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  #11  
Old July 1st, 2011, 10:40 AM
shadroch shadroch is offline
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Nelson Rockefeller was dead in 1986, and had stopped being Governor of NY back during the administration of President Ford when he resigned to serve as Vice President of the USofA.
  #12  
Old July 4th, 2011, 10:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLASH1296 View Post
HockeXpert, you said,

"tribal police who are bound first by US law then tribal law"

Correction:

The tribes are NEVER bound by US Law, as they are SOVEREIGN nations.

There is a US Supreme Court Case from the 1970's where the Justices decreed that even constitutional protections (in that case "unreasonable search and seizure") do NOT apply on Indian Land.

I can post that here if there is interest.

One might note that the Seminole Casinos in Florida, according to the Florida Supreme Court's unanimous decision, are unlawful; yet their sovereignty completely protects them from Florida state law.

The single best example of Native American sovereignty that I know of was when (around 1986) New York's then Governor, Nelson Rockefeller, foolishly sent in the State Police to shut down the (then) unlawful casino operating on the Ste. Regis Reservation in northern N.Y. The Mohawks greeted the State Police with road blocks and a hail of gunfire in which some State police were wounded. The Attorney General quickly informed the governor that the State Police have no right to enforce any laws on tribal lands and that agents and officers of Federal, State, County, Municipal governments cannot so much as be present on their land without their permission.

Billboards stating that were erected on the eastern and western access roads, and were still present when last I was there.

Those signs explicitly refused access to the I.R.S. F.B.I. etc.

p.s. Federally recognized Native Americans tribes number > 550 with about 2.4 million members, who have been American citizens with voting rights since 1924. (New Mexico 1962)

State income taxes are not paid on reservation or trust lands.

"Tribal sovereignty describes the right of federally recognized tribes to govern themselves and the existence of a government-to-government relationship with the United States. Thus a tribe is not a ward of the government, but an independent nation with the right to form its own government, adjudicate legal cases within its borders, levy taxes within its borders, establish its membership, and decide its own future fate. The federal government has a trust responsibility to protect tribal lands, assets, resources and treaty rights."
Your interpretation of law and rights on Indian reservations is dangerously false.

American Indians on or off reservations are American citizens and the provisions of the 14th Amendment apply to them as well as us. If I drag a cocktail waitress into my room at Foxwoods and rape her, I will be arrested by Connecticut state police and tried in a Connecticut court. Same thing will happen to a tribal member who does it. No one is above state criminal laws.

It is civil law that is inapplicable on reservations. If I slip and fall in a bafroom at Foxwoods, I will not be able to successfully sue in a Connecticut court. This difference is eminently important to us as AP's, relative to the way we may be treated in these stores, and the things they can and cannot get away with. They can get away with doing things to your car, not your body.
  #13  
Old July 5th, 2011, 12:19 AM
tthree tthree is offline
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Originally Posted by Automatic Monkey View Post
Your interpretation of law and rights on Indian reservations is dangerously false.

American Indians on or off reservations are American citizens and the provisions of the 14th Amendment apply to them as well as us. If I drag a cocktail waitress into my room at Foxwoods and rape her, I will be arrested by Connecticut state police and tried in a Connecticut court. Same thing will happen to a tribal member who does it. No one is above state criminal laws.

It is civil law that is inapplicable on reservations. If I slip and fall in a bafroom at Foxwoods, I will not be able to successfully sue in a Connecticut court. This difference is eminently important to us as AP's, relative to the way we may be treated in these stores, and the things they can and cannot get away with. They can get away with doing things to your car, not your body.
So if while you are in custody of tribal athority at the casino and they take you to the bathroom and the floor is slippery. The try to hold you up but you repeatedly slip on the floor banging your head while they tried to hold you on your feet. You can't sue for battery.
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Old July 5th, 2011, 03:09 AM
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"Facts on the Ground" are that there is no enforcement of any laws on Native American Land.

But, that is irrelevant.

