Trump Marina shuffles because $3700 bettor got an Ace as first card

Sucker

Well-Known Member
#3
This is only ONE side of the story. Something about this reporter's story sounds a bit fishy. Why would he even write this story without even TRYING to verify it? Why would he ask an attorney who USED to work for Trump? Most reporters will at least ATTEMPT to go straight to the horse's mouth.
 

johndoe

Well-Known Member
#4
Sucker said:
This is only ONE side of the story. Something about this reporter's story sounds a bit fishy. Why would he even write this story without even TRYING to verify it? Why would he ask an attorney who USED to work for Trump? Most reporters will at least ATTEMPT to go straight to the horse's mouth.
I have to imagine you guys know exactly who Mankodi is, and why he was targeted so aggressively.

My guess is the ace was flashed or he otherwise knew with certainty it was coming. He put out a huge bet and pissed off the store.

Still a blatantly illegal move by the casino, of course. That, plus false imprisonment, makes his odds in prevailing in the lawsuit very good.
 

Sucker

Well-Known Member
#5
johndoe said:
My guess is the ace was flashed or he otherwise knew with certainty it was coming.
Of course. And I'm NOT saying that the story definitely WAS wrong. And I'm CERTAINLY not going to blindly take the casino's side (haven't even HEARD that yet). But until I hear both sides of a story, I can't make up my mind one way or another.

Even my best friends will sometimes embellish a story, or leave something out. Perhaps the ace didn't actually HIT the felt; maybe it was just the card that WOULD have come out? I can think of several OTHER things that could have occurred in which the casino MIGHT have a defense. There ARE a few (very few) circumstances in which the casino IS in the right to call a misdeal.

I've had this EXACT same thing happen to ME before. And I've also had it happen the OTHER way; a BAD card would come out & the circumstances would be such that I've successfully argued for a misdeal (I've discussed THIS move in a previous post). I've even had a hand ruled dead after BOTH of my cards were out.

I also have a friend who has even had THIS happen to him, and more than ONCE:
AFTER a winning roll on the dice table, the pit would rule "NO ROLL!", and NO one would get paid! ONLY because they realized WHO it was that was rolling. :whip:

That said; I'm in perfect agreement - his odds of prevailing in a lawsuit are probably pretty good, at least on the false imprisonment aspect. Doubtful that it's going to even end up in court.
 
#6
Sucker said:
Of course. And I'm NOT saying that the story definitely WAS wrong. And I'm CERTAINLY not going to blindly take the casino's side (haven't even HEARD that yet). But until I hear both sides of a story, I can't make up my mind one way or another.

Even my best friends will sometimes embellish a story, or leave something out. Perhaps the ace didn't actually HIT the felt; maybe it was just the card that WOULD have come out? I can think of several OTHER things that could have occurred in which the casino MIGHT have a defense. There ARE a few (very few) circumstances in which the casino IS in the right to call a misdeal.

I've had this EXACT same thing happen to ME before. And I've also had it happen the OTHER way; a BAD card would come out & the circumstances would be such that I've successfully argued for a misdeal (I've discussed THIS move in a previous post). I've even had a hand ruled dead after BOTH of my cards were out.

I also have a friend who has even had THIS happen to him, and more than ONCE:
AFTER a winning roll on the dice table, the pit would rule "NO ROLL!", and NO one would get paid! ONLY because they realized WHO it was that was rolling. :whip:

That said; I'm in perfect agreement - his odds of prevailing in a lawsuit are probably pretty good, at least on the false imprisonment aspect. Doubtful that it's going to even end up in court.
Why did the pit actually rule a No Roll on your friend. Craps players are a big cash cow for the casinos. If they feel the casino is cheating them they will go somewhere else. this would be very bad for that casino.
 

shadroch

Well-Known Member
#7
As Trump Marina no longer exists, it would be rather difficault to speak to anyone from management. Even if a person was employed in the exact same position with the new Golden Nugget, there would be no point in discussing this with a reporter.
 
#8
johndoe said:
I have to imagine you guys know exactly who Mankodi is, and why he was targeted so aggressively.

My guess is the ace was flashed or he otherwise knew with certainty it was coming. He put out a huge bet and pissed off the store.

Still a blatantly illegal move by the casino, of course. That, plus false imprisonment, makes his odds in prevailing in the lawsuit very good.
I had a similar problem in LV when an ace was flashed and I maxed out my bet, and the dealer and PC told me if I raised my bet, they were going to burn the card.

The TM shuffle was not especially vulnerable, could have been just the usual kinds of ace sequencing where you get the ace 1/8 to 1/10 times, or just straight counting, and the pit boss wanted to get the most bang for his buck with his illegal backoff.
 
#10
johndoe said:
I have to imagine you guys know exactly who Mankodi is, and why he was targeted so aggressively.
Mankodi is ExCAA's partner in THE BOOK publishing and release "strategy". Presumably he is not a salamander, rather a true chimpanzee.
(see Exhibit CAA publishing post)

Pit boss was quoted as saying, "Obvious he was cheating." > Well IF his Ace was off the top then possibly he cut to it in an illegal manner... AC casinos are established that certain techniques that cause the Ace to be cut to the top are cheating moves (I think)... otherwise he legitimately used key-card sequencing, which is allowed. zg
 
#11
zengrifter said:
Mankodi is ExCAA's partner in THE BOOK publishing and release "strategy". Presumably he is not a salamander, rather a true chimpanzee.
(see Exhibit CAA publishing post)

Pit boss was quoted as saying, "Obvious he was cheating." > Well IF his Ace was off the top then possibly he cut to it in an illegal manner... AC casinos are established that certain techniques that cause the Ace to be cut to the top are cheating moves (I think)... otherwise he legitimately used key-card sequencing, which is allowed. zg
AC does not like fishing around with the cut card. They can ban you for it but it is still not established law that it is cheating. (That's why I do it.)

I'd rather be a salamander. Let's see a mammal regenerate a missing limb. And salamanders can bury themselves in the mud, hibernate, and survive through a large range of conditions. When the last mammal is extinct from this planet, the earth will still be teeming with cold-blooded vertebrates and invertebrates.
 
#12
Automatic Monkey said:
AC does not like fishing around with the cut card. They can ban you for it but it is still not established law that it is cheating. (That's why I do it.)

I'd rather be a salamander. Let's see a mammal regenerate a missing limb. And salamanders can bury themselves in the mud, hibernate, and survive through a large range of conditions. When the last mammal is extinct from this planet, the earth will still be teeming with cold-blooded vertebrates and invertebrates.
... and cockroaches.
The reason I thought it was established as cheating is because several APs, including Sam Case, were threatened with prosecution... AND David Morse was placed into the AC "black-book" for it. zg
 
#13
zengrifter said:
... and cockroaches.
The reason I thought it was established as cheating is because several APs, including Sam Case, were threatened with prosecution... AND David Morse was placed into the AC "black-book" for it. zg
Yes, threatened with it. Actually getting a court to say "This is cheating" and survive the appeal is something different. It is in the casinos' best interest to reserve it as a threat, because nobody is going to want to be the test case, than to get the test case over with and perhaps lose.
 
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