Found a decent game in Reno

R

Reno Dude

Well-Known Member
#1
#1
At ElDorado in Reno they have a game called Super Single Blackjack or something of that nature. It's single deck, double on any first 2 cards and double after split and also has the lucky ladys side bet. Penetration was good. The only down side is Bj pays 6 to 5 but I'd take that trade off to be able to double on first 2 and double after split.
 
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Sonny

Sonny

Well-Known Member
#2
#2
Reno Dude said:
The only down side is Bj pays 6 to 5 but I'd take that trade off to be able to double on first 2 and double after split.
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The DA2 rule will give you an extra 0.13%. The DAS rule gives you another .14%. The 6:5 rule will take away 1.4%. You've increased your disadvantage by about 1.13% by playing this game. Pretty much any other BJ game in town has a lower house edge than that.

-Sonny-
 
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bj bob

bj bob

Well-Known Member
#3
#3
You've gotta be kidding!

Reno Dude said:
At ElDorado in Reno they have a game called Super Single Blackjack or something of that nature. It's single deck, double on any first 2 cards and double after split and also has the lucky ladys side bet. Penetration was good. The only down side is Bj pays 6 to 5 but I'd take that trade off to be able to double on first 2 and double after split.
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You have to lay off those Lefty Luckies. That Super Single Deck crap they have at the El D. is just that--crap.They could even add DAS and LS to those rules and it still wouldn't even come close to a 3:2 BJ payout. Listen closely, by adding DOA the house advantaage decreases by only .26%, by adding DAS, by .14% and even adding S-17, it only drops by .19%. Put all those goodies together and it does'nt even come close to the WHOPPING 1.39% that the 6:5 rule presents.
I have a hard time believing "civilians" would still play this game let alone anyone who has been hanging around this forum for any lenght of time.
 
R

Reno Dude

Well-Known Member
#5
#5
bj bob said:
You have to lay off those Lefty Luckies. That Super Single Deck crap they have at the El D. is just that--crap.They could even add DAS and LS to those rules and it still wouldn't even come close to a 3:2 BJ payout. Listen closely, by adding DOA the house advantaage decreases by only .26%, by adding DAS, by .14% and even adding S-17, it only drops by .19%. Put all those goodies together and it does'nt even come close to the WHOPPING 1.39% that the 6:5 rule presents.
I have a hard time believing "civilians" would still play this game let alone anyone who has been hanging around this forum for any lenght of time.
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I was not aware of the exact percentages. I was going by I seem to get a lot more hands that present the oppertunity to DAS or DA2 compaired to Blackjacks. The lucky ladies I seem to have good luck with in possitive counts.
 
bj bob

bj bob

Well-Known Member
#6
#6
Refocusing

Reno Dude said:
I was not aware of the exact percentages. I was going by I seem to get a lot more hands that present the oppertunity to DAS or DA2 compaired to Blackjacks. The lucky ladies I seem to have good luck with in possitive counts.
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The next time you sit down and play that game try focusing on every twenty first hand that you catch a BJ. Try imagining a $15 payout in front of you instead of that $12 stack you were just paid on a $10 bet, then multiply that $3 difference times 5 (100 hands/hr.) and that will give you a good snap shot of the effect of the 6:5 rule.
 
jimbiggs

jimbiggs

Well-Known Member
#7
#7
I'm also just guessing that the LL side bet will not give much advantage because there are not two queen of hearts in a single deck. I'm wondering though, with good pen, could LL side bet overcome the 6:5 disadvantage? And is backcounting allowed?
 
ihate17

ihate17

Well-Known Member
#8
#8
Enourmous misimpression

DAS, DA2, it all sounds so very great and they are good rules but when compared to blackjack paying 3/2 or 6/5 they are barely significant and here is why I think some civilians get fooled.
They tend to forget that when you get a blackjack you will generally win that hand except for a rare push, but will never lose a hand with a blackjack. At the same time every time you split or double or combine the two, you will definately not win. In fact over time you may win just slightly more of these than you lose and on any given day easily lose more of these than win, resulting in an overall small player advantage that is dwarfed by the disadvantage of 6/5.