ALL of the laws that you and I are concerned with, whether A.P. or not, are State and local laws.

I spent some time with someone who was severely beaten and injured, (enough to spend more than a week in Intensive Care), after being beaten up at Foxwoods.

His brother, an attorney in Hartford, had the unpleasant task of visiting him in the hospital and informing him that he had no recourse re: criminal charges or a civil claim for reimbursement of hospitalization expenses, etc.
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Old July 5th, 2011, 03:10 AM
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FLASH1296 FLASH1296 is offline
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"Facts on the Ground" are that there is no enforcement of any laws on Native American Land.

But, that is irrelevant.

ALL of the laws that you and I are concerned with, whether A.P. or not, are State and local laws.

I spent some time with someone who was severely beaten and injured,
(enough to spend more than a week in Intensive Care), after being beaten up at Foxwoods.

His brother, an attorney in Hartford, had the unpleasant task of visiting him in the hospital and informing him
that he had no recourse re: criminal charges or a civil claim for reimbursement of hospitalization expenses, etc.
  #16  
Old July 5th, 2011, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tthree View Post
So if while you are in custody of tribal athority at the casino and they take you to the bathroom and the floor is slippery. The try to hold you up but you repeatedly slip on the floor banging your head while they tried to hold you on your feet. You can't sue for battery.
At FW the security guards do not put their hands on anyone as far as I know, but there are always CT state troopers on the premises who will arrest anyone who needs to be arrested. If you saw the security guards there you would understand why they shouldn't be getting involved in anything physical. Keep this in mind if you are having difficulties with the civilians: the security guards cannot help you if violence breaks out.

They'll be charged with battery if you are beaten, for sure, but what you won't be able to sue for are your medical bills and time lost from work if you are injured there in any way, unless it is caused by someone who has assets off their ersatz reservation.
  #17  
Old July 5th, 2011, 11:33 AM
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FLASH1296 FLASH1296 is offline
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In Oct '09 I was indeed physically grabbed by a FW security guard while they
were trying to interrogate my wife, without me being able to hear it clearly.

I had shouted to her "You have nothing to say"
and took a step in her direction, when I was roughly
grabbed by my shirt front and shoved back.
  #18  
Old July 5th, 2011, 11:59 AM
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flyingwind flyingwind is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLASH1296
In Oct '09 I was indeed physically grabbed by a FW security guard while they
were trying to interrogate my wife, without me being able to hear it clearly.

I had shouted to her "You have nothing to say"
and took a step in her direction, when I was roughly
grabbed by my shirt front and shoved back.
Wow. What a story/ordeal. Were you and your wife ok? What else happened? (pm rather than post in public?)
  #19  
Old July 8th, 2011, 01:04 AM
alwayssplitaces alwayssplitaces is offline
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Tribes can't violate federal laws on their reservations. Otherwise we would have marijuana sold at every Indian casino because pot would boost the tribe's revenues. Connecticut law makes it illegal to operate a casino in the state, but Foxwoods and Mohegan Sun are on federal land. The state does not get a dime in taxes from them. Ironically, Connecticut promotes the casinos to encourage tourism.
  #20  
Old July 8th, 2011, 07:07 AM
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Default Iconoclastic Flash says:



There is nothing ironic here. In lieu of taxes, since the state cannot tax a tribe's income,
CT shares in casino slot machine revenue, via a "compact".
The state has a strong pecuniary, interest in funneling tourists to the casinos.

Federal law does not apply to Native American "reservations".
If they did, "tribal lands" would not be "sovereign nations".

That notion of Federal law being applicable and enforceable on native lands is a fiction promulgated
by the federal government in order to placate the non-native american populace.

When "Facts-on-the-Ground" supersede what one is told, only the gullible and naive accept the latter.
Those are the peeps that believe that "all people are treated equally under the law",
including Casey Anthony, O.J. Simpson, and Hurricane Carter. Those are the peeps that
believe in products advertised to give them "six-pack abs", and imagine that chiropractors are physicians.
 

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