Are There Any "Ghosts" Out There?

  • Southpaw

    Are There Any "Ghosts" Out There?

    Post deleted

  • Richard Munchkin

     

    30 years ago I was a dealer and part-time floor person. One Halloween night a spooking team came in to the joint and to my pit. The BP was dressed as a pirate, and I swear to you, the spook was dressed, you guessed it as a spook. I couldn’t help but laugh. I got directly into the eye line of the spook, and when he made eye contact with me I just shook my head “no”. He turned around and walked out, the BP played maybe 5 minutes and then left.

    Now I’m sure a bunch of people will jump in here and tell you that spooking is illegal. That is an opinion as far as I know, not a fact. I don’t believe there has ever been a spooking case conviction or even a trial that I am aware of. Bob Nersesian is the guest this week on Gambling With an Edge, and if we get time I will ask him about this.

  • Southpaw

     

    Interesting comments Richard Munchkin. I usually don’t make the guest chat sessions. If you speak with him on this subject, please report back to me.

    Spaw

  • blackriver

     

    Wow I’d be very interested in this. I have no experience with holecarding but I’ve seen plenty of opportunities to spook, this would be easy

  • Richard Munchkin

     

    Southpaw, it is not a chat session. I do a radio show on Thursday nights in Vegas. If you click on either link in my signature you can get more info.

  • Lonesome Gambler

     

    I would be eager to hear Bob’s opinion on this subject.

  • Southpaw

     

    Quote: Richard Munchkin said:
    Southpaw, it is not a chat session. I do a radio show on Thursday nights in Vegas. If you click on either link in my signature you can get more info.

    My bad. I misread your post. I know this site often features guests during its chat sessions, and I assumed that this is what you were talking about.

    Even if “spooking” is not illegal, I think that by using this technique one certainly is taking a very large risk of being backroomed and possibly jailed for a few days by attempting such tactics. I know some genius is going to chime in and say that the same risks apply with CC’ing, but CC’ers are usually dealt with by a tap, and I just don’t see the house dealing with “spookers” so kindly.

    Spaw

  • Wookets

     

    Quote: Lonesome Gambler said:
    I would be eager to hear Bob’s opinion on this subject.

    As would I!

  • Richard Munchkin

     

    One of my favorite quotes from my book was Chip Reese saying,
    “Just because I haven’t done anything wrong doesn’t mean I won’t have to defend myself some day.”

    I think it is quite likely you would be arrested if caught spooking.

  • zengrifter

     

    Quote: Lonesome Gambler said:
    I would be eager to hear Bob’s opinion on this subject.

    ZG’s opinion, while we wait: Spooking is illegal-cheating, in Nevada anyway.

  • paddywhack

     

    Quote: zengrifter said:
    ZG’s opinion, while we wait: Spooking is illegal-cheating, in Nevada anyway.

    Gotta agree with zg on this one.

  • bobstaman

     

    Quote: Richard Munchkin said:
    Now I’m sure a bunch of people will jump in here and tell you that spooking is illegal. That is an opinion as far as I know, not a fact. I don’t believe there has ever been a spooking case conviction or even a trial that I am aware of.

    What have been cases where there was a conviction or trial?

  • zengrifter

     

    Quote: Richard Munchkin said:
    One of my favorite quotes from my book was Chip Reese saying,
    “Just because I haven’t done anything wrong doesn’t mean I won’t have to defend myself some day.”

    That sounds more like Billy Walters. zg

  • zengrifter

     

    Quote: paddywhack said:
    Gotta agree with zg on this one.

    Which one do you NOT agree with? zg

  • zengrifter

     

    Quote: Richard Munchkin said:
    Now I’m sure a bunch of people will jump in here and tell you that spooking is illegal. That is an opinion as far as I know, not a fact. I don’t believe there has ever been a spooking case conviction or even a trial that I am aware of. Bob Nersesian is the guest this week on Gambling With an Edge, and if we get time I will ask him about this.

