Pitch Blackjack Question

[SammyBoy]

I love playing pitch BJ either double or single deck, as I'm sure most of you do as well. It's occured to me that I could make better decisions if I were able to see the "down" cards of the other players, especially when contemplating insurance. Occasionally the players next to me will show me their cards or I'm able to look at their cards and incorporate them into the count. I've never heard anyone from the pit ever say that players could not look at each others cards. Now to take this one step farther. If I knew 2 or 3 guys that were playing with me at the table we could devise a system where if they have 2 ten point cards they would tuck them immediately, or if it was a pair of two's or simialr hand where the value is +2 they would hold them above the table. You could come up with other signals for either a +1, -1, or 0 hand. Here are my questions:

1. Would this be considered cheating by the casino?
2. If it is not cheating would it be worth the effort?
3. If it is cheating would it be worth the risk/effort?

 

[Biff]

I try to see as many cards as possible during the hand. You need to develope a cover for doing this. I use the good old boy cover and start developing as soon as I sit down. I will ask players on both sides of me what they would do with this hand, but of course I do whatever indices tell me to do.
Bottom line is more cards you see the better it is for you.
Biff

 

[JamesB]

Sammy,
Not cheating but is always advantageous as in the more info the better. I agree with Biff that cover is the way to go, 'cause the house will introduce themselves if they find your using the info. Sitting center is best.

JB

 

[phantom007]

And, as long as you do not do it every hand, and especially when you hold hands that "would require thought" at a ploppy level (DD's, 12's, etc.), just simply ask other players "what ya' got?". This happens so frequently, that I doubt it would get any attention.

Another ploy would be to have a friend sit to your right, and play the "beginner act"...thus it would look natural to look at most of his/her hands, and give advice (and Count the Cards). Best to have your accomplice betting low $, so as to be able to give "bad" advice if PC visiting. I suggest "to the right" of you just so that you can Count both the 2 hole cards plus any applicable draw cards.

Tired of acting? Then just have your friend(s) hold their cards at an angle where you can see them...easily accomplished without looking unnatural. When your friends take a hit, have them show their cards to the Dealer, and of course to you...a common ploppy ploy, show the Dealer what you need to increase the chance of getting it.

Another angle is "Counting by Inference". For example, the Dealer shows a 9 up, and the other players quickly slide their cards under their chips, sigh, smile, then sit back and look at you to hurry up and play out your hand, so that they can get paid...you can "Infer" that most if not all of the unseen cards are 10's, and adjust the Count ONLY for your play of your hand. And, if a player hits, draws a 10, hits again, and draws a 5, then stands, the "Inference" would be that he/she has 2 small cards, and same would be noted in the Count for the play of THAT hand.

Certainly nothing wrong with your proposed system...just seems to me to be adding a complicated layer of distraction in order to obtain data that is usually available by other, and easier, means. If you routinely play with an accomplice, your efforts might be better spent with one of you keeping a "perfect" Insurance Count, and the other, the Regular Count for Bet and Play purposes. Then, only Insure when the Insurance Counter does. Increase/Decrease bets only when the BP Counter does. Then work on your signalling system for Play changes.

I hope this is helpful.

 

[zengrifter]

simple answer...

... its NOT that important to see all the cards before they are turned over... AND it is definetly NOT an effective use of manpower or capital mgmt for two teammates or partners to play 'pure' counting at the same table - no matter what extra gain you get will NOT be superior to the two or more counters playing at seperate tables. zg

 

[SammyBoy]

Thanks ZG!