Arizona casino info?

#1
(Crossposted from BJT.com)

Phoenix specifically.

As seen in this thread, I'm on the verge of leaving momma bird's nest and establishing myself as an actual independant adult.

In this adult life, I want to supplement my income with some advantage blackjack play. Nothing with huge time committments, just something to do every now and then on weekends to, like I said, supplement my monies*. Tournaments too of course.

With that said, Phoenix, Arizona is a location I am likely to end up one of these days. One of my best and longest-running friends lives there and it would be nice to be able to see and talk to him more often. Maybe even corrupting him into becoming an AP too. ;)

But I come to you all for help in preemptively pointing out good/bad casinos in Arizona. The closer to Phoenix the better, but I'm willing to do about two hours worth of traveling (like I'm already prepared to here in NM). Don't be afraid to be detailed and long-winded, I'm not. :p

*Don't worry about how I handle my money. I won't jump right into anything I can't financially handle. I'll be staying in the "kiddie" pool until my confidence and bankroll are at acceptable levels.
 

hawkeye

Well-Known Member
#2
I live in the Phoenix area. The casinos I know off-hand are Gila River Wild Horse Pass, Gila River Lone Butte, Harrah's Ak-Chin (in Maricopa), and two Casino Arizona locations both on the 101 in Scottsdale, one at McKellips and the 101 and the other at Indian Bend and the 101. I think there are a couple more casinos around the Phoenix area though, I think there's one more Lone Butte at least. All the ones I mentioned are on the east half of town, so there might be more on the west.

Gila River Wild Horse Pass:
Many BJ tables, even on Sun afternoon they had $5 tables. 6-deck shoe, decent pen last time I was there, 1 to 1.5 decks. DOA, DAS, S17. Also, they're ASM.

Same rules at Gila River Lone Butte but it seems much harder to find a $5 table there, mostly $10. Also Lone Butte is very small and mostly for slots.

Casino Arizona on McKellips has a weird mix of BJ tables. Some CSM, a lot of ASM, and last time there were a couple hand shuffled. Sometimes you can find $5 tables, mostly on weekdays or early on weekends, but they are usually CSM. 6-deck ASM is usually $10. Same rules as Gila River, I think they've all mostly agreed to use the same rules.

Harrah's Ak-Chin is about 30 miles south of Phoenix in a town called Maricopa. It's decent sized, I remember a lot of $10 tables, hand shuffled at least on a few, but this was over a year ago. It's too far away when there are better games in town.

There are a lot of good places to play BJ around Phoenix. Heat is non-existent, but they are Indian Casinos so play nice.
 
#3
DOA, DAS, S17. Also, they're ASM.
Sadly I must reveal my noobishness, I need a clarification of these abbreviations.

DOA: ???
DAS: Double after split.
S17: Dealer hits on soft 17.
ASM: ???
CSM: ???

There are a lot of good places to play BJ around Phoenix. Heat is non-existent, but they are Indian Casinos so play nice.
Sounds like a may try and move there sooner rather than later. :grin:

What about tournaments?
 

Brutus

Well-Known Member
#4
casino arizona has a tournament on wednesdays.

i was there yesterday. - 20 units

there was this abnoxious biatch sitting next to me making comments about my play. I told her I thought i might have fleas, trying to get her away. finally i asked her if she liked sex, she looked at me funny, not sure how to answer. she nodded yes, then i told her to go f herself. that did it.

avoid wearing that hood, there's enough freaks, kooks and nutjobs running around that place.
 

TheApprentice

Well-Known Member
#5
nice one

Brutus said:
casino arizona has a tournament on wednesdays.

i was there yesterday. - 20 units

there was this abnoxious biatch sitting next to me making comments about my play. I told her I thought i might have fleas, trying to get her away. finally i asked her if she liked sex, she looked at me funny, not sure how to answer. she nodded yes, then i told her to go f herself. that did it.

avoid wearing that hood, there's enough freaks, kooks and nutjobs running around that place.
You are my "table-clearing" hero.

