Blackjack and Card Counting Forums - BlackjackInfo.com

  #21  
Old July 16th, 2011, 07:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kewljason View Post
It seems to me, the advanced mathematics angle has really been pushed on this site lately. Maybe it is my lack of a mathematics degree and/or background that prevents me from not appreciating this angle as much as others.

Someone visiting this site for the first time and reading through some of these threads, will conclude that to succeed in card counting today, you must play an advanced level 2, 3 or higher count, with multiple side counts, and hundreds of strategy change indices for both the primary count and side counts and that is just not so. I actually believe that in today's game the mathematics is less important than it used to be. The math guys want to run sims showing that a multiple level count will improve your results by .xx percent or two side counts will with hundreds of play variations is worth an additional .xx percent. Some of these guys, I think the majority of their blackjack experience takes place on their computer. They think Qfit's products or even their own programs are their blackjack career instead of a tool to aide in their actual play.

I am not disputing that these advanced card counting ideas don't improve performance. I do believe the value of this 'gain' is overstated, the error rate understated and that it just doesn't translate fully in actual play. I am questioning the value for the majority of players in the real world of play. In the real world there is so much education that must take place on the ground, rather than the computer screen that seems to be overlooked. Things that can result in far greater improvement to your results than higher level counts and side counts. Sniffing out and taking advantage of better games and opportunities. Learning what is and isn't tolerated at different places and tayloring your play to these guidelines and levels. Even learning these tolerance levels for different pit personnel and co-ordinating with their schedules. All these advanced math techniques don't mean squat if you aren't able to apply them anywhere but your computer.

So while, you guys can fight over the merits of such gains in threads that run 15+pages, I want to go on record to say to anyone reading these threads for the first time, or the umpteenth time, whatever your level and intent, from recreational player to supplementing your lifestyle/income, to full-time player, “you don't have to be Newton or Einstein to succeed. You can still do just fine learning the basics”.
Forsooth Brother Kewl, forsooth! zg

Last edited by zengrifter; July 16th, 2011 at 07:57 PM.
  #22  
Old July 16th, 2011, 07:57 PM
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Less is more
Say less and mean more
Keep it simple

Tallman
  #23  
Old July 16th, 2011, 07:59 PM
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zengrifter zengrifter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sucker View Post
This post, with only a LITTLE bit of editing; could and SHOULD be made into a "sticky".
Go ahead and add your little bit of editing here.
Better yet, lets turn the KJ sticky post into a wiki and we can all hack at it! zg
  #24  
Old July 16th, 2011, 08:02 PM
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Gamblor Gamblor is offline
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Fill your bowl to the brim
and it will spill.
Keep sharpening your knife
and it will blunt.
  #25  
Old July 16th, 2011, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psyduck View Post
to have a "mathematics" thread based on personal beliefs and feelings without any data.
Psyduck, I gather by your avatar you have a fondness for water either strained through dried dead leaves or beans.
  #26  
Old July 16th, 2011, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamblor View Post
Fill your bowl to the brim
and it will spill.
Keep sharpening your knife
and it will blunt.
"Let us not confuse the menu for the meal, nor the compass for the destination." --Alan Watts
  #27  
Old July 16th, 2011, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Munchkin View Post
What's really amazing is that people have been arguing this stuff for 30 years. I would be amazed if you could find one really successful player (7 figure lifetime winnings) that would attribute it to using a higher level count.
Richard, I have heard of you! Nice to see you here!

Now with that out of the way, I know one player quite well that fits that description and sides with having the most detailed count imaginable, attributing this to overall lifetime success.
  #28  
Old July 16th, 2011, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zengrifter View Post
"Let us not confuse the menu for the meal, nor the compass for the destination." --Alan Watts
He also said “Zen does not confuse spirituality with thinking about God while one is peeling potatoes. Zen spirituality is just to peel the potatoes.”
  #29  
Old July 16th, 2011, 08:11 PM
MangoJ MangoJ is offline
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I'm very happy to talk math here in this forum, because Blackjack is a rather simple game (from the math point of view). I learned a great deal, which may - or may not - be applicable to different games. My upcoming projects is to tap into poker - profound math skills can only be benefitial.

Of course people can say that the only thing that matters is what happens on the table. I won't disagree, but that is not the point in math discussions. How do you think counting was invented in the first place ?

If you don't care about math threads, don't read'em.
  #30  
Old July 16th, 2011, 08:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zengrifter View Post
"Let us not confuse the menu for the meal, nor the compass for the destination." --Alan Watts
Yep, the map is not the ground you walk on. The model is not reality.
 

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