My local casino has a tuesday night special. TRIPLE COMP NIGHT. The comps are pretty good and best of all they are CASHABLE. A $50 avg bet seems to get a player $10/hr. Rough estimation. So triple comp night i can get $30/hr $50avg bet. Here is the problem im running into. They only have two or three tables open all six decks $100 MAX bet. I can only play two hands at the same time. The last few times i went I played it like this 2x 1-4 unit spread play all. Giving me a slight advantage over the house. But all the money im making is in the comps. Next time i go I was think of spreading from 2x50-2x100 play all. 1-2 spread. Now that would give the house a small edge over me. But the comps would be a lot better. What do you guys think i should do? should I increase my spread to 1-20 so i'm playing a lot more profitable BJ game but not getting near the comps?
How should I play this?
- Thread starter Cass
- Start date
A few additional pieces of advice
With comps like that, I would probably flat-bet it with a Wongout if I had sufficient bankroll. But a small spread would work too. Remember you are having a problem up there with being recognized as a counter so being seen as a flat-betting "whale" will be good for your career. Also, they can take your comps away any time they want so you don't want to take chances when they have such power over your money.
Don't forget to count so you play the hands right and Wong out at the right time. This might also be a good time to toke a little bit when the PC is watching. If they don't like you they can and will include your zeros (from Wonging out) in your average but if they do like you they won't bother.
With comps like that, I would probably flat-bet it with a Wongout if I had sufficient bankroll. But a small spread would work too. Remember you are having a problem up there with being recognized as a counter so being seen as a flat-betting "whale" will be good for your career. Also, they can take your comps away any time they want so you don't want to take chances when they have such power over your money.
Don't forget to count so you play the hands right and Wong out at the right time. This might also be a good time to toke a little bit when the PC is watching. If they don't like you they can and will include your zeros (from Wonging out) in your average but if they do like you they won't bother.
A little math here
If you flat bet $100 then you can expect:
$100 x 100 (hands per hour) x –0.005 (house edge) = -$50/hr
But you will be getting $60 in comps so you should be making about $10/hr. That’s not so good. If you take Shadrock’s advice and slow down to 50 hands per hour then:
$100 x 50 x –0.005 = -$25 + $60 comp = $35/hr
Now that’s much better! However, if you can get a decent spread then you can overcome the house edge completely, and maybe even win a little on top of that. It all depends on how much heat you are getting. You could start with $50 bets and spread to 2x$50 and 2x$100 when appropriate, then drop down to $10-$15 when the count tanks and nobody is looking. If nobody is watching, spread like hell!
If they start watching you more closely you can still Wong out of terrible shoes (maybe -4 or more) so that you aren’t eating up too much of your bankroll with those big bets. A little lost EV is fine, but try to limit your losses.
Basically, show them what they want to see – a guy making $50-$100 bets. Don’t show them what they don’t want to see – a guy dropping down to $10-$15 bets. You are playing for comps, buy you can still try to sneak in a good spread whenever possible. And keep you playing nice and sloooooow.
-Sonny-
If you flat bet $100 then you can expect:
$100 x 100 (hands per hour) x –0.005 (house edge) = -$50/hr
But you will be getting $60 in comps so you should be making about $10/hr. That’s not so good. If you take Shadrock’s advice and slow down to 50 hands per hour then:
$100 x 50 x –0.005 = -$25 + $60 comp = $35/hr
Now that’s much better! However, if you can get a decent spread then you can overcome the house edge completely, and maybe even win a little on top of that. It all depends on how much heat you are getting. You could start with $50 bets and spread to 2x$50 and 2x$100 when appropriate, then drop down to $10-$15 when the count tanks and nobody is looking. If nobody is watching, spread like hell!
If they start watching you more closely you can still Wong out of terrible shoes (maybe -4 or more) so that you aren’t eating up too much of your bankroll with those big bets. A little lost EV is fine, but try to limit your losses.Basically, show them what they want to see – a guy making $50-$100 bets. Don’t show them what they don’t want to see – a guy dropping down to $10-$15 bets. You are playing for comps, buy you can still try to sneak in a good spread whenever possible. And keep you playing nice and sloooooow.