Tell more about the tournament, if you have details, please.
 
#8
Covered_in_Bees! said:
In this adult life, I want to supplement my income with some advantage blackjack play. Nothing with huge time committments, just something to do every now and then on weekends to, like I said, supplement my monies*.
Check the 7/11 stores in your area. Night shift pays an extra $1 or $2 per hour. Also check for Pizza delivery job. Don't know the situation on crop pickers out that way but check that out also. Hope that helps you out with getting a real job.
 
#9
InPlay: Forgive me if I gave you the wrong impression, but I do have a job/career ahead of me. No kind of "mcjob". I tend to be private so I don't divulge many details about myself, but apparently I keep giving people the wrong idea about what I'm up to. :p

Brutus said:
avoid wearing that hood, there's enough freaks, kooks and nutjobs running around that place.
To expound on what I said earlier about this: If I ever move to Arizona, I think anything that even resembles Winter clothing is going to get left behind. :laugh:

On Phoenix specifics: Could anyone in the Phoenix area tell me about the good and bad parts of the city? Somewhere/anywhere that would have some decent apartments, but not so shady that might get a blackjack player robbed. Ya know?

Thanks for all the help.
 

hawkeye

Well-Known Member
#10
DOA - Double on Anything
ASM - Automatic Shuffling Machines
CSM - Continuous Shuffling Machines

ASM's hold two shoes worth of cards and automatically shuffles them. The dealer pulls one shoe out of the ASM and puts in the dealing shoe and deals. When they are done, they put that shoe back in the ASM, and take the other one out and play with it. Then when they're done, repeat over and over. The game never slows down to shuffle.

CSM's are machines that continuously shuffle the cards and spit out small groups of them in a slot in the front. You can't count a CSM at all, and basically you shouldn't play at them at all.


Phoenix is very spread out. Central Phoenix, south of downtown is not good. Just East of downtown, near the airport, is not good either. Most of the East Valley is good, Chandler, Mesa, Tempe, Gilbert, Scottsdale are all nice and don't have bad parts. There's a tiny little city/reservation by Chandler/Ahwatukee called Guadalupe that's not very nice, but you prob wouldn't end up there anyways. I don't know the West side as well, but I do know that it's very hit and miss in some parts, with some nice neighborhoods being next to crappy ones. I don't know it all that well though. Tempe is where ASU is, so there might be cheap places to live but it's also the hometown of the biggest college in the country so it might be too crowded to find cheap places, I'm not sure. Good luck finding a place, there are a lot here right now. If you're looking at renting a house you can find deals as the housing market is down right now and a lot of people that can't sell are renting to get something out of their place.
 
#11
Most of the East Valley is good, Chandler, Mesa, Tempe, Gilbert, Scottsdale are all nice and don't have bad parts.
This is because they're all suburbs right? Or are these areas included in the city of Phoenix when referred to as a whole?

CSM's are machines that continuously shuffle
O_O

ASM's hold two shoes worth of cards and automatically shuffles them. The dealer pulls one shoe out of the ASM and puts in the dealing shoe and deals. When they are done, they put that shoe back in the ASM, and take the other one out and play with it. Then when they're done, repeat over and over. The game never slows down to shuffle.
These are countable right? Since a whole shoe's worth of cards gets shuffled once and just at the beginning, correct?

DOA - Double on Anything
So obvious in hindsight! >_<

Anything else you guys think I should know about the Phoenix area?
 

Brutus

Well-Known Member
#12
Covered_in_Bees! said:
Anything else you guys think I should know about the Phoenix area?
only thing missing here is an ocean. there are more beautiful women here than anywhere. if you dont believe me, have dinner in the kierland shopping center on a friday or saturday night. have a drink and hang out.
scope out the place a day or so ahead (pick out a restaurant like ra sushi) so you'll know how to dress, and how much cash to bring.

