What is the counting system with the best PE for 6D?

#1
I'm sorry for my english speaking abilities.
I would be pleased if you help me with my doubts.

1. Is PE the efficiency to vary the basic strategy?
2. What is the counting system with the best PE for a game 6 decks, S17, DAS, No Surrender, No Peek?
3. Could I have the deviations of the basic strategy?

Thank you and excuse me if I'm a nuisance.
 

BrianCP

Well-Known Member
#3
If you are going to be playing 6 deck blackjack, PE is not nearly as important as BC (playing efficiency and betting correlation).

The reason for this is that in 6 deck, the swings in player advantage occur much less and are more gradual. This does two things: you won't encounter nearly as many extreme counts and swings in player advantage are more gradual.

Due to the lack of extreme counts, many play variations will almost never be used. This negates the benefit having having more accurate play variations.

Due to the gradual changes in player advantage, you need to be able to recognize your small advantages more accurately, as they occur less frequently and are less obvious.

This means being able to bet more accurately in a 6 deck game is much more important than varying strategy. According to Professional Blackjack by Stanford Wong, "Varying basic strategy with the count per deck improves on basic strategy only by a small amount...Most of that improvement is due to taking insurance, standing on a hard 16 against 10, and standing on hard 15 against 10."

If you go for the counting system with the highest playing efficiency, you will sacrifice a lot of potential profit playing 6 deck games. Both Hi-Opt II and Uston APC have BC's of .91. One is a level two system, the other one is a level three system. To bet accurately on a 6 deck game using these, you must side count aces. This makes for a very hard counting system indeed.

On the other hand, you can settle for a much easier counting system with a much higher BC while sacrificing the rather unimportant PE. Let's take a look at the standard, Hi-Lo. Hi-Lo is an easy level one count, but it has a .97 BC, .06 more than either of the two high PE systems. This means it is a much better choice for shoe games (4, 6, 8, or more decks....though I've never heard of more than 8 decks).

If you want to continue with a system that uses a high PE, you should find some single and double deck games. If those aren't a great option, stick to systems with a higher BC.

For reference, here is a list of counting systems that includes both the PE and
BC values: http://www.qfit.com/card-counting.htm
 
#5
Thank for your answers.

FLASH1296, could you link me to a table with the variations of the basic strategy by counting with Hi-Opt II?

BrianCP, I knew already what you have said, but thank you anyway. Do you know tables of variations of the basic strategy for counting systems with a high PE?

QFIT, could you link me to a table with the variations of the basic strategy by counting with Uston APC?

Thank you very much again.
 
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QFIT

Well-Known Member
#6
Sorry, but that would be a copyright violation. You can find the tables in the appropriate books. You can also download the demo of CV, which has the tables for most systems with permission of the various authors.
 
#7
HIOPT II is rarely used without side counting aces. The BC is .98 when you do this. Combine with the top PE it has and you have a winner.
 
#8
QFIT, I have downloaded your demo CV. Are there tables for European style?

tthree, where could I find tables for HiOpt II (SC)?

Thank you both.
 
#11
Bondy3 said:
I understand PE and BC, but whats IC?
Insurance correlation. It is a measure of how accurate your count is with the insurance decision. It is a very important index as insurance is the most profitable strategy deviation when properly used.
 

BrianCP

Well-Known Member
#13
Of course the count with the highest IC is the ten count. +1 for all cards, except 10s which are -2. It's unbalanced, and literally a perfect indicator for when to take insurance.
 

AussiePlayer

Well-Known Member
#14
BrianCP said:
Of course the count with the highest IC is the ten count. +1 for all cards, except 10s which are -2. It's unbalanced, and literally a perfect indicator for when to take insurance.
There is also a balanced version, -9 for 10's, +4 for all others.
 

BJgenius007

Well-Known Member
#15
QFIT said:
Sorry, but that would be a copyright violation. You can find the tables in the appropriate books. You can also download the demo of CV, which has the tables for most systems with permission of the various authors.
Come on. How do you know such tables are copied from the books or generated from program somebody just wrote? Mathematics are all the same. Different programs should generate the same results. It is like to say someone goes to the patent office and get the copyright of "1 plus 1 equals 2" and anybody calculates one plus one should pay the person who has the copyright.
 

BrianCP

Well-Known Member
#16
BJgenius007 said:
Come on. How do you know such tables are copied from the books or generated from program somebody just wrote? Mathematics are all the same. Different programs should generate the same results. It is like to say someone goes to the patent office and get the copyright of "1 plus 1 equals 2" and anybody calculates one plus one should pay the person who has the copyright.
Different programs actually tend to produce slightly different indices when running simulations. This is because all indices are approximations. This is what allowed Snyder to simplify the Ill. 18 for his Hi-Lo lite system down to two index numbers
 
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