Could be interesting?

#2
Really aint that right. I had never heard on thing in the bio about being a christian team. Then they come out with this. Sounds like disinformation to me. Maybe a way to wiggle back into some places.
 
#4
I know this site well. I think the leader of the team is called Ben, they are well known to casinos now though which is why I think they didn't mind doing a documentary, they offer a boot camp where you can go away for a day or a weekend (not sure how long) and learn card counting, they have many videos for free on card counting and some that you have to be a member to access. It all seems genuine to me although I haven't purchased anything from the site. Ben has wrote a sort of autobiography that is free and I found it pretty good, there are also some pod casts and a blog on the site as well as a forum which is the first card counting forum I joined.

I would strongly recommend watching their free videos as I found them very helpful, as for things concerning money I cant provide any proof that they are genuine because I haven't bought anything, all I can say is that if they are scamming people then they are incredibly good at hiding it in my opinion. This is my opinion though based on what I learnt when I did some units on internet scams at college, also definitely do some research before purchasing anything.

ringlejames is also right though, there was definitely nothing about being a Christian in Ben's bio
 
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BrianCP

Well-Known Member
#5
Here is my interpretation. They know what they are doing. However, this doesn't mean it is worth the money.

Most people don't anticipate the amount of work it takes just to get your card counting system down completely. By completely, I mean the method, the game, the bankroll, the bet spread, the cover, the back counting, everything about being a card counter.

I've been able to piece a lot of it together from various books (Blackbelt in Blackjack, Professional Blackjack, Blackjack Attack) and internet sources (such as this wonderful community).

Most people aren't nearly as dedicated to researching something and understanding it as I am. They just want someone to tell them everything.

This is where this group of people comes in. They know all about people wanting a teacher who shows them everything instead of having to figure out a lot themselves (despite all the reference material available to them). How much is this worth to an aspiring counter? A lot of money.

Now, the person(s) running the show know all about the very small actual edge you have from straight counting (%1 on a game you can visit regularly, %2+ on a game that won't be around for very long). Combine this with the variance, long hours, and all other negative involved with counting, why not make money from it a different way?

Guaranteed money from aspiring players you know you can overcharge by a huge amount is a lot better than a %1 edge that takes 10,000 hours of play to reach an expected result.
 
#7
Personally I don't even think its necessary to pay to learn how to become a card counter apart from maybe a few good books, I think its more about the dedication, passion, seriousness and how much time you are willing to put into it, I practice at-least 6 days a week for about 2-3 hours per day and has been one of the reasons for missing a few deadlines at college :eek:.
 
#8
What part of this video does anyone think is legit? I don't think there was one part that seemed realistic. If this movie actually comes out I would think an awesome drinking game could be made up of the times your here the words: Christain, God, Faith.
 

EmeraldCityBJ

Well-Known Member
#9
I know the guys behind this film, and can assure you that what they are presenting is legit. Some of the scenes were staged (with cooperation from various casinos and casino employees), but they are consistent representations of events which have actually taken place.

I saw a screening of the film a few months back, and it's without a doubt the most accurate portrayal of what it takes to be a successful card counter and what it takes to run a successful team. Unlike many blackjack movies (like "21") which are marketed to the masses and fictionalized to a ridiculous extent, this film is a documentary, and the folks behind the film went out of their way to present the events as they actually happened. I enjoyed the film because many of the things these players and this team experienced are some of the same things I've personally experienced and could relate to.

If you have an opportunity to see this film, I'd highly recommend it - especially if you have ever considered playing on a team.
 

Coach R

Well-Known Member
#11
EmeraldCityBJ said:
I know the guys behind this film, and can assure you that what they are presenting is legit. Some of the scenes were staged (with cooperation from various casinos and casino employees), but they are consistent representations of events which have actually taken place.


So various casinos and casino workers cooperated with these guys to make a card counting movie?
 
#15
I'll chime in again

Hey guys. This is Colin from BlackjackApprenticeship.com.

The footage wasn't staged:

This was actually pretty witty on Bryan's part...

He had set up with several casinos a day of following casino managers. He simply told them he was making a documentary about gambling. So he followed them around all day, interviewing them, etc.

