Banned

[Nawlins08]

Hi guys,
I was recently asked to leave (and told not to come back) from several casinos in New Orleans over the course of 1 month. It all started after being caught at Treasure Chest. One week later Boomtown asked me to leave, and then about 2 weeks after that I was told to leave Harrahs. Now, I had played for well over 6 months probably around 50-75 times at Harrahs before this incident. So, I assume that they got word from the other casinos in the area. Do u guys think I will be tossed out of casinos in Vegas now as well? Is there still a "griffin" book? Or is it probably just the casinos around New Orleans share info? Also, I am a diamond member at Harrahs, so i am now concerned that i wont be able to get rooms comped at harrahs casinos in Vegas like i used to...what do u guys think?

Any advice or ideas are appreciated!!

PS In all these instances I was counting cards...although they never would say that when they asked me to leave.

 

[moo321]

Umm... how were you playing? Were you spreading 1-10 on double deck for 5 hours at a time?

 

[Nawlins08]

ok sorry let me explain this a little more:

at all these places i played shoe games (6 decks when available, 8 decks at harrahs). i played generally 5, 10 or 15 mins. And yes, I sometimes had big spreads. (1-10 or more).

Basically, the guys at treasure chest tried to back room me and then when i told them i didnt have to go with them they said ok but if u ever come back we will charge u with criminal trespassing (can this really happen?). the guys at boomtown just told me to leave. and the guys at harrahs told me i cant come back (after i prodded they said i could be arrested if i come back).

 

[moo321]

ok sorry let me explain this a little more:

at all these places i played shoe games (6 decks when available, 8 decks at harrahs). i played generally 5, 10 or 15 mins. And yes, I sometimes had big spreads. (1-10 or more).

Basically, the guys at treasure chest tried to back room me and then when i told them i didnt have to go with them they said ok but if u ever come back we will charge u with criminal trespassing (can this really happen?). the guys at boomtown just told me to leave. and the guys at harrahs told me i cant come back (after i prodded they said i could be arrested if i come back).

Yes, if they tell you you're not welcome you can be arrested for trespassing.

If you weren't playing black chips, you have to be doing something that gave you away. Do you move your lips when you count, make "21" jokes, or do anything else that would give it away?

 

[Nawlins08]

well i actually was playing black chips when i was at treasure chest. i made a 100 $ bet that turned into 500 after getting dealt three 2s, and splitting, and then having to double on two of them. i caught a lot of heat for that (at a ten dollar table). that was the first time i got caught. the other times involved mostly green chips. obviously, betting like that can get u caught. but does being banned from one harrahs casino mean i am banned from their other properties in diff cities?

 

[moo321]

well i actually was playing black chips when i was at treasure chest. i made a 100 $ bet that turned into 500 after getting dealt three 2s, and splitting, and then having to double on two of them. i caught a lot of heat for that (at a ten dollar table). that was the first time i got caught. the other times involved mostly green chips. obviously, betting like that can get u caught. but does being banned from one harrahs casino mean i am banned from their other properties in diff cities?

If you were playing rated, it means the player's card is no good. You can play unrated.

 

[EasyRhino]

Harrah's corp will probably still send you marketing offers for a year or two, which you can still use at other properties.

But one would expect that handing a floorman your player's card would raise a few red flags at any property.

The real pity is that 1-10 spread isn't even that hot on shoe games.

 

[EyeHeartHalves]

Lol

Umm... how were you playing? Were you spreading 1-10 on double deck for 5 hours at a time?

I only got 86'd once in my life and that was exactly what I did!--stupid!

It's my understanding that if any property sends you a current mailer, inviting you to said property, you are "innocent" of trespassing because that mailer acts as a "written invitation" and thus, makes any previous "trespass warning" null and void.

But take that with a grain of salt--I'm not an attorney.

 

[FLASH1296]

" ... but if u ever come back we will charge u with criminal trespassing (can this really happen?)"

YES, they can arrest you, but it is actually a bit worse than that.
If you return at any time in the future they realize that before they have you hauled off by the local constabulary they can detain you and harass you for hours on end, as they have video proof that you are on premises in violation of the law.

I have been trespassed several times in several states.
It is NOT a pleasant experience, I assure you.

You are now barred system-wide, not just locally.

Your big mistake was the Black Chip play in a sawdust joint; but I am willing to bet that you played far too many hours.

 

[UK-21]

It's my understanding that if any property sends you a current mailer, inviting you to said property, you are "innocent" of trespassing because that mailer acts as a "written invitation" and thus, makes any previous "trespass warning" null and void.

But take that with a grain of salt--I'm not an attorney.

