First Casino Counting Experience.

[JREDZ84]

Sometime last year I looked into counting cards I was into Texas holdem at this time, but for some reason counting cards just seemed to confusing to learn so I just quit.

Well ive been on a loosing streak in poker after thinking I was really good cuz I had won so many times, so now I had been wanting to try something new.

About a 8 days ago I decided to learn how to count, I got the Idea the first day and practiced counting the next day too, I got down to about counting a deck in 45sec. That same day I went to the bookstore and bought a blackjack book and learned the basic strategy and was trying to understand the variations to betting.

On the 4th day I bought 5 decks of cards and was practing by myself, I also started playing with poker chips as if they were real money. I would give out cards as if there was 3 or 4 people at the table. Of course looking at the book, basic strategy and variations at the same time cuz I didnt have everything memorized yet.

I kept practing the next day and by the end of the day I pretty much had everything memorized alright for a beginner. I was amazed to how much I was winning, and was thinking this actually might work. On the 6th day I felt as if I was pretty good at it already and felt as if I needed to start practicing at a casino.

I live in Texas and there is no casinos around here, the only place I would have a chance at is playing on a casino boat that leaves an hour out into sea where gambling is allowed. The boat is 2 and a half hours away.

On the 7th day I put 60 bucks of gas in my car and left, payed 11bucks to enter the boat....

Getting in there I noticed I was in trouble, They had no shoe where they put the decks of cards, instead they had these machines where the decks go into an there is no way of seeing how many decks are left. I had no other choice but to play.

First hand out I lost count dealer was superfast on the 3rd handout I kinda got it, and was counting good from there on. The count was mostly positive from the begining mostly like at plus 4 wouldnt drop below plus2 I was winning alot of my minimum bets of 5buks, How I didnt know how many decks where left I didnt want to raise the bet, I waited a while till I assumed there was few decks left or many had been delt, at one point the count went up to plus 12 plus 15, I started raising the bet at this point, and saw the dealer add another deck into the machine, the count was high and new there was few decks left for the dealer to have added another, so this time I was raising 3 to 4 units. It seemed like I was the only one winning everyone sitting around me had already lost there chips and rebought. I used this strategy on my betting all night since I didnt know how many decks were left. My bets where going up and down sometime from 4 units to 1 unit and I know you shouldnt do this to not attract attention.

I started getting paranoid as the pit boss would come and stand next to me, than he'd leave, after a while he came back stood behind me then grabbed my almost full beer that i hadnt even been drinking and put it in a cup holder. Im mostly a serious quiet type of person and was even more queit at the table, the dealers where fast and i kept concentrating on the count. Pit boss came back so I just decided to color in my chips and come back in a while, the count was positive and didnt really want to leave.

I went to another table and the count was going from plus 4 to minus 4 throughout the game and it seemed like if it was just staying there, I decided to leave the table I broke about even at that table.

I went to another table that was next to the one I had first been at, and the count started going up, I was winning and winning, alot more than I was loosing, I would make up my lost bets when the count would go up. The dealer even started asking me for a tip lol, "Show me some love" thats what she was saying. That same pit boss came to that table, at this point the count was dropping ended up going into the negatives. I pushed my chips to be colored in and the dealer goes <U><B>"WOW SMART MOVE PERFECT TIME TO LEAVE"</B></U> I smiled and walked away with the thought in my head of what she had said, I started wondering if she new I was counting, made me think more that I was being watched.

Well I came back to a table about 15min later, that table had a negative count wouldnt go higher than a negative 8 then it went to negative 15, I was loosing most of my minimum bets and wanted to get out asap but didnt want to make it obvious that I was switching and switching tables.

A table then opened up next to me and switched to that one, count wasnt so bad but I kept loosing, count started going higher with a few minutes left to play and I made my money back that i had been loosing at this table.

I went home with the thought in my head, imagine if I knew how many decks where left, and imagine If I had alot more practice, imagine if I was playing with dimes instead of nickels (Im no where near playing wit 1/4s yet).
I learned alot of little things I need to adjust from this practice, and I still need to learn alot more. I also need to start getting used to having distractions and being more social. Now I know playing with nickels is not alot and I dont know if the casinos would even pay attention to that, maybe I was over paranoid then again no highrollers go on that boat, the maximum play there was 1/4s. I went home with a $420 profit playing, id say not bad for my first time.

I need to practice at a casino where I can see how many decks are left, the closet one is in louisiana about 9 hours away driving. Im currently looking into going to vegas even if its just for 2 days or so.

Thank you all for taking the time to read this long as story, any advice or recommendations are appreiciated.

[callipygian]

Originally Posted by JREDZ84

Well ive been on a loosing streak in poker after thinking I was really good cuz I had won so many times, so now I had been wanting to try something new.

