Greece

[Machinist]

Okay so all we hear on the news is we dont want Greece to default.
I dont get it. Why should we care and why would this have any effect on our markets?
I mean how big is Greece ...........big enough to cause a ripple effect?
What the heck does Greece do for this world anyways..............I cant think of one thing i have bought that says " Made in Greece". Maybe olive oil???
Any insite into this.........anybody???

Thanks

Machinist

[tthree]

Originally Posted by Machinist

Okay so all we hear on the news is we dont want Greece to default.
I dont get it. Why should we care and why would this have any effect on our markets?
I mean how big is Greece ...........big enough to cause a ripple effect?
What the heck does Greece do for this world anyways..............I cant think of one thing i have bought that says " Made in Greece". Maybe olive oil???
Any insite into this.........anybody???

Thanks

Machinist

There is a debt scam that has been going on between governments and bankers and other big business interests. The deal between them is to give the politicians the money to be elected so they can continue to spend more than what is brought in. More and more of tax revenue goes to pay for the scam each year as long as people are dumb enough to elect the candidates that these interests own. The interests own the media outlets, so their candidates are treated with velvet gloves by the media. The ones that they don't own are lambasted or ignored by the media. Most people are to stupid to think for themselves so this approach is very effective. The scam works great yielding a higher percent of the collected taxes to special interests each year until the government defaults on the debt. At that time they use the media to cause a panic and buy up valuable assets at fire sale prices with all the money they have siphoned off the taxpayers. This way they even make money on the default. It is just a more sophisticated good old boy network kind of stuff that has been around for years.

[sagefr0g]

Originally Posted by tthree

There is a debt scam that has been going on between governments and bankers and other big business interests. The deal between them is to give the politicians the money to be elected so they can continue to spend more than what is brought in. More and more of tax revenue goes to pay for the scam each year as long as people are dumb enough to elect the candidates that these interests own. The interests own the media outlets, so their candidates are treated with velvet gloves by the media. The ones that they don't own are lambasted or ignored by the media. Most people are to stupid to think for themselves so this approach is very effective. The scam works great yielding a higher percent of the collected taxes to special interests each year until the government defaults on the debt. At that time they use the media to cause a panic and buy up valuable assets at fire sale prices with all the money they have siphoned off the taxpayers. This way they even make money on the default. It is just a more sophisticated good old boy network kind of stuff that has been around for years.

yup, pretty much what's going on, imho.
just would add the P-word, more emphasis on it if that was allowed, lol.
but the suffering caused, the people in Greece, well actually globally, here too, well, in a word, it's deplorable.
entities that are 'too big to fail' are set up to fail, then the instigator comes to the 'rescue' ......... it's the phony sick hero syndrome, like a firefighter that goes around setting fires, so he can put them out and be the hero.

[Machinist]

I dont know tthree. How big is the GDP of Greece? I kind of might compare it to one of our states going belly up , like oh well Illinois , if they went bankrupt what would be the effect.
I dont know if that is a good comparison. You really think its the good ole boy stuff?
If Illinois did go belly up would it shift world markets and worries????
Still seems strange to me.. Has to be more to the story...

Machinist

[Jack_Black]

Originally Posted by tthree

There is a debt scam that has been going on between governments and bankers and other big business interests. The deal between them is to give the politicians the money to be elected so they can continue to spend more than what is brought in. More and more of tax revenue goes to pay for the scam each year as long as people are dumb enough to elect the candidates that these interests own. The interests own the media outlets, so their candidates are treated with velvet gloves by the media. The ones that they don't own are lambasted or ignored by the media. Most people are to stupid to think for themselves so this approach is very effective. The scam works great yielding a higher percent of the collected taxes to special interests each year until the government defaults on the debt. At that time they use the media to cause a panic and buy up valuable assets at fire sale prices with all the money they have siphoned off the taxpayers. This way they even make money on the default. It is just a more sophisticated good old boy network kind of stuff that has been around for years.

whoa, that is some serious conspiracy conjecture.

anyway, the real answer is Greece is part of the EU which uses the euro for currency. They are now realizing the limitations of having multiple and independent economies using one currency for trade. it was a dumb idea to begin with. all the strong nations prop the weak nations somewhat. but now the cost of living in the weaker countries skyrocket while still keeping wages at pre euro levels. I used to be able to get a beer in Prague for 10 cents, and a cappuccino in italy for a dollar, but after the euro, beer in most countries is now 10 bucks in a bar and coffee is about 5 bucks in a cafe.

back to Greece and the world. the euro has other countries with economic problems, but greece is about to default, or not. depending on what media source you read. it's putting quite the pressure on the Euro to stay relevant. Germany was one of the few strong countries that was helping to keep the euro afloat by buying some of Greece's debt, but even Germany is now in trouble. And no, it's not like if IL went bankrupt. there's 17 countries and each country is supposedly independent, unlike IL which has plenty of federal funding.

The Euro was supposed to be the New world order currency. a few years after it's inception, you could buy Oil barrels in Dollars or Euro. it was supposed to take over the dollar as the most powerful currency based on the idea of several countries backing it must be better than one. well guess what?

The world market is really just one market. a ripple effect is commonplace. So many countries and Institutions use the Euro for trading and investing. when the Euro loses value, it puts a strain on trading european made products. For example, those beemers and ferraris can't be sold for pennies on the dollar. they also can't be built if the euro doesn't have much buying power to buy raw materials.

[shadroch]

If I owe you $10,000, you can claim it as an asset and borrow against it.
It is considered part of your net worth, as it is, in business terms, an account recievable.
If I default, now you can't claim it as an asset, and your net worth is reduced by the same amount.
It doesn't really matter if you can repay me or not. As long as your promise to pay me is viable, I can use your IOU as colateral on a loan from someone else.
This is a simple explanation of what is happening in Europe.

[blackjack avenger]

Originally Posted by shadroch

If I owe you $10,000, you can claim it as an asset and borrow against it.
It is considered part of your net worth, as it is, in business terms, an account recievable.
If I default, now you can't claim it as an asset, and your net worth is reduced by the same amount.
It doesn't really matter if you can repay me or not. As long as your promise to pay me is viable, I can use your IOU as colateral on a loan from someone else.
This is a simple explanation of what is happening in Europe.

I agree & Greece shows the problem of to much credit
&
Failure of socialism

[tthree]

Originally Posted by blackjack avenger

I agree & Greece shows the problem of to much credit
&
Failure of socialism

Are we learning yet? Hasta la vista,baby.

[shadroch]

Originally Posted by blackjack avenger

I agree & Greece shows the problem of to much credit
&
Failure of socialism

No offense, but that makes about as much sense as saying the housing crash shows the problem of too much credit and capitalism.
In reality, neither one shows any such thing.

[Machinist]

Originally Posted by shadroch

If I owe you $10,000, you can claim it as an asset and borrow against it.
It is considered part of your net worth, as it is, in business terms, an account recievable.
If I default, now you can't claim it as an asset, and your net worth is reduced by the same amount.
It doesn't really matter if you can repay me or not. As long as your promise to pay me is viable, I can use your IOU as colateral on a loan from someone else.
This is a simple explanation of what is happening in Europe.

Thanks shad,
That makes sense. But how much dough are we talking about here? Its greece, population of?? I mean........how big of a player are they in this game?? Do they even represent a tiny fraction of a percent of all money borrowed, lent, or shuffled about?
They just seem to small to make any ripples at all. Maybe I'm underestimating the country.

Machinist