Etiquette on loaning chips

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UnevenSeven

Active Member
#1
#1
Hi I was wondering what the etiquette was on loaning chips.

This young lady had 8,8 vs. 6 but it was her last chip. I tossed her a chip to split and she got another 8 on one. I tossed her another chip to split and she got another 8 on that. I tossed another and she got another 8 on that! Tossed her another so she could split, then got a 3 on one of those 8's. Tossed her another to double that one.

Anyway, dealer busted.

How should the winnings be split? Or even better, how should I have approached the situation?

Thanks
 
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BMDD

Well-Known Member
#2
#2
You should keep all your bets and all wins on those bets. She got the advantage of starting with 8 instead of 16.
 
D

Diver

Well-Known Member
#4
#4
Loan

You need to establish immediately if you are providing a loan or making a play on the cards she can't. A loan implies you will get paid back (plus "interest" of some amount, in this case depending on whether the hands win or lose). If you are making a play on her hands, then she owes you nothing if the hands lose and isn't entitled to anything if you win, however it should be clear whether or not you would share any of your winnings with her for giving you the opportunity. Never a good idea to enter into a financial transaction without all parties being clear about the terms.
 
Automatic Monkey

Automatic Monkey

Banned
#5
#5
Diver said:
You need to establish immediately if you are providing a loan or making a play on the cards she can't. A loan implies you will get paid back (plus "interest" of some amount, in this case depending on whether the hands win or lose). If you are making a play on her hands, then she owes you nothing if the hands lose and isn't entitled to anything if you win, however it should be clear whether or not you would share any of your winnings with her for giving you the opportunity. Never a good idea to enter into a financial transaction without all parties being clear about the terms.
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Yes I've gotten screwed like that in an identical situation where the bets won and the "lady" simply handed me back my cheques. Remember that ploppies do not see what is going on at the table anything like the way we do and do not consider this a profit-making opportunity.
 
SleightOfHand

SleightOfHand

Well-Known Member
#6
#6
Automatic Monkey said:
Yes I've gotten screwed like that in an identical situation where the bets won and the "lady" simply handed me back my cheques. Remember that ploppies do not see what is going on at the table anything like the way we do and do not consider this a profit-making opportunity.
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My last visit in FW, I gave a lady only put $15 on a $25 MP. Seeing this, I jumped at the opportunity to put in the additional $10 which she accepted. "We" won, but after the hand got paid, she didn't give me anything! I had to say something, and she gave me my original bet back. I had to argue for like 3 minutes just to get the 1:1 winnings, and didn't even get the MP portion.
 
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BMDD

Well-Known Member
#7
#7
Automatic Monkey said:
Remember that ploppies do not see what is going on at the table anything like the way we do and do not consider this a profit-making opportunity.
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Absolutely. For this reason I avoid most potentially profitable scavenger opportunities unless the conditions are obvious and made clear. If you do have to debate, you may be drawing unwanted attention.
 
M

Meistro

Well-Known Member
#8
#8
Yeah I have gotten screwed A LOT on scavenger plays, and just in general hustled and stolen from by random degenerates. Generally you are safe when they are doubling for less and you fill in the amount and if you are on great terms with someone (laughing, you are both winning money, a good back and forth) you might want to consider it. The thing you have to remember is getting screwed even once in a while just kills your +EV. Also iron out the terms before you pass the money over.
 
T

tripsix

Well-Known Member
#9
#9
Make it completely clear!

A guy was steaming, losing and got 2 Aces towards his demise(financially:laugh:.)
I told him I'll buy that and take the first hand of his split, (the TC was high.) He accepted. Dealer made a 21 and killed all hands. Due to my wording, I'm certain would have been paid. He would've been happy to see casino lose money at that point.
If any haggling or anything I would've said forget it and dropped it.
Before that I've loaned a chip to a double and recieved both the loan and win. Since I wasn't clear that time I split the win with the ploppy but learned my lesson at that time.
Scavenging is not glamorous and must be concise and quiet. Take any advantage when you can.
Good luck!
 
B

Blue Efficacy

Well-Known Member
#10
#10
When buying or selling a split ace, it is best to specify which Ace is yours. e.g. I want the diamond, you take the heart, deal?

I have never been burned by scavenger plays, but it is of vital importance you at least develop some degree of rapport with the person first. Unless it is a very obvious split or double and the person is out of money.

Make it clear that you are buying into the hand and thus receive any winnings for your portion of the money.

They certainly could screw you because where I play at, technically you have to "give" them the chips and they have to "give" the winnings back to you. But most people will be honest here if for no other reason than it would make every person in the casino who saw this happen hate them. Note that I am a red chip player, and if you're playing green or higher, the social cost of "stealing" in this situation becomes lower relative to the reward. Just use your best judgment. Even if you do get ripped off sometime, it is very unlikely this will offset the gains of being a scavenger on a regular basis.
 
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