Where should I start?

[Martinstatic]

I have been practicing counting for a while now, and my results from mock games (with 6 decks and Lego as chips) are very good, however, I have never counted in a casino.
I'll be 18 soon, so a plethora of casino's will be available to me, but, I don't know where to start.

There is a small place nearby down an alley which I thought would be a good place to start, but when I rang to ask questions, it seemed dodgy. The man's voice was slurred and didn't seem to know what I was talking about, and kept asking 'Who am I speaking ta?"; he didn't seem to realize I was talking about the casino for a while, and even when he did, his answers weren't straight.

Should I risk counting in such a place or just go to a better recognized establishment?


- Thanks in advance, Martin

[no_fear]

Well, I'm also new but I think that could be a good idea - you hone your skills there and then once you feel confident enough go smash the bigger casinos. Also, if you get barred from there it won't be such a big deal

[Pro21]

What country are you in? I would not recommend the back alley casino. Cheating is rare, but when it does happen it is more likely in one of these illegal underground clubs. I would stick with the well-advertised, brightly lit casinos.

[Martinstatic]

Originally Posted by Pro21

What country are you in? I would not recommend the back alley casino. Cheating is rare, but when it does happen it is more likely in one of these illegal underground clubs. I would stick with the well-advertised, brightly lit casinos.

I'm in Ireland, I think that would be a good idea. Especially considering the small size of the town, I wouldn't want to end up sitting in an empty room with just me and some drunk guy getting angry.

[newb99]

If it's some unlicensed gambling den, don't be silly. You will get the $#it beaten out of you if they suss on to the fact that you're being smart. The people who run places like this aren't just going to smile as you walk away with their money and say "have a nice day".

Practice until you're 18, then pop over to the UK and visit a University town. There'll be loads of kids your age playing and you'll have no problems blending in. I'm told you can get a Ryanair flight from Dublin or Shannon for around a tenner return?

Good luck.

[Martinstatic]

Originally Posted by newb99

If it's some unlicensed gambling den, don't be silly. You will get the $#it beaten out of you if they suss on to the fact that you're being smart. The people who run places like this aren't just going to smile as you walk away with their money and say "have a nice day".

Practice until you're 18, then pop over to the UK and visit a University town. There'll be loads of kids your age playing and you'll have no problems blending in. I'm told you can get a Ryanair flight from Dublin or Shannon for around a tenner return?

Good luck.

True, I was thinking of going to the UK (I was born and lived there, only came here about 3 years ago) as I have a place to stay and know my way around London a fair bit.
There are some respectable places in Dublin, but from the pictures I have seen, they look to be quiet and have small gaming areas, don't want everyone breathing down my the back of my neck.
I'll probably try London, our even outer London soon, maybe Halloween time.
Thanks for advice!

[Traveller]

The games in the uk are not great, they are hard to beat, conditions are poor in most places. The spread you need to beat the game with the rules they have will be large and therefore fluctuations will be high. I suspect you don't have much of a bankroll and even if you did, with the experience you have it is unlikely that you will win.

I think you should finish your education and forget about blackjack.

[newb99]

Traveller, a rather pessimistic summary I think. Blazin22 said something even more severe recently when he described the ENHC-UK ruleset as a "Trash game".

Depends of course on what you're comparing it with. If you're comparing it with the SD/DD 3:2 games that can be found in the States, it probably is. But if you're a low stakes player (£5/$10 per unit) and all you can find in the States is a six decker with H17, then there probably isn't a lot in it. I agree that to get a reasonable return you'll need a 1-16+ spread, but if everything on these boards is to be believed whereas you can do that without any hassle in the UK even with a poorer ruleset in the States it'll put a flag up.

Now, before Blazin goes off again, taking this view doesn't make me the marketing rep for the UK table games industry, I make it to keep things in perspective. Unless you're playing for thousands of hours, with a £20+ unit bet, the extra 0.11% HE isn't really going to make too much difference. If you're a pro AP playing 30-40 hours a week at £20+ then yes - book a flight to the States. I wonder how many people actually play BJ for the specific purpose of making or topping up a living in the UK (having an expectation of winning £5K+pa)? I bet you wouldn't need more than a couple of 'phone boxes to put them all in. For recreational players if you accept that until someone has 5,000-10,000 hands plus under their belt, the variance in the game leaves it all a gamble anyway, then the finer points of the "good game / bad game" arguements (and I include the 0.11% extra HE in this) become somewhat irrelevent.

My advice (for what it's worth) to Martinstatic would be to come to the UK and enjoy himself playing BJ, counting for the crack. Provided he's under no illusions about walking away with a bundle more than he came with, and has a handle on his RoR, he won't go home disappointed. I beg to differ in that I think he should complete his education and enjoy playing BJ with money he can afford to lose. His call of course.

[Traveller]

Originally Posted by newb99

.

I wonder how many people actually play BJ for the specific purpose of making or topping up a living in the UK (having an expectation of winning £5K+pa)? I bet you wouldn't need more than a couple of 'phone boxes to put them all in.

My advice (for what it's worth) to Martinstatic would be to come to the UK and enjoy himself playing BJ, counting for the crack. Provided he's under no illusions about walking away with a bundle more than he came with, and has a handle on his RoR, he won't go home disappointed. I beg to differ in that I think he should complete his education and enjoy playing BJ with money he can afford to lose. His call of course.

Hi Newb, nice to see you again, long time no chat.

You said it yourself in the first paragraph above. There are not many players making a living in the uk because it is so tough. Martinstatic does not want to play recreationally he wants to try to make it as a pro and it just isn't likely to happen on the UK games.

I was not trashing the uk games i was merely pointing out to 'M' that it is just not worth the effort and with his experience he is more likely to get burned. Of course the games is beatable but he does not have anywhere near enough experience not only tactically but also mentally, he will crumble at the first sign of a down swing.

Hence my advice to go study.

[RJT]

Speaking from personal experience i can say for a fact that if you know what you are doing you can get away with a hell of a lot more than a 1-16 spread in the UK. I seem to remember playing a 1-30 possibly more a few years back.
For counting the games aren't very good, but there are a lot of other opportunities if you know what you are doing. The main problem is not the conditions of the games but rather the ID requirements of the casinos. This is the real barrier between pro players and the UK. Barred in one = barred in all with no chance of playing as you have to produce your members card to get in.

RJT.