Should I learn to count heads up first?

[UncrownedKing]

I know this would be the easiest way to start and once I'm fluent add extra players/ hands to the table, but would I be learning a bad habit by starting to count heads up? If so how many players should I learn to count with at the table?

[moo321]

practice dealing a variety of situations to yourself. The biggest mistake a lot of people make is counting down decks, instead of counting a blackjack game.

[UncrownedKing]

The biggest mistake a lot of people make is counting down decks, instead of counting a blackjack game.

I guess yet again, I have learned a bad habit. When dealing to myself, I clearly won't be able to count 6 or 7 hands at a time even when dealing slow, does 2 or 3 sound ok for starting off at fair speed?

[StandardDeviant]

Originally Posted by UncrownedKing

I guess yet again, I have learned a bad habit...I clearly won't be able to count 6 or 7 hands at a time even when dealing slow

I have found that it doesn't make that much of a difference how many hands are at the table, since the dealer deals to them one at a time. I count two cards at a time, so I will be looking at players 1&2, and then 3&4, etc.

I do find there is a difference when there is an odd v an even number of players when counting two at a time, because if there is an odd number of players, the dealer's card is needed to complete the last pair (e.g., player 3 + dealer).

On my last trip to the casino I found myself doing something a bit different than counting in pairs as described above. I'm not sure I can describe this adequately, but here goes. I would count in "pairs" but across more than two cards at a time. For example:

Player 1 gets a 10 - I think "-1"
Player 2 gets a 9 - I ignore it
Player 3 gets an 8 - I ignore it
Player 4 gets a 2 - I think "1 + -1 = 0, no change to the count"

I find that when I think this way, instead of focusing on Player 1 + Player 2 and then Player 3 + Player 4, the game seems to slow down

[UncrownedKing]

So you count as the cards are being dealt instead of the more common way of waiting til all the cards are dealt?

[jack,jackson]

Originally Posted by UncrownedKing

I know this would be the easiest way to start and once I'm fluent add extra players/ hands to the table, but would I be learning a bad habit by starting to count heads up? If so how many players should I learn to count with at the table?

If you practice just playing heads-up, you may find yourself a little overwhelmed, at first(especially when playing with a fast dealer) with a full table.

Your two card combos, "adding and subtracting" from the RC, gets a little harder as the number of players increase. However, TC caculations, for betting and playing decisions, become somewhat easier, because of the extra amount of time your given before making your decision.

So, while playing heads-up, maybe easier for the actual counting of the cards, its somewhat harder, in the aspect of calculating TCs for betting and playing decisions. Thats probably why, Moo said its best to balance the # of hands.

[UncrownedKing]

So, while playing heads-up, maybe easier for the actual counting of the cards, its somewhat harder, in the aspect of calculating TCs for betting and playing decisions. Thats probably why, Moo said its best to balance the # of hands.

I've been counting on verite with 2-3 players and I'm getting pretty quick with the count. The dealing and animated settings are about 1/4 away from the highest speed, but if I add more hands it gets way overwhelming as you said. I guess I will have to keep pushing myself. "The sky is the limit."

PS: I am using the demo version of verite strictly for counting reasons, not for $$ results. It is the closest I can get to real-time speed, although it is not quite real-time speed.

[ohbehave]

Typically a heads up game is significantly faster. You'll need to be better than if there are other players. Other players slow down the game.

[UncrownedKing]

Typically a heads up game is significantly faster. You'll need to be better than if there are other players. Other players slow down the game.

I know, but I can count 3 cards significantly faster than say 9 or 11. Plus (on verite) by the time I have the count after 11 cards, some of the players have already played out their hand(not to mention if the dealer gets BJ I'm screwed as far as the count goes). I am getting pretty quick though. I'm hoping to be able to count and play 7 hands at the same time with little hesitation before I actually test my skills at a casino.

Thanks for the rapid responses and the advice. I wouldn't have started card counting if it weren't for this forum. I can't even begin to express my gratitude.

[takinfromindians97]

You should learn to count in pairs its much faster because alot of time you will get 2 card which cancel each other out and can skip right over it. Also if you count the cards as they are dropped you should be done by the time first base starts to play his hand, then just count the additional cards which are played. i recomend pair counting or even 3 or 4 cards at a time, that will help you for playing hand held games for when the dealer flips everyones hands over quickly.