That's a very interesting point. If you're '86d you haven't actually committed any act of civil trespass at that stage. If you receive a written invitation in the post to visit the site and engage in playing cards, would it then be a case of unlawful detention if you were "back-roomed" prior to be handed over to the police on grounds of having committed a civil trespass?

How could an organisation justify a detention when they themselves had invited you onto their property? In such a case, would the police take you into custody on seeing a personally addressed mailer, or instruct the casino to allow you to leave? If you were to explain you would sue for false arrest on the grounds you're there on invitation, would they bottle it and allow you to leave. If the police didn't make the arrest, would that then be evidence that there was no grounds for being detained in the first place?

In the UK this would never happen of course.

 

[EyeHeartHalves]

In the UK this would never happen of course.

Neither in NJ. NV has a hotel law that says that a hotel/saloon/casino owner could kick out a patron with the threat of trespass charges upon the patron's return as long as it's not in vioulation of the Civil Rights Acts. Casino owners in NJ do not have that right.

 

[squeeks]

Correct me if I am comprehending this wrong, but I thought that if a pit critter or another casino enployee just asked you to leave you just leave and then you can still come back without being in violation of the law. Only when a casino enployee reads you the trustpast act would you be prohibited by law to enter that casino again.
correct?

 

[ihate17]

They said they read it, you said they did not, you are arrested!!!

Correct me if I am comprehending this wrong, but I thought that if a pit critter or another casino enployee just asked you to leave you just leave and then you can still come back without being in violation of the law. Only when a casino enployee reads you the trustpast act would you be prohibited by law to enter that casino again.
correct?

Your word against the casino's and at least in Nevada that means you are lying.

 

[EyeHeartHalves]

Correct me if I am comprehending this wrong, but I thought that if a pit critter or another casino enployee just asked you to leave you just leave and then you can still come back without being in violation of the law. Only when a casino enployee reads you the trustpast act would you be prohibited by law to enter that casino again.
correct?

I would assume that you are correct but this guy's saying that he was told not to come back by some casinos and simply told to leave by another casino. But still, I see what you're saying--you would think they would have to read him the trespass act for that state so that it would be formal notice?

 

[FLASH1296]

"Facts on the Ground"

Having been trespassed in two states (and backed-off from practically everywhere else) I can tell you that they read you the "trespass act" (actually the local legal statute) in front of witnesses (and cameras) and then direct you to sign a form acknowledging that you have been read it.

If you refuse to sign, security goons and/or others will sign - attesting to the fact that you have been read the appropriate section of the state law.

They cannot have you put behind bars without a documented record of this occurence - BUT it is not all that hard to have someone charged with disorderly conduct or some such misdemeanor. In general casinos will NOT do that simply because it can create a "scene" and negative publicity.

 

[callipygian]

It's my understanding that if any property sends you a current mailer, inviting you to said property, you are "innocent" of trespassing because that mailer acts as a "written invitation" and thus, makes any previous "trespass warning" null and void.

Given how police are much more likely to take the word of a reputable casino manager over some scum he's trying to kick out, it's more likely they would declare your current mailer to be null and void in light of your prior banning.

In any case, though, the casino will have probable cause to detain you, and the police will have probable cause to arrest you. Arguing the finer points of the law with the police is futile - it's not their job to convict you, it's their job to arrest you, and they arrest based on probable cause. It may be that you will be exonerated in a court of law, but chances are your gaming session is over whether you will eventually be found guilty or not guilty.

 

[Nawlins08]

well thanks for everyone's input. I was never read anything at any of these places, nor was i ever asked to sign anything. Regardless, I'm gonna hold off on going back to any of the places for awhile. As someone mentioned above, I think my big mistake was playin black chips at some sh*thole casino where i kinda stuck out (i.e. younger than most of the people there).

Anyway, Im goin to some places in Biloxi this weekend. I will let u guys know if I get tossed out of those places as well.

Livin the dream, babyyyyy!!!

 

[moo321]

well thanks for everyone's input. I was never read anything at any of these places, nor was i ever asked to sign anything. Regardless, I'm gonna hold off on going back to any of the places for awhile. As someone mentioned above, I think my big mistake was playin black chips at some sh*thole casino where i kinda stuck out (i.e. younger than most of the people there).

Anyway, Im goin to some places in Biloxi this weekend. I will let u guys know if I get tossed out of those places as well.

Livin the dream, babyyyyy!!!

You may need to work on your act too. Put on some nicer clothes, try to blend in with the other people.

 

[Diver]

You may need to work on your act too. Put on some nicer clothes, try to blend in with the other people.

In some venues, that could mean getting a John Deer cap, flannel shirt and down vest

 

[Billy C1]

In some venues, that could mean getting a John Deer cap, flannel shirt and down vest

But there's a chance those people know how to spell John Deere.

Billy C1