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#1
September 13th, 2011, 03:24 AM
 Mr. Ed Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Central CT Posts: 14
When to Leave to Maximize EV per hour?

At what negative count should I leave the table if I want to maximize EV dollars per hour?

I usually leave when the true count pops below -1, but I've always wondered what the ideal time would be.

I'm going to Foxwoods. Eight decks, penetration is 87.5% (one deck), das, ls,
#2
September 13th, 2011, 05:00 AM
 tthree Banned Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,146

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Mr. Ed At what negative count should I leave the table if I want to maximize EV dollars per hour? I usually leave when the true count pops below -1, but I've always wondered what the ideal time would be. I'm going to Foxwoods. Eight decks, penetration is 87.5% (one deck), das, ls,
Your count is necessary to know to answer the question. Blackjack Attack 2005 edition chapter 13 is dedicated to answering this question. It is a must read for counters that wong.
#3
September 13th, 2011, 11:27 AM
 Mr. Ed Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Central CT Posts: 14

Sorry, I don't have BJ Attack III.

Any insights on when to leave the table?

I used to target -1 religiously, but then I simulated as best I could, the average count leaving at -0.5, -1.0, -1.5 and -2.0. It ended up that there was only a tiny difference between -0.5 and -1.0, a small difference between -1.0 and -1.5 and a tolerable difference between -1.5 and -2.0.

Now I feel comfortable leaving at -1.0 if I have a good reason to leave, and waiting until -2.0 if I have a good reason to stay.

But I never took into account the waiting time to find another shoe. It might take 5 minutes if I sit down at an empty table and the dealer has to reshuffle. Or maybe 15 minutes if the casino is crowded.

So, I'm not sure what's the BEST time to leave, if I'm trying to make the most dollars per hour.
#4
September 13th, 2011, 11:58 AM
 FLASH1296 Executive Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: East Coast, U S A Posts: 2,748

Mr. Ed,

"Sorry, I don't have BJ Attack III."

The 3rd ed. of BJA is a must have.

It is requisite reading. Not debatable.

I will forego defining the imperative "must".

If you can put cash on the table in a casino,

then you have no rational excuse.

... not as long as you can read (English).
#5
September 13th, 2011, 12:30 PM
 tthree Banned Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,146
I hope this helps

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Mr. Ed Sorry, I don't have BJ Attack III. Any insights on when to leave the table? I used to target -1 religiously, but then I simulated as best I could, the average count leaving at -0.5, -1.0, -1.5 and -2.0. It ended up that there was only a tiny difference between -0.5 and -1.0, a small difference between -1.0 and -1.5 and a tolerable difference between -1.5 and -2.0. Now I feel comfortable leaving at -1.0 if I have a good reason to leave, and waiting until -2.0 if I have a good reason to stay. But I never took into account the waiting time to find another shoe. It might take 5 minutes if I sit down at an empty table and the dealer has to reshuffle. Or maybe 15 minutes if the casino is crowded. So, I'm not sure what's the BEST time to leave, if I'm trying to make the most dollars per hour.
It varies for rules and pen. They use a 1 to 12 spread as the standard. I have crushed some shoes that hit my normal wong out point early but were cut skinny so I stayed and everything went right after that. After checking the CBJN I see you have 6 deck S17 DAS LS nm.

6 S17 DAS LS: TC departures are listed below.
depth, 4.5pen 5pen
0.5 dk, -0.85, -0.90
1.0 dk, -0.90, -1.03
1.5 dk, -0.95, -1.16
2.0 dk, -1.00, -1.29
2.5 dk, -1.05, -1.42
3.0 dk, -1.00, -1.55
3.5 dk, -0.85, -1.61
4.0 dk, -0.35, -1.55
4.5 dk, +1.95, -1.16
5.0 dk, ------, +1.94

The reason you leave at a plus count late in the shoe is the time it takes to shuffle is better spent starting a new shoe than playing a hand or so at an advantage. I am not sure I agree. I guess it depends on if a shoe is about to be started or not. They tried to determine wasted time between shoes (6 rounds) and felt it better to leave for a fresh shoe that is about to be dealt. Other common sense variables are considered.

Last edited by tthree; September 13th, 2011 at 12:33 PM.
#6
September 13th, 2011, 11:19 PM
 bigplayer Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: United States Posts: 359

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Mr. Ed At what negative count should I leave the table if I want to maximize EV dollars per hour? I usually leave when the true count pops below -1, but I've always wondered what the ideal time would be. I'm going to Foxwoods. Eight decks, penetration is 87.5% (one deck), das, ls,
#7
September 16th, 2011, 06:24 PM
 stopgambling Senior Member Join Date: May 2011 Location: north Posts: 63

How often can we go to the washroom in an hour without looking strange.I got many bad shoes in an hour .So i go to washroom every 20 mins??????Are there any good tactics to deal with these situation??
#8
September 16th, 2011, 06:42 PM
 Automatic Monkey Banned Join Date: May 2006 Location: Connecticut Posts: 4,537

Quote:
I agree, if you are using High-Low, and not going to another table, the best number is around TC = -2.
#9
September 17th, 2011, 05:18 AM
 21forme Executive Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 2,497

Quote:
 Originally Posted by stopgambling How often can we go to the washroom in an hour without looking strange.I got many bad shoes in an hour .So i go to washroom every 20 mins??????Are there any good tactics to deal with these situation??
Always have a cup of coffee (decaf) at the table.
#10
September 18th, 2011, 03:18 AM
 SleightOfHand Executive Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 691

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