What happens if you get caught counting?

#1
What happens when someone gets caught counting? are you barred from the casino? are you barred from all casinos? is there any chance of getting in trouble with the law?
 

callipygian

Well-Known Member
#3
bjrookie said:
are you barred from the casino? are you barred from all casinos? is there any chance of getting in trouble with the law?
Maybe, maybe, no. Card counting is not against any law.

Your punishment for getting caught highly varies depending on how high of stakes you're playing, where you get caught, and the mood of the pit boss at the time. From mildest to worst ...

(1) Polite countermeasures: penetration will be cut or the speed at which they deal will be sped up or slowed down (depending on what they think annoys you). Generally if you walk away at this point you're free to return on another shift or on another day with zero repercussions.

(2) Annoying countermeasures: pit boss will try to distract you or make remakrs about your play, or otherwise try to hassle you into leaving. At this point your face will be recognized, so it's best to stay away until your face fades from memory.

(3) Backed off: you will be asked not to play blackjack any more (but usually any other game is fine) or for a certain time. You can try returning at a different shift or day, but you'll face worse and worse punishments from this point forward and surveillance likely snapped a photo of you for future reference.

(4) Barred: you will be asked to leave the casino and not to return to the premises. Typically you get read the "trespass act" which is a legal warning not to return. You will get arrested if you return. You're essentially done at that casino and will be on a shorter leash at sister properties.

(5) Backroomed: you will be forcibly taken to the back room and detained until police arrive. The casino legally needs reasonable suspicion that a crime has been committed, but if you're playing high enough stakes or otherwise seriously threatening the casino's bottom line, they might make stuff up to backroom you. At this point, you've got more than "can I play blackjack" to worry about - you might spend a night in jail, guilty or not of what they accuse you of having done. Nevada police will believe the casino 99% of the time.
 
#5
hm...i've been reading around. I hear that a common practice nowadays is to "flat-bet" the suspected counter.

Where do you think this ranks on the list? does this mean that one won't be able to vary their bets at other casinos as well? Has this ever happened to anyone? i'm planning on making a trip soon and i don't want to have to worry about these as distractions.

thanks for the replies.
 

Pro21

Well-Known Member
#6
That happens in Atlantic City where they aren't allowed to bar you for counting cards. If you bet enough money then they can send your photo around to other places and they may also flat bet you. If you are starting out and betting red and green chips I wouldn't worry about it.
 

itakeyourmoney

Well-Known Member
#7
bjrookie said:
hm...i've been reading around. I hear that a common practice nowadays is to "flat-bet" the suspected counter.

Where do you think this ranks on the list? does this mean that one won't be able to vary their bets at other casinos as well? Has this ever happened to anyone? i'm planning on making a trip soon and i don't want to have to worry about these as distractions.

thanks for the replies.
This happens a lot in AC since they legally can't stop a player (counter or not) from playing blackjack. So by making him flat bet it takes away his advantage. Just because one casino makes you flat bet doesn't stop you from spreading at other casinos (or even that same casino at a different time). This is not a very serious charge, annoying sure as you'll lose your advantage, but you'll live to count another day haha.
 

21forme

Well-Known Member
#8
In AC, you're not exactly flat betted. but your maximum bet is restricted. By law, they must give you a 10:1 spread and typically they'll restrict only you to $5-$50.

The other thing they do in AC is throw you in the ocean. We have a former board member who witnessed such an event and has never been heard from again. :laugh:
 
#9
there was once a member that told me this happened to him at a vegas casino. i'm not gonna say his sn because he probably wouldn't appreciate that. He told me that he would not go to any of the sister casinos for at least a few years.

I haven't heard from him in a few months but it makes me wonder, how would you know if your picture has been sent to another casino?
 

Pro21

Well-Known Member
#10
bjrookie said:
... how would you know if your picture has been sent to another casino?
You walk into a casino and they bar you before you start playing, or soon after you sit down before you start spreading. Sometimes they will call you by name if you used a players card at the place that sent your picture around. That is why it is important not to use players cards if you are more than a recreational player.
 
#11
Pro21 said:
That is why it is important not to use players cards if you are more than a recreational player.
Don't they force you to use a players card if you play anything more than qurters? that has been my experience.
 

Pro21

Well-Known Member
#12
You are NEVER forced to use a players card. "Just say no."

There may be exceptions in foreign casinos, or Missouri used to have rules that you needed a players card because of buy in laws but I believe that law has changed.
 

Pro21

Well-Known Member
#13
I should add that you shouldn't get too worried about this. Everyone gets barred and backed off, and it really doesn't mean much. Every pro I know has made far more money after being in Griffin than they did before. This isn't to say that getting Griffinized helps, it just usually happens early in a career. It is nothing more than a minor annoyance, but part of the business.
 
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