Queston to ZG and SONNY : bonus blackjack

[brighten]

one of the local casino offers the bonus blackjack at selective times: The bonus is pay 2:1 instead of 3:2 on suited blackjack, any 6,7,8 pays 2:1. it is 6 deck shoes game, with regular blackjack rules except LS. the pen is decent, most dealer give 1 deck cut.
It is said that player who play BS already have an edge (about 0.2-0.3) on the top with the bonus pay off. I think the edge is very small with suited black only 1/80 hands and 6,7,8 only adds up 0.36 edge with perfect play. So question to Zangrift and Sonny, what is the edge of this game if you flat bet with BS? or bet spead from 1: 20 ? Since this game already has an edge at the very beginning, what is the overall edge that I can get with 1:20 spread? better than a decent DD game with 75% pen with liberal rules?

thanks a lot!

[Sonny]

The edge is actually very large. You’re right that the 6-7-8 bonus doesn’t add much, but it almost makes it an even game off the top. The suited BJ bonus is the biggest help. It will give you almost a 2% edge with basic strategy.

Since the penetration is excellent, even a 1-6 spread will give you incredible results. The exact advantage will depend on your bet ramp, but with an off-the-top edge of 2% you should probably play it safe with a small spread. This is one game you do not want to get barred from!

-Sonny-

P.S. - Man, where do you guys keep finding these 2:1 bonus games? Quinc found one in Reno but now they seem to be popping up all over!

[zengrifter]

Originally Posted by Sonny

The edge is actually very large. You’re right that the 6-7-8 bonus doesn’t add much, but it almost makes it an even game off the top. The suited BJ bonus is the biggest help. It will give you almost a 2% edge with basic strategy.

I don't think suited BJ adds 2% - this came up once before and someone, maybe it was Ken did a sim. Double check that, please. zg

[E-town-guy]

Originally Posted by zengrifter

I don't think suited BJ adds 2% - this came up once before and someone, maybe it was Ken did a sim. Double check that, please. zg

In Blackbelt in Blackjack Snyder says suited blackjack adds 0.56 to the player in shoe games. If ALL blackjacks play 2:1 it adds 2.26 to the players edge.

[zengrifter]

Originally Posted by E-town-guy

In Blackbelt in Blackjack Snyder says suited blackjack adds 0.56 to the player in shoe games. If ALL blackjacks play 2:1 it adds 2.26 to the players edge.

SONNY!!!!!

[Sonny]

Originally Posted by zengrifter

SONNY!!!!!

Don't blame the me! CVData gave me a win rate of 1.97% with the rules above (6D H17 DAS nS 5/6 pen, 6-7-8=2:1, Suited BJ=2:1)

The 6-7-8 rule added about 0.36% and the suited BJ rule added about 2%. Maybe someone else should run a quick sim and compare it to what I got.

-Sonny-

[QFIT]

My guess is that you specified a 20:10 bonus. But, bonuses are additive. If you want a BJ bonus of 20:10 for suited BJs, specify 5:10 since it already pays 15:10. If you still have problems, use TOOLS-EXPORT and send me the file.

Also the figures in BiB are probably Basic Strategy. I'm not sure of the purpose of these numbers in counting books as the effect for a counter can be quite different.

[Sonny]

Yup, that was exactly the problem. I'll get the new results out shortly...

-Sonny-

[Sonny]

Okay, here are the revised results:

Base game = -0.56%
6-7-8 bonus = +0.31%
Suited BJ bonus = +0.57%
OTT Advantage = +0.32%

The game has an off-the-top edge of about 0.32%. That's still pretty damn good. You have a slight advantage off the top, and it shoots up to 1% at a TC of only +1. A TC of +2 will almost give you a 2% edge so you can be raising your bets often and aggressively. You will barely be ramping your bets at all, mostly jumping from minimum to mid-range to max.

I would still suggest a very small spread since this game will be watched very closely. Don't let your greed get you barred! Start with a 2 unit bet and either double up if the count raises or bet half if the count drops (a simple 1-4 spread). You can easily get away with making big cover bets off the top in this game as well. There is plenty of opportunity for cover, which you will need to use plenty of.

-Sonny-

[zengrifter]

Originally Posted by QFIT

My guess is that you specified a 20:10 bonus. But, bonuses are additive. If you want a BJ bonus of 20:10 for suited BJs, specify 5:10 since it already pays 15:10. If you still have problems, use TOOLS-EXPORT and send me the file.

Also the figures in BiB are probably Basic Strategy. I'm not sure of the purpose of these numbers in counting books as the effect for a counter can be quite different.

Thanks Norm! zg