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  #1  
Old December 2nd, 2011, 02:47 PM
mikeyd mikeyd is offline
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Default Surrender Indices for H17

What index should be used to late surrender 17 vs A,
and to surrender 8,8 vs A for H17, 7/8?

According to Professional BJ, page 261, 17 should be
surrendered against A at TC +2 or lower,
and 8,8 should be surrendered vs A at TC of -5 or higher.

I downloaded indices from demo of CV and all
were what I expected except there was no index
for these two; that is, the CV demo said not to surrender.

Given my lack of technology skills, I could have messed up
in running CV, so I want to make sure I know the correct index.
Thanks for any input.
  #2  
Old December 2nd, 2011, 05:04 PM
Zero's Avatar
Zero Zero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyd View Post
What index should be used to late surrender 17 vs A,
and to surrender 8,8 vs A for H17, 7/8?

According to Professional BJ, page 261, 17 should be
surrendered against A at TC +2 or lower,
and 8,8 should be surrendered vs A at TC of -5 or higher.
What edition are you looking at? My 1994 edition has no such numbers. There is no index for surrendering 17 v A nor 8,8 v A on p 261 of my book.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyd View Post
I downloaded indices from demo of CV and all
were what I expected except there was no index
for these two; that is, the CV demo said not to surrender.

Given my lack of technology skills, I could have messed up
in running CV, so I want to make sure I know the correct index.
Thanks for any input.
No, you've got it right. There is no index for these two scenarios in CV's Hi-Lo index table. You should not surrender.

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  #3  
Old December 2nd, 2011, 05:47 PM
mikeyd mikeyd is offline
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[QUOTE=Zero;262845]What edition are you looking at? My 1994 edition has no such numbers. There is no index for surrendering 17 v A nor 8,8 v A on p 261 of my book.

I have the 1994 edition. Appendix A, Table A2, High-Low, Four Decks, H17 on the 3rd page of this table, which is page 261 of my book, for Player's Hand of 10-7 or 9-8, late surrender vs A shows index of 2*. Same page shows 8-8 vs A, index of -5.
Is this table not in your book?
  #4  
Old December 2nd, 2011, 05:53 PM
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Zero Zero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyd View Post
I have the 1994 edition. Appendix A, Table A2, High-Low, Four Decks, H17 on the 3rd page of this table, which is page 261 of my book, for Player's Hand of 10-7 or 9-8, late surrender vs A shows index of 2*. Same page shows 8-8 vs A, index of -5.
Is this table not in your book?
It's there. Appendix A, Table A2 (Continued), p261 (3rd page of Table A2): 10-7 and 9-8 have a blank under the "late" / "ace" column, 8-8 as well. Weird...

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  #5  
Old December 2nd, 2011, 06:00 PM
21forme 21forme is offline
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Look at Table 33 on p. 93.
  #6  
Old December 2nd, 2011, 07:07 PM
mikeyd mikeyd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 21forme View Post
Look at Table 33 on p. 93.
Right. Page 93 also has surrender 17 v A index at +2 or lower.
It also has index for surrender 8,8 v A as 4*, but based on
table on page 261, I think you ignore this if you can both buy
insurance and surrender, and thus should surrender at -5 or higher.
Do you read this the same way?
  #7  
Old December 2nd, 2011, 09:12 PM
21forme 21forme is offline
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We're talking LS, not ES, so there may be times when you buy INS and surrender.

Your INS index is always +3, regardless of your hand. So at +3, take INS. If the dealer has BJ, the hand is over. If not, then you surrender since TC<4.

If TC<3, don't take INS, but surrender if there is no BJ and the play continues.
  #8  
Old December 2nd, 2011, 10:16 PM
mikeyd mikeyd is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 21forme View Post
We're talking LS, not ES, so there may be times when you buy INS and surrender.

Your INS index is always +3, regardless of your hand. So at +3, take INS. If the dealer has BJ, the hand is over. If not, then you surrender since TC<4.

If TC<3, don't take INS, but surrender if there is no BJ and the play continues.
OK. Thanks. I had been misreading this.
So if I understand this now, PBJ is saying to
late surrender 8,8 v A if TC is -5 thru +4.
Thus at +5 or higher, 8,8 should be split vs A.
  #9  
Old December 3rd, 2011, 08:03 AM
21forme 21forme is offline
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Correct.

Don't worry about the lower index of -5. In a shoe game, you should n't be playing anywhere near that index. Time for a bathroom break or phone call.
  #10  
Old December 3rd, 2011, 08:03 AM
mikeyd mikeyd is offline
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Default Question for QFIT-Possible Glitch in CV Demo

Norm,
I know you said you were taking a break from posting,
but I thought you might be interested in this question.

Is there a glitch in CV demo for H17, 7/8, DAS, LS, which
appears to say to not late surrender 17 v A or 8,8 v A?

According to Professional BJ, page 261, 17 should be
late surrendered against A at TC +2 or lower,
and 8,8 should be surrendered vs A at TC between -5 and +4.
 

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