This isn't a good start. Blackjack, like poker, has a high variance with respect to expected winnings. As a result, unless you play a super duper whole lot, it's nearly impossible to determine whether you are a long-term winner or a long-term loser. Just as a reference, Sonny just calculated for me that I would need 90,000 hands to tell whether I'm winning. I've played about 4,000 hands. Assuming you spent 8-10 hours playing at crowded tables, you've probably played 500.

Just as with poker, if you want to win in the long run, you need to be convinced that you're a winner and that you have a winning strategy long before you're proven right.

Originally Posted by JREZ84

They had no shoe where they put the decks of cards, instead they had these machines where the decks go into an there is no way of seeing how many decks are left.

Are you sure you weren't playing on a continuous shuffling machine (CSM)?

Originally Posted by JREZ84

any advice or recommendations are appreiciated.

I'll leave advice to the "real" card counters, I'm pretty much still a newbie myself.

It might help if you posted what counting system you're using. People have a lot of comments on that.

[JREDZ84]

Originally Posted by callipygian

This isn't a good start. Blackjack, like poker, has a high variance with respect to expected winnings. As a result, unless you play a super duper whole lot, it's nearly impossible to determine whether you are a long-term winner or a long-term loser. Just as a reference, Sonny just calculated for me that I would need 90,000 hands to tell whether I'm winning. I've played about 4,000 hands. Assuming you spent 8-10 hours playing at crowded tables, you've probably played 500.

Just as with poker, if you want to win in the long run, you need to be convinced that you're a winner and that you have a winning strategy long before you're proven right.

Are you sure you weren't playing on a continuous shuffling machine (CSM)?

I'll leave advice to the "real" card counters, I'm pretty much still a newbie myself.

It might help if you posted what counting system you're using. People have a lot of comments on that.

You know I started betting with 5dollar units, im gonna take the advice of this book I read and move up to 10dollar units once I reach a blackjack bankroll of $2000, thats of course if I ever do. Sorry I forgot to mention the system I was using ment to do so, the HI LO count. Im also not wanting to bet to much even with that really high count since you always have that chance of loosing, and just try to build my bankroll slowly. This was actually my second time playing blackjack and had not idea what those machines where, maybe they are those you mentioned, since I just noticed they kept adding decks after a while. Hopefully next time I go it goes good too, I know I wont always win. Thanks for the comments.

[E-town-guy]

If you're playing with a $1-2000 BR you're going to find it tough to spread your bets without going broke. Or else you'll have to sit out all negative counts and just play the good ones.

[la_dee_daa]

well at least you had a good first experience with some $$ win

you need to explain what type of machine you were playing against because csms are uncountable but since they were putting decks back its hard to say without more of an explaination. where did they put the cards after they were discarded from the table and when they put them back in? you need to find out how many decks there are to get your TC rather then the running count also.. i suspect these machines will not end up doing (automatic suffle machines) which are countable and either csms or mindplay which is not good.

this next stuff assumes you are playing a countable game

I assume when you say 1/4 units you mean you play $5-$20 or 1-4 unit spread.. you will need alot bigger spread to get an advantage more like 1-12 or $5-$60. unless you have a bankroll of 8-10k don't move to the $10 tables. With 2k you shouldn't even be playing all with $5 min rather you should not play the negative counts (wonging). Without proper bankroll you will have a very high risk of ruin, losing your entire bankroll.

1-4 unit spread also shouldn't attract really any heat at all so don't sweat making those bigger bets. unless this is a super tight joint or something which ain't good

read around this website and read some books and all to learn some more.

work on getting your counting speed for a deck to under 25secs and so on practice with distractions the usual comments you will find around here.

you will find many answears searching old posts.

good luck

[EasyRhino]

It really sounds like the boat was using continuous shufflers. cards go in maybe half a deck at a time, and the machine is always mixing them around. It's the equivalent of having a freshly shuffled shoe every hand you play. In other words, keeping a count is meaningless.

This might be the unintentionally funniest post I've read in a long time. I'll admit that I was baffled when I first saw a CSM, but I could tell that counting against it wasn't going to do me any good.

[Mimosine]

Originally Posted by EasyRhino

.... when I first saw a CSM, but I could tell that counting against it wasn't going to do me any good.

i find this hard to believe and even more funny than the original post, since on countless trips you've ended up playing a couple hands of spanish 21 before realizing something funny was going on

admit it, you've counted a csm or two in your day!

[EasyRhino]

a) It was Super Fun 21, not Spanish.
b) I was drunk.
c) I've backcounted a CSM on accident, but I've never actually played one while counting.
d) I was drunk then, too.
e) I'm drunk right now.

[Diver]

Originally Posted by EasyRhino

e) I'm drunk right now.

Hopefully coming off a full night of consuming Red Bull and vodka, or do we have to consider an intervention considering the time of this post?

[sagefr0g]

Originally Posted by Mimosine

....

admit it, you've counted a csm or two in your day!

lol the very first time i ever played blackjack i tryed to count and of course it was a csm.