Now if you have found a way to win every double and every split, you might be on to something.

ihate17
 
R

Reno Dude

Well-Known Member
#9
#9
ihate17 said:
DAS, DA2, it all sounds so very great and they are good rules but when compared to blackjack paying 3/2 or 6/5 they are barely significant and here is why I think some civilians get fooled.
They tend to forget that when you get a blackjack you will generally win that hand except for a rare push, but will never lose a hand with a blackjack. At the same time every time you split or double or combine the two, you will definately not win. In fact over time you may win just slightly more of these than you lose and on any given day easily lose more of these than win, resulting in an overall small player advantage that is dwarfed by the disadvantage of 6/5.

Now if you have found a way to win every double and every split, you might be on to something.

ihate17
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All very good points. Maybe I was fooled by a run of good luck.
 
P

Paradox

Well-Known Member
#10
#10
Yes you were.

Reno Dude said:
All very good points. Maybe I was fooled by a run of good luck.
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Randomness can produce good results in the very short run, but 6:5 is nearly impossible to overcome unless you are seeing the hole card 100% of the time and use the proper strategy. As the others have pointed out the edge is still 1%. The worst rules that pay 3:2 is much much better than the best rules and 6:5. Consider all 6:5 games carnival games, no matter what the extra rules are.
 
moo321

moo321

Well-Known Member
#11
#11
Paradox said:
Randomness can produce good results in the very short run, but 6:5 is nearly impossible to overcome unless you are seeing the hole card 100% of the time and use the proper strategy. As the others have pointed out the edge is still 1%. The worst rules that pay 3:2 is much much better than the best rules and 6:5. Consider all 6:5 games carnival games, no matter what the extra rules are.
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You don't need 100% hole card info to beat 6:5... More like 20, or 40-50% if it's just a partial flash. With late surrender, it might even be lower.
 
Automatic Monkey

Automatic Monkey

Banned
#12
#12
moo321 said:
You don't need 100% hole card info to beat 6:5... More like 20, or 40-50% if it's just a partial flash. With late surrender, it might even be lower.
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That's correct- the hole card game for 6:5 is almost as good as for 3:2 because when holecarding you don't make your money from naturals. Your biggest gains are actually on your bad hands, when you see the dealer has a stiff too.
 
C

Cardcounter

Well-Known Member
#13
#13
2 blocks away there is a much better game!

2 blocks from the Eldordo there is the Siena that offers much better blackjack rules you can double on any two cards no das but blackjack pays 3:2 for a house advantage of the top of 0.25%! Plus I have a card there and they sent me $50 in match plays each month because I have a level 2 card! Level 1 gets $25 a month! They comp me an average bet every 1 or 2 hours of play! The comps are great and the rules are great at the Siena my favorite casino!
 
R

Reno Dude

Well-Known Member
#15
#15
Cardcounter said:
2 blocks from the Eldordo there is the Siena that offers much better blackjack rules you can double on any two cards no das but blackjack pays 3:2 for a house advantage of the top of 0.25%! Plus I have a card there and they sent me $50 in match plays each month because I have a level 2 card! Level 1 gets $25 a month! They comp me an average bet every 1 or 2 hours of play! The comps are great and the rules are great at the Siena my favorite casino!
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Anyone that has half a clue how to play will get backed off fast as soon as they start to win at Siena.
 
Mimosine

Mimosine

Well-Known Member
#17
#17
moo321 said:
You don't need 100% hole card info to beat 6:5... More like 20, or 40-50% if it's just a partial flash. With late surrender, it might even be lower.
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Seconded and thirded.

100% hole card play adds something on the order of a 10% advantage. correct me if i'm wrong. if that is right than 20% hole carding would overcome a 1.3% house edge. Monkey made the best point, though, why 6:5 makes no difference in a hole card game. well put!
 
C

Cardcounter

Well-Known Member
#18
#18
Siena

At the Siena I have not been backed off yet, maybe the chocolate covered macodemia nuts I gave the pit payed off! However since I have been backed of before I'm a little more concious on how I bet my my hands especially when I see the pit bosses watching closely and I don't always make the same bet of the top. I also heard close to the Siena the Fitgerald is offering the same rules double any two 3:2 single deck I just heard that I haven't played at Fitgerald to confirm that. How much where you betting at the Siena when you got backed off? Yesterday I won $440 without even a look!
 
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