back from vegas,some observations,and questions.

shadroch

Well-Known Member
#1
Four days of playing blackjack downtown left me a bit perplexed.
Are these casinos trying to lose money, and chase away players?Tuesday afternoon,5pm Vegas time,the Vegas club had 1 BJ table open,and a $25 minimum.When I questioned a pb,he said that was the price of playing SD. I pointed out to him that the only DD table was closed,but he wasn't moved.
Even the decisions they make are not consistant.At one point,I forgot to put a bet up and the dealer skipped me by.She made me sit out the remainder of the deck.Not five minutes later,another player who was on a cell phone was allowed to resume after missing a hand.When her first hand resulted in a dealer BJ,another player and I protested and the pb just smiled and said -take your money and play somewhere else in you have a problem.
Later that nite at the DD table,I met the single most annoying player I've ever run across. A scrawny Fillipino looking guy who claimed he hadn't had a job in 30 years and won $200 a nite minimum,every nite.He literally screamed at you if you didn't follow his advice.One hand,I'm at 3B,about halfway thru a DD shoe.Hand before,2 of 5 players busted on 5 cards.This hand,I have 4 cards adding to 16. I look at the board and see 6 or 7 small cards,so I stand.
Of course,the dealer pulls a 4,and the next card would have busted him.Scrawny guy is screaming at me,and gives everyone at the table a free $5 promo chip,since 3B screwed up the flow of the shoe.Three shuffles later he's still pointing out that he's unsure what to do since 3B is so weak and may screw up another hand.BTW-This guy is betting a few bucks on the royal match every hand,and tipping a dollar every time he wins 2 hands in a row,and encouraging everyone to do the same.Soon after,I'd had enough,colored up and told the pb rather loudly that I was leaving because the guy was a jerk.She made me laugh when she said that while I was here for a few days,she had to listen to him almost every night.
Then,I headed for El Cortez,but thats another story....
 
#2
shadroch said:
...halfway thru a DD shoe.Hand before,2 of 5 players busted on 5 cards.This hand,I have 4 cards adding to 16. I look at the board and see 6 or 7 small cards,so I stand.
You didn't say what card the dealer showed or what the count was. zg
 
#3
shadroch said:
Scrawny guy is screaming at me,and gives everyone at the table a free $5 promo chip,since 3B screwed up the flow of the shoe.
I would have told him, "Give me $20 and I'll leave, otherwise I'm going to play even worse!" zg
 
#4
shadroch said:
A scrawny Fillipino looking guy who claimed he hadn't had a job in 30 years and won $200 a nite minimum,every nite.He literally screamed at you if you didn't follow his advice.
I think I know who that is - he has a great act - one of the best APs I've seen downtown! (seriously). zg
 

shadroch

Well-Known Member
#5
zengrifter said:
You didn't say what card the dealer showed or what the count was. zg
I wasn't keeping a real count. Just trying to keep a general plus/minus of the shoe. I had it as negative before the hand and the number of small cards to faces this hand was bigger still. Dealer showed a 7.
While I will give this guy some props for knowing BS,I never saw him raise a bet unless he won 3 hands in a row,and why would any AP bet a 2-1,50Suited K-Q royal match game.Smokes Tareyton like a chimmney?
 
#6
shadroch said:
I wasn't keeping a real count. Just trying to keep a general plus/minus of the shoe. I had it as negative before the hand and the number of small cards to faces this hand was bigger still. Dealer showed a 7.
The correct play was HIT!!! Don't you already know that if you're not counting you need to stick to BS?? The only situation where your observation method 'might' have been correct to stand was 16v.10! Get it together, the scawny asian was correct. :whip: zg
 

shadroch

Well-Known Member
#7
zengrifter said:
The correct play was HIT!!! Don't you already know that if you're not counting you need to stick to BS?? The only situation where your observation method 'might' have been correct to stand was 16v.10! Get it together, the scawny asian was correct. :whip: zg

Please show me where I can get a chart that shows BS for 4 card hands.Obviously ,the math behind a 4 card 16 is different from a two card 16.

Please explain why an AP player would A)flat bet until he wins 3 hands in a row, b)tip, c)play the royal match,d)never take insurance e)play at full tables.
 

ScottH

Well-Known Member
#8
shadroch said:
Please show me where I can get a chart that shows BS for 4 card hands.Obviously ,the math behind a 4 card 16 is different from a two card 16.

Please explain why an AP player would A)flat bet until he wins 3 hands in a row, b)tip, c)play the royal match,d)never take insurance e)play at full tables.
You need a much more positive count to stand with a 16 vs 7 than a 16 vs 10. Sometimes you can just use your intuition for close plays like 16 vs 10, but if you're not counting you wouldn't deviate from BS on 16 vs 7.
 
Last edited:

Sonny

Well-Known Member
#9
shadroch said:
Please show me where I can get a chart that shows BS for 4 card hands.Obviously ,the math behind a 4 card 16 is different from a two card 16.
Not really. The standard BS charts take into account 4-card hands. They considers all possible hands, so even a 12-card hand will still follow the appropriate BS chart (unless the count tells you otherwise). If you want to know when to deviate from BS then you should learn to count, otherwise you are better off sticking with BS.

shadroch said:
Please explain why an AP player would A)flat bet until he wins 3 hands in a row,
Maybe he was waiting for a very high count to raise his bets. That would reduce the variance quite a bit and would allow him to make large bets with a limited bankroll. Maybe he was just using it as cover, similar to Revere‘s “only raise your bet after a win“ system.

shadroch said:
For cover.

shadroch said:
c)play the royal match,
Because it is beatable.

shadroch said:
d)never take insurance
For cover, although there are much better ways to use insurance as cover. Never taking insurance is very unusual, unless the count never got high enough.

shadroch said:
e)play at full tables.
Cover, backcounting, team play/signals, front loading, tracking/sequencing/steering strategy, who knows. There are a lot of reasons a smart player might want a certain number of players at the table.

I don’t know the guy you are talking about and I’m certainly not trying to stick up for him here. I just wanted to give an idea of why a smart player might use unorthodox techniques to improve his win rate.

-Sonny-
 

E-town-guy

Well-Known Member
#10
shadroch said:
Please explain why an AP player would A)flat bet until he wins 3 hands in a row, b)tip, c)play the royal match,d)never take insurance e)play at full tables.
Its possible he was not who zg thought and therefore not an AP.
 
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