    Along similar lines, a qualified legal opinion can be rendered that holecarding is an illicit act.
    On the flip side, the Nevada Device Law, ban against hidden computer use, has some shaky Constitutional
    conflicts and has never been sufficiently tested. zg

  • WRX

     

    Quote: zengrifter said:
    ZG’s opinion, while we wait: Spooking is illegal-cheating, in Nevada anyway.

    If Bob Nersesian posted this, I MIGHT give weight to his opinion, based on reputation alone, but I’d probably expect even him to explain his reasoning and the authority on which it was based. When zengrifter says this, I can’t bring myself to attach any importance to it.

  • zengrifter

     

    Quote: WRX said:
    If Bob Nersesian posted this, I MIGHT give weight to his opinion, based on reputation alone, but I’d probably expect even him to explain his reasoning and the authority on which it was based. When zengrifter says this, I can’t bring myself to attach any importance to it.

    I thought that I properly qualified my comment with this —

    Quote: zengrifter said:
    Along similar lines, a qualified legal opinion can be rendered that holecarding is an illicit act.
    On the flip side, the Nevada Device Law, [ostensibly a] ban against hidden computer use, has some shaky Constitutional
    conflicts and has never been sufficiently tested. zg

    My initial opinion was conventional, and I did not read Richard’s observation initially.
    Now I see that spooking MIGHT be “only” a gray area. zg

  • Richard Munchkin

     

    Quote: bobstaman said:
    What have been cases where there was a conviction or trial?

    Well, there have been cases that went to the Supreme Court where they ruled that hole carding is legal. There have been cases brought to trial where they ruled using a hidden computer is illegal.

  • pit15

     

    I’ve stood and stared at ploppies for hours. Sometimes it works and makes them uncomfortable enough to leave, a lot of times it doesn’t. If it’s clear you’re making someone uncomfortable, start standing closer to them.

  • Richard Munchkin

     

    Quote: pit15 said:
    I’ve stood and stared at ploppies for hours. Sometimes it works and makes them uncomfortable enough to leave, a lot of times it doesn’t. If it’s clear you’re making someone uncomfortable, start standing closer to them.

    I think a whole book could be written about what people have done to get a civilian out of a seat.

  • zengrifter

     

    Quote: Richard Munchkin said:
    I think a whole book could be written about what people have done to get a civilian out of a seat.

    I’ve discreetly bought them for a small amount.
    Max Rubin, eulogizing D.V. Cellini, tells of meeting him at a flashing dealer’s table,
    Max already in the money spot first, so Cellini proceeded to vomit on him.
    It worked, Max moved. zg

  • Gamblor

     

    Quote: pit15 said:
    I’ve stood and stared at ploppies for hours. Sometimes it works and makes them uncomfortable enough to leave, a lot of times it doesn’t. If it’s clear you’re making someone uncomfortable, start standing closer to them.

    One time, there was this b*tch of a ploppy, I tried to buy in, but she would spread to two if I tried. She was already going at it with another player at the table, and they were rooting openly for each other to lose. I started joining in and teaming up with the other guy and rooting for her to lose, giving him hi fives when she lost a land, criticizing her play, etc., She left after 10 minutes.

  • Richard Munchkin

     

    During the SARS scare I kept coughing at the table and mentioned that I had just returned from Hong Kong. They cleared out within minutes.

  • zengrifter

     

    Quote: Richard Munchkin said:
    Well, there have been cases that went to the Supreme Court where they ruled that hole carding is legal.

    “Multiple” cases went to the NV Supreme Court? That would make HC etched in stone, I would think…
    But here is an example of casino lawyers STILL making an argument that “intentional” HC is still illegal cheating —

  • Southpaw

     

    Just in case anyone was curious, I returned to this casino and actually found another dealer that was near 100%. Of the two hours I was able to get in against this dealer, I only missed the read twice and relied on the BS for the game in these two cases. During the same evening, I found two other dealers that were about 50%, although someone more experienced would have probably been able to get a better read. (I did not play seriously against these two dealers, only playing them when needed to lock up a seat when the “lucky dealer” was about to return. Play against these dealers was for the minimum bet and included many bathroom / meal breaks).

    So, at this store, I now have 2 dealers that are virtually 100% and 2 that are 50%ish that may become better as my eyes get better.

    Spaw

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