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  #11  
Old September 26th, 2011, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sucker View Post

If no one EVER wins, there will soon be NO casinos at ALL.
That is a good point, however I think even if the house edge goes through the roof, you will still see the stone-cold degens camped out at slot machines and tables, looking miserable as if it were their job. Nothing more depressing than a degen who wins a huge jackpot and doesn's show an ounce of emotion. I'm sure you have all seen them in your travels.
  #12  
Old September 27th, 2011, 12:13 PM
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Default H17 games

The problem with H17, from our point of view, is that it's insidious. Unlike 6:5, where the reduced payout should be obvious to all but the most unaware, and unlike NDAS, where, if the rule is posted, even the biggest doofus is being told she or he can't do something and therefore usually will assume it's something s/he otherwise would want to do, the disadvantage to the casual player of H17 is not obvious. Sometimes it benefits the house, but sometimes it benefits the player, and to the casual observer it usually won't be apparent that it benefits the house more than it does the player. That's why public education is so important So go out there and spread the word.

I agree wholeheartedly with Tarzan's excellent post. The casinos forget that they are in the gambling business, which means the players have to have at least a small chance of winning. I am amazed at the tightening of rules and comps in this economic environment, when most other businesses are finding ways to give their customers more rather than less value.
  #13  
Old October 10th, 2011, 08:48 PM
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So, this Saturday is the day?

Seems weird to do it on a weekend. You'd think they'd change the layouts on grave shift on a Tuesday or something.

Might try to see what's going on there on Friday. Maybe the last chance on the S17. I like the 4 deck tables. The 1- and 2-deck tables have 1 PC per 2 tables sometimes. Although I have seen some crazy spreads with no heat. (Usually not in line with the count, though.)
  #14  
Old October 12th, 2011, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWFL Blackjack View Post
Nothing more depressing than a degen who wins a huge jackpot and doesn's show an ounce of emotion. I'm sure you have all seen them in your travels.
Erm, after getting a blackjack on a table max bet recently, I realized how little emotion I was showing after getting some awkward looks. Does that make me degenerate? I had to fake it...
  #15  
Old October 12th, 2011, 07:40 PM
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I believe they will just go to the casinos more often in hopes of chasing that illusive big cash out that gamblers love. It is the feeling of that adreniline. That you don't know whats going to happen feeling that gamblers love. Not the rules them selves.

Look at the slots, HA is as high as 17% on the penny slots. Yet slots, I do believe, make up for 60+% all the casinos bottom line. Yet there are still people who try to employ advantage play in slots and electronic games such as video poker and wat not. There may be a little less serious counters overall. Or there will be more counters introducing advantage play techniques or better counting systems. The loss of some wannabe counters could bring a surcharge on dealer tips from all games.

They could give out less free drinks or make the time it takes for a cocktail waitress to reach the table a little longer.

All in all I think the addition of h17 in casinos could actually bring more profit to the casinos in ways that we just dont understand.

The amount of truly talented counters is so small. The addition of the h17 for serious counters that actually make money will just FORCE them to learn something such as ace sequencing, shuffle tracking, hole carding and so on.

Now lets talk about the one that think they know how to count. These people always disregard rules and house advantage and dont really commit to learning the completely. They are really just the average gambler looking for that feeling whither they know it or not.

Also the real gamblers will just push mountains of more money in the casinos pockets because they have a problem they cant control. Rules such as h17 and so on have no effect them. I would like to say that more than 90% of them dont even know and could never understand the mathematical significance of such rules.

To say that rules of a game decide whether or not the casinos will stay in business is not even an opinion. It isn't even a possibility. The size of the casino, casino personnel and the amount of free comps maybe effected. But casinos are used to there profits and they will do anything to protect them. They are not going to enforce a rule to a game unless they have contingencies in place to safe guard there future as a business
  #16  
Old October 14th, 2011, 09:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fwb View Post
Erm, after getting a blackjack on a table max bet recently, I realized how little emotion I was showing after getting some awkward looks. Does that make me degenerate? I had to fake it...
That makes you look like a counter. You are wise to fake it.
  #17  
Old October 14th, 2011, 11:52 PM
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Really? I watched a lot of degen. gamblers have no emotion either when they get blk jack.!!!!!!!1 I specificly watch them because of hearing you say this or someone else.
  #18  
Old October 15th, 2011, 07:51 PM
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BTW, Biloxi Isle still S17 as of today.

They do say they are going H17, but no one has a firm date. Just "eventually" or "sometime soon" or "that's what they say."
  #19  
Old October 18th, 2011, 10:15 AM
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Default Changing times indeed

Quote:
Originally Posted by creeping panther View Post
All but hi-limit rooms will be hit 17. This is really signalling the end of BJ as a game that can be somewhat easily beaten, and will wash out more wanna-be counters than anything ever before.

The curtain is coming down, little things here and there, and then real big things like h-17, once reserved for only sd games, now on CSM and multi deck and 6.5.

For those who care to argue the fact, look at the math between h-17 and s-17.

CP
I pretty much agree with this and the other views expressed in this interesting thread. Blackjack is no longer the game analyzed by Stanford Wong and Ken Uston and others years ago.
One point not mentioned enough is that perhaps all future AP gamblers will always be BIG players. S17 is still offered in some high-limit rooms and these big players also get casino credit and even a loss rebate. It was a combination of these factors that enabled a blackjack expert to crush the high-limit games in Jersey a few months ago.
  #20  
Old November 14th, 2011, 06:21 PM
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Biloxi Isle still S17 on all tables.
 

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