He had also told people on our blackjack team he wanted them to play certain casinos at certain times for the doc. So Dusty showed up and played the place at that time, and Bryan got to be in the surveillance room while they evaluated Dusty's play, etc.

The casino had no idea Bryan knew Dusty. I don't even know if Dusty knew what was going on, other than Bryan wanted to film him at that casino at that time.

Other footage was "hidden" cameras. I wore one, and while getting backed off, I asked the casino manager why he was kicking me out, why he thought it was fair to only let losing players play etc.

All the casino personel that Bryan followed around had signed release forms, so it's legit to have it in the doc.
 
#16
re: why we sell stuff on the website

When we started card counting, we learned a million mistakes along the way, and probably cost ourselves millions of dollars worth of EV in the process. Fortunately, we had bj21 as well as each other to correct ourselves along the way. I wish I could have paid $1K of my bankroll to a seasoned pro when I was first getting started. It would have made me a lot more money in the long run.

We have people who come to our bootcamps and still believe the simplest gambler's fallacies. Some of them are losing 4, 5, or 6 figures each year at casinos. Since we have a proven track record (having been a part of and run teams that won in the mid 7 figures), we know we can teach them what it takes to truly be an advantage player. I know they can read books or whatever, but that doesn't mean they'll get it.

We've only had 1 person tell us our bootcamp wasn't valuable and there was nothing we had to teach him(he could count cards well enough to get kicked out of casinos, but still made basic strategy mistakes)... a year later he emailed us about how much money he was losing following his own advice, rather than ours. That's why we offer money back guarantees on everything. If it's not valuable, people shouldn't pay for it.

For what it's worth, if someone from Blackjackinfo wants to attend a bootcamp for free I'd gladly give away a spot. If it's a waste of time and money, then you can let us and everyone else know. If it's valuable, great.

Anyway, we really aren't trying to scam people into paying money for stuff. We want to give people great content, and charge what's fair for it (just like we did with bj21, dozens of books, dvds, etc for years and years). But we also give a lot of it away for free so that people who aren't willing to pay can still learn from our experience.

Cheers.
 

Friendo

Well-Known Member
#17
BrianCP said:
Most people aren't nearly as dedicated to researching something and understanding it as I am. They just want someone to tell them everything.

This is where this group of people comes in. They know all about people wanting a teacher who shows them everything instead of having to figure out a lot themselves (despite all the reference material available to them).
Well put.

One look at all the newbie threads here bolsters this conclusion.

To anyone learning this stuff: You will need to put in a few dozen hours of reading & pondering, plus several dozen more hours of practice, before you're fit to handle money in a casino. Asking for short, simple explanations won't hurt, but it won't get you there - you must also marinate your neurons in the information. Reading a couple of books is the way to do that.
 
#18
So now what we have here are "Christains" who are now saying that they are using witty ways to deceive people. And now suddenly people are showing up all from Washington to defend this "documentary". This is just a group of Johnnycomelatelies who are trying to feed there own egos and agenda. If this "documentary" was legit you wouldn't have to weave in in with the whole Christain angle. If you guys were legitiment Christains you wouldn't be deceiving people left and right.
 
#19
I'm sorry, but I don't follow how anyone is deceiving people or trying to feed our own egos or agendas?

I guess people who watch it and know our story and decide if it's legit or not. But the director hoped the documentary would tell the true story of the life of professional card counters, as well as challenge some of the assumptions of what it means to be a Christian. We definitely hope to profit off of blackjackapprenticeship in the same way we hoped to profit from card counting. I suppose that's part of the agenda, but it's a little surprising if people see that as ignoble goals... I've never met a card counter who didn't hope to profit from it.


Booper702 said:
So now what we have here are "Christains" who are now saying that they are using witty ways to deceive people. And now suddenly people are showing up all from Washington to defend this "documentary". This is just a group of Johnnycomelatelies who are trying to feed there own egos and agenda. If this "documentary" was legit you wouldn't have to weave in in with the whole Christain angle. If you guys were legitiment Christains you wouldn't be deceiving people left and right.
 
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