I like the northeast phoenix and scottsdale areas.

stay away from the tweaker /street drug crowd.
they say..."come on vacation, leave on probation" and they mean it.
a ton of people come here to make a new life, but only bring their old problems with them. work hard and stay focused.
 

hawkeye

Well-Known Member
#13
Yes, the East Valley is suburbs. Phoenix is all suburbs though.

I've lived all over this country, and Phoenix is unique because there isn't much of a downtown. Go downtown Phoenix on a Saturday night, it's a ghost town. I've done it, there's not much there. So living "downtown" doesn't mean a lot because there's not a lot there. It's getting better, but it's still not a downtown like you think of traditionally. So people may refer to the city of Phoenix, but honestly there's not a lot there. I work in Phoenix, but live in the East Valley. I rarely come to the city of Phoenix to do anything other than go to the airport or a Diamondbacks game. Find a suburb that has the things you like and live there.

Most of the night life is in Scottsdale or Tempe. Tempe for the college crowd, and Scottsdale for everyone with enough money to not have to hang around college kids.

Brutus is right, the women are pretty and the drinks are expensive.
 

hawkeye

Well-Known Member
#14
And yes, ASM's are countable. It's all I really find around here, and I count them. I rarely see hand-shuffled decks around here.
 

TheApprentice

Well-Known Member
#15
livin in the PHX

Here's a neat little trick to figuring out the neigborhood in an unfamiliar city:

Go to the grocery stores in an area and check them out. In Phoenix, if all you find are tiny independents and Food City's, then it may not be the best area. If you find an AJ's Fine Foods or a Sprouts Farmer's Market, you'll probably be just fine. The middle ground is full of all the regular chains (we've got Safeway, Frys, etc) but these big chains will be either fresh and new and clean looking or they'll be dumps. Find the best area you can afford with this simple trick!
I guess how you'll judge Phx depends on from where you are coming.
 

hawkeye

Well-Known Member
#16
That's some really solid advice, never thought of that.

The neighborhood where I work is full of Food City's, aka not so great. But if you want the best salsa or the queso fresco don't bother with Safeway, head for Food City.
 
#17
Brutus said:
only thing missing here is an ocean.
I'm sure we can convince someone that there's an ocean in Arizona. ;)

there are more beautiful women here than anywhere. if you dont believe me, have dinner in the kierland shopping center on a friday or saturday night. have a drink and hang out.
Now this I definately want to investigate first hand. :cool2:

stay away from the tweaker /street drug crowd.
Not a problem.

hawkeye said:
I've lived all over this country, and Phoenix is unique because there isn't much of a downtown. Go downtown Phoenix on a Saturday night, it's a ghost town. I've done it, there's not much there. So living "downtown" doesn't mean a lot because there's not a lot there. It's getting better, but it's still not a downtown like you think of traditionally. So people may refer to the city of Phoenix, but honestly there's not a lot there. I work in Phoenix, but live in the East Valley. I rarely come to the city of Phoenix to do anything other than go to the airport or a Diamondbacks game. Find a suburb that has the things you like and live there.
That's craziness. I never knew anything like this about Phoenix.

Most of the night life is in Scottsdale or Tempe. Tempe for the college crowd, and Scottsdale for everyone with enough money to not have to hang around college kids.
Sounds like Tempe it is. :grin:

TheApprentice said:
Here's a neat little trick to figuring out the neigborhood in an unfamiliar city:

Go to the grocery stores in an area and check them out. In Phoenix, if all you find are tiny independents and Food City's, then it may not be the best area. If you find an AJ's Fine Foods or a Sprouts Farmer's Market, you'll probably be just fine. The middle ground is full of all the regular chains (we've got Safeway, Frys, etc) but these big chains will be either fresh and new and clean looking or they'll be dumps. Find the best area you can afford with this simple trick!
That's a nice trick. I'll definately remember it.

Anyone else wanna chime in on Phoenix as a city or the quality of blackjack games/tournaments in the city? We have quite a nice little discussion going here.

EDIT: How can someone tell the difference between a CSM and an ASM?

