Someone explain please Why cardcounting?

[ccibball50]

Originally Posted by kewljason

Personally, I feel this statement is only partially true. If you are referring to full time counters making 100K/year, then yes, I concur 100 percent. However, I know quite a few counters such as myself that do play full time and are making 25k to 40K a year. If you need to make 100k/year, this probably means you have a family to support, a mortgage, several car payments, and college tuition to save for, then this probably isnt the best time in your life for this venture. Not only is 100K per year difficult (but not impossible) in this day and age, but to do so would take one away from family quite a bit.
However, for someone 26 years old, with no college education, not married, no children, no mortgage, who enjoys travel and restuarants, 30K a year and 75-80 comped nights in a hotel, hundreds of free meals is a very enjoyable experience.

I agree to an extent. It is fun for a short time. However, regardless of education, you can make more money in the long run by getting a good job and working your way up. You could have benefits with retirement, dental, health, etc. From what I understand, bj is getting more difficult, and there are fewer beatable games every year on average. the technology is making it more difficult. What this means is that you will probably make less money in the future unless you can find a nitch.

In my opinion, it is not about how much money you can make an hour if you can't play 40 hours a week.

I am not putting bj down, I love the game and will continue to play it seriously, but as a hobbie. I love to travel, and I love to go to the casinos. I will vacation at casino's and play bj probalby for as long as I can, but it has to take a back seat to my job, becasue there is no huge potential unless I create a team.

Fairly soon, a good AP player will be visiting, and I hope to learn some valuable info when he comes.

[ccibball50]

I have another question. I cannot remember where I read it, but in one book I read, it said you can play a game with about a 1 percent advantage spreading from 2-1 and using like 50 indeces in good SD game. I know that there are casinos that offer good games, however from what I understand, they are highly watched and have way too much heat on them. But with a spread that low, could it be playable long term? Say the SD game has a 5000 max and you played 2500 as your base unit.

If this were true, then an average size bet of about 4000 playing heads up with 200 hands/hr would yield about 8k an hour. If you could hit different casinos up for about 100 hours during the course of a year, you could make some good money.

[gibsonlp33stl]

Originally Posted by celadore

I think you should treat it as a hobby and forget about trying to make it a full time career. 100k a year would require an enormous bankroll and/or thousands of hours at the tables. This is going to increase your chances of getting caught.

Team play is difficult as well. Even if you could find players dedicated as you, how much will you be able to trust them? Let's say a team of five. You'll need to be making 500k a year so you can each earn 100k. Big action for me.

I think of blackjack as a high risk investment. I have about $20k committed to this venture now ($15k profit). I expect a 30% annual return for my money playing only part time. That's $6k a year. I have an EV of $30 an hour, which means 200 hours a year, a measly 4 hours a week. Next year I'll have an investment of $26k, so I'll increase my hours to maintain a 30% ROI).

At the same time, I have my funds invested in a 12% flexible investment, that's going to get me an extra $2,400 a year appox. More as I keep adding to the pot.

Now, that's a long way off a $100k a year. It's not even $10k this year.

However, I worked out that if I never spend any money from my bankroll, continue to win 30% of my bankroll every year and put it in a 12% flexible investment, in 6 years time I will be making $100k a year from both my investment and blackjack, and in 9 years time I will be making $100k from just my 12% flexible investment.

I know that there are some major flaws with this theory, but it's something to think about. Not bad for a part time hobby, and don't forget that the day-job is making the moola as well

Now if only I could find a way for the wifey to stop spending my money

Where in the world are you investing your money, with a flexible 12% return?!?!?! Have you checked those stocks lately? Is your fund ran by a Mr. Bernie Madoff?

[shadroch]

Perhaps Agape Financial? Yet another ponzi scheme unearthed here on Long Island. Only this one targeted middle class people. It's easy to offer 12% interest when you are planning on keeping the principle.

[SD Padres]

It's really just a matter of what makes you happy and what kind of income do you need to support yourself and your family. Personally, I would much rather make $40k from counting cards than $100k working some corporate BS job.
But that's just me. The independence of counting cards for a living is one of the may aspects that is so appealing. Not working for the man.
If you needed / wanted to earn $100k it becomes more difficult as a solo player. That's probably where team play would be a better fit. Get bigger bets down in higher counts and maintain low profile with team play techniques and strategies.

[Billy C1]

Originally Posted by SD Padres

It's really just a matter of what makes you happy and what kind of income do you need to support yourself and your family. Personally, I would much rather make $40k from counting cards than $100k working some corporate BS job.
But that's just me. The independence of counting cards for a living is one of the may aspects that is so appealing. Not working for the man.
If you needed / wanted to earn $100k it becomes more difficult as a solo player. That's probably where team play would be a better fit. Get bigger bets down in higher counts and maintain low profile with team play techniques and strategies.

I understand what you're saying but that 60k difference in income is very substantial.

Billy C1

[celadore]

Originally Posted by gibsonlp33stl

Where in the world are you investing your money, with a flexible 12% return?!?!?! Have you checked those stocks lately? Is your fund ran by a Mr. Bernie Madoff?

Firstly, I don't live in the USA.
This is a private deal that our extended family has negotiated with our bank. It is quite common for a lot of people in our country, although most are only offered 8-10%. $ exchange rate has been fairly stable for the last 15 years.
Last month my uncle withdrew $1 million from Canada to put it in this account here. So you can see I'm pretty much just along for the ride. Beyond that I would prefer not to get into any details.


Even in today's economic climate, there are plenty of decent yielding investments out there. Of course most of those are for long term investments. There are also plenty of private ventures which return 15-25% annual yields, but once again more fixed term. They are also more risky and with limited investment opportunities. Got to make that money work.

[gibsonlp33stl]

From what I've heard it's not just the US that has a tanking economy...

But typically if something is too good to be true than it's either false, or highly illegal. I'm not saying yours is, but it seems pretty sketchy...

[callipygian]

There are more ways to (legally and morally) make money from the stock market than waiting for the stock market to go up. Short selling, for example, is a great way of making money when stocks are headed down.

Given people who know their stuff and have all possible tools at their disposal, it's quite reasonable to consistently beat the stock market as a whole long-term. That's the whole concept of hedge funds.

[SD Padres]

Originally Posted by Billy C1

I understand what you're saying but that 60k difference in income is very substantial.

Billy C1

Absoulutley! If I needed 100k to sustain my current economic obligations, then without question the safety of a guaranteed paycheck is crucial.

But for many - living on 40k and not doing the 9-5 thing can be very rewarding.