Blackjack and Card Counting Forums - BlackjackInfo.com

  #11  
Old November 12th, 2011, 06:15 AM
tthree tthree is offline
Executive Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,277
Default

The players I see in AC are terrible players and locals for the most part. They aren't going anywhere no matter what but the bulk of the AC gamblers are going elsewhere because most players DO know the difference. And all their friends that don't play blackjack but prefer slots or some carny game go right along with them. If a group of 6 guys want to go to a casino and 1 plays BJ while the rest likes slots, 3 card poker, roulette and craps, everyone doesn't care where they go except the blackjack player. so they go where the BJ player wants to go. The other games are the same everywhere. This has cost AC millions maybe billions. They can test this hypothesis. Start to offer early surrender on their games or some other rule that makes them better than their competition. At this point going to the same as the competition is not likely to help but it would be a good start.

Jacob how is poker getting back at them. the make money of every pot. They can't lose unless the pots are so small and the game is so slow that the rake can't cover the cost of the running the table. Are you suggesting getting a bunch of people together and filling a table or the whole pit and playing extra slow and not betting? Otherwise you are allowing them to reap the benefits of driving you from the BJ tables by playing poker.
  #12  
Old November 12th, 2011, 08:24 AM
Jacob Jacob is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 83
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tthree View Post

Jacob how is poker getting back at them. the make money of every pot. They can't lose unless the pots are so small and the game is so slow that the rake can't cover the cost of the running the table. Are you suggesting getting a bunch of people together and filling a table or the whole pit and playing extra slow and not betting? Otherwise you are allowing them to reap the benefits of driving you from the BJ tables by playing poker.

The receptive and adaptive APs can find more than one way to skin a cat. Poker or 3CP is another revenue to get back at casinos. As an example, take the cases of the "Padman" and the Godfather of AC. Casinos have "86ed" them indirectly from all bj games; however, With a little help of "library cards (note1)", they have created new identities and still are welcome by casinos in the games of poker and 3CP.

Back at your question, it's true that Padman has won money NOT directly from casinos but from other weak poker players, but casinos have comped him to the Diamond or Chairman's Club Buffets everyday, and even free rooms if he wants to (Wow, from a 86ed guy to VIP!). Also Padman or other APs can encourage suckers to drop bj games and to play games of poker . Now that encouragement is another way to get back at the evil empire. Hmm--- it seems working because there are more suckers in poker rooms than bj pits .

Note1: Circa decades ago, Counselor Dallas Barrister of BJ21.com coined "library card." At that time he said it's okay to use a "library card" to get a rating card "anonymously".

Last edited by Jacob; November 12th, 2011 at 07:22 PM.
  #13  
Old November 12th, 2011, 11:25 AM
shadroch shadroch is offline
Executive Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 6,696
Default

Is it your quest to win money from the evil casinos or just to win money?
I play to win money and enjoy myself. Doesn't really matter where the money comes from.
  #14  
Old November 12th, 2011, 12:09 PM
jaygruden's Avatar
jaygruden jaygruden is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Anytown, USA on the East Coast
Posts: 279
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadroch View Post
Personal observations are almost worthless.
While I don't disagree with this statement, how else can you make any judgments on the matter? As a matter of fact, how are you arriving at your belief that ploppies have no idea about the rules? Unless you have done a scientific study or taken a massive survey of gamblers then you are also basing this purely on observation.

I think that too often we group BJ players into only 2 groups...AP and Ploppy but you can not discount that a 3rd group exists...the skilled basic strategy player. He is still playing a losing game but certainly understands the rules of the game and how they affect the HE. He knows BS and plays with it primarily if not always.

Using only my personal observations this is how I estimate the BJ field looks:

1% Advantage Player
19% What the casino would call "Skilled Basic Strategy Player" who narrows the HE down to the theoretical 1-2% +or-
80% Ploppy who plays so poorly that they inflate the HE to 3-5% or greater range.

I am using no scientific research here. It is only an estimate but think I may be underestimating the % of the BS player.

I agree that the true ploppy doesn't know sh*t from shinola when it comes to the rules of the game or how they affect the HE. The BS player does understand this, however. I know many personally and have met hordes of others who say they used to go to AC but have not gone since some neighboring states have opened stores with way better rules. I think that AC has lost most of these people and will not get them back unless/until they improve the quality of their games. JMHO.
  #15  
Old November 12th, 2011, 01:59 PM
Automatic Monkey's Avatar
Automatic Monkey Automatic Monkey is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 5,171
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadroch View Post
Is it your quest to win money from the evil casinos or just to win money?
I play to win money and enjoy myself. Doesn't really matter where the money comes from.
Do you feel the same way about sex? It's all fun and games until somebody gets the bullhead.
  #16  
Old November 12th, 2011, 04:03 PM
FLASH1296's Avatar
FLASH1296 FLASH1296 is offline
Executive Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: East Coast, U S A
Posts: 3,749
Send a message via ICQ to FLASH1296 Send a message via AIM to FLASH1296
Default

On behalf of us, one and (virtually) all, welcome back A.M.
  #17  
Old November 12th, 2011, 06:16 PM
shadroch shadroch is offline
Executive Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 6,696
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Automatic Monkey View Post
Do you feel the same way about sex? It's all fun and games until somebody gets the bullhead.

If I was going to break my word and return aftwer vowing never to, I think I'd save it for sonmething important.
  #18  
Old November 13th, 2011, 01:41 AM
Automatic Monkey's Avatar
Automatic Monkey Automatic Monkey is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 5,171
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shadroch View Post
If I was going to break my word and return aftwer vowing never to, I think I'd save it for sonmething important.
1. I have my reasons.

2. The bullhead is important.

3. All AP information will now be posted at the Zen Zone, which unlike this site is managed by a legitimate AP who does not screw with AP's.
  #19  
Old November 13th, 2011, 08:52 AM
SandBaggins's Avatar
SandBaggins SandBaggins is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 54
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarzan

Greed causes them to jack up the rules to make a higher percentage of profit but if your gross volume of business declines drastically due to the rule changes, this backfires and they destroy their profit margins. Paranoia causes them to not only spend huge amounts of money (more than they could possibly ever lose to counters) on countermeasures but to also cause encumbrances on the game itself that affect all players.
I fully agree. Sounds a lot like the US tax code!

(To prevent any drama, I am not going to reply to any comments resulting from my post :-)

SB
  #20  
Old November 13th, 2011, 08:57 AM
tthree tthree is offline
Executive Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 2,277
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SandBaggins View Post
I fully agree. Sounds a lot like the US tax code!

(To prevent any drama, I am not going to reply to any comments resulting from my post :-)

SB
x2. Let's to to restrain the response. Start your own thread if you want to go all political.
 

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:05 AM.


Forum Software vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005-2011 Bayview Strategies LLC