EDIT 2: Does anyone have any specific info on tournaments in the Phoenix area? The peeps over at BJT.com haven't replied to my thread at all, last I checked. So I thought I'd ask here. Specifically, which casinos have more frequent tournies? What about the most consistent cheap tournies? Finally, which tournies tend to have "less skilled" players? Plus anything you can think of that might be useful to me that I left out.

Thanks a bunch!
 
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hawkeye

Well-Known Member
#18
An ASM game will still be dealt out of a traditional looking BJ shoe. When they get to the end of the shoe they stack up the cards and then push a button the little ASM machine that's hooked to the back of the table right by first base. A slot slides up from the ASM, they put those cards in it, and then the slot slides down into the machine to shuffle those cards. Then they push the other button and another slot slides up with the other 6 decks. they pull those decks out, give someone the cut card, and then put them in the shoe. They repeat that process back and forth with the two decks. The ASM is flush with the top of the table, it doesn't stick out very much. If you sit at first base it's right there to your right hooked onto the back of the table.


A CSM is a large black machine that sits at that same spot on the table, but it's pretty wide and sits a good 10 inches above the table. The dealer pulls cards straight out of it when dealing. You can easily spot them, there is no shoe at a CSM table, just the big CSM machine. All the ones I've seen are black, and the slot where the cards come out is down at the bottom of the machine close to the table. You won't have a problem distinguishing between the two.

Casino Arizona on McKellips has BJ Tourneys on Wednesday's I believe, I've never entered one. Other than that, I'm not sure.

Can I ask, just out of curiousity, why you are looking for tournaments specifically? Are you also looking for good BJ games besides tourneys? Just wondering, I've only played in a tourney once, it was on a cruise ship and people were betting crazy. They would bet the table limit every hand so anybody who was lucky enough to get 4 winning hands in a row would win the table.
 
#19
Can I ask, just out of curiousity, why you are looking for tournaments specifically? Are you also looking for good BJ games besides tourneys?
The answer is likely to get long-winded and filled with rambling. So get comfortable.

I would prefer tournaments because I don't particularly have an interest in doing diehard counting. I don't believe I have the mental acuity for the amount of numbers and memorization and the blocking out of distractions would require.

I will admit to not knowing about all of the different methods of counting, so if there is a decently easy one, I'll look into it. If counting were easy, everyone would do it of course, so I'm not expecting to be able to just walk into a casino one day and take them for all they've got.

Now, as for tournaments, I'd prefer them because they have a clear cut ending and the monetary risk is only as high as the entry fee. If I am mentally prepared to enter a tournament, then I'm already prepared to lose that money. You (well, I won't) won't enter a tournament with the absolute expectation to win. You'll enter it and likely not win, thus you're already mentally prepared to be down by the entry fee.

If something goes wrong with a cash game, I could be out by a far larger portion than expected. Yes if I handle my bankroll intelligently I'll never be completely ruined by a bad run of cards, but it can still be upsetting.

Make sense?

I've only played in a tourney once, it was on a cruise ship and people were betting crazy. They would bet the table limit every hand so anybody who was lucky enough to get 4 winning hands in a row would win the table.
Yeah people are crazy, can't help that really. If that person wins that table, you can at least shoot for second in chips, provided the top two move on. Then we'll see how much longer that crazy bettor lasts in the next table. Then the next after that and so on. Or am I misaken?

Right now I'm just in my "evaluation period" of interest in advanced blackjack. I'm interested in learning most anything I can and when I do eventually get into AP play, we'll see what techniques and types of games (tournaments vs. cash) I get into. Nothing is set in stone at all with me and my blackjack play. It's free for everyone to mold, so if anyone feels like taking up a student, PM me. :grin:
 

TheApprentice

Well-Known Member
#20
Tourney play

Bees,
how about a run down of the main points of difference with tournament play?
Maybe a reader's digest condensed version of the basic How It Works and then any examples you may be able to give about how you're playing/betting technique would vary compared to regular cash table games?
I know people write books on this stuff, but just a quick overview based on your experiences.
 
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