-Sonny-
There are so many variables,it's hard to answer,and to be honest,most of my knowledge is second hand,obtained from reading books like The Frugal Gambler series and Comp City.
Most places I've played will give you a buffet/coffe shop comp each day if you play 4 hours or so.But in many places,table game slots can't be banked. Its use them now or lose them.
Most places I've played will give you a buffet/coffe shop comp each day if you play 4 hours or so.But in many places,table game slots can't be banked. Its use them now or lose them.
Tableman
I have been playing BJ on my computer for about 15 years now. I never realized how much training I was doing. I got into an international BJ competition in 2003 and placed 7th in the online competition. BJ is in my opinion a cylclical ramdamess game. To be effective I must make periodic adjustments to my playing. Casinos has added to the complication of playing by adding automated deck shufflers' which can prove to very ineffective or very effective. And unfriendlly deck dealing 13s and 14s and 15s need to be broken up by playing 3 hands for 3 times and reverting back too 1 hand. This adaptive strategy can act as a damper to the cycle of bad hands and the use of the surrender option. Can cut your loses substantially. I have tried very effectively and was able to cut my loses. Don't be afraid to surrender your hand. It's better taking a 50% loss as to a 100% loss. Some time the game is unfriendly all together... Go home. On average a good player can quadruple his/her money. Another good tip practice on your computer every day. When possible. There are good training software avalable on line that can help you traing yourself. Long periods away from the game can also play as a defecit on your ability. Good luck...
I have been playing BJ on my computer for about 15 years now. I never realized how much training I was doing. I got into an international BJ competition in 2003 and placed 7th in the online competition. BJ is in my opinion a cylclical ramdamess game. To be effective I must make periodic adjustments to my playing. Casinos has added to the complication of playing by adding automated deck shufflers' which can prove to very ineffective or very effective. And unfriendlly deck dealing 13s and 14s and 15s need to be broken up by playing 3 hands for 3 times and reverting back too 1 hand. This adaptive strategy can act as a damper to the cycle of bad hands and the use of the surrender option. Can cut your loses substantially. I have tried very effectively and was able to cut my loses. Don't be afraid to surrender your hand. It's better taking a 50% loss as to a 100% loss. Some time the game is unfriendly all together... Go home. On average a good player can quadruple his/her money. Another good tip practice on your computer every day. When possible. There are good training software avalable on line that can help you traing yourself. Long periods away from the game can also play as a defecit on your ability. Good luck...
Tableman
I have been playing BJ on my computer for about 15 years now. I never realized how much training I was doing. I got into an international BJ competition in 2003 and placed 7th in the online competition. BJ is in my opinion a cylclical ramdamess game. To be effective I must make periodic adjustments to my playing. Casinos has added to the complication of playing by adding automated deck shufflers' which can prove to very ineffective or very effective. And unfriendlly deck dealing 13s and 14s and 15s need to be broken up by playing 3 hands for 3 times and reverting back too 1 hand. This adaptive strategy can act as a damper to the cycle of bad hands and the use of the surrender option. Can cut your loses substantially. I have tried very effectively and was able to cut my loses. Don't be afraid to surrender your hand. It's better taking a 50% loss as to a 100% loss. Some time the game is unfriendly all together... Go home. On average a good player can quadruple his/her money. Another good tip practice on your computer every day. When possible. There are good training software avalable on line that can help you train yourself. Long periods away from the game can also play as a defecit on your ability. Good luck...
I have been playing BJ on my computer for about 15 years now. I never realized how much training I was doing. I got into an international BJ competition in 2003 and placed 7th in the online competition. BJ is in my opinion a cylclical ramdamess game. To be effective I must make periodic adjustments to my playing. Casinos has added to the complication of playing by adding automated deck shufflers' which can prove to very ineffective or very effective. And unfriendlly deck dealing 13s and 14s and 15s need to be broken up by playing 3 hands for 3 times and reverting back too 1 hand. This adaptive strategy can act as a damper to the cycle of bad hands and the use of the surrender option. Can cut your loses substantially. I have tried very effectively and was able to cut my loses. Don't be afraid to surrender your hand. It's better taking a 50% loss as to a 100% loss. Some time the game is unfriendly all together... Go home. On average a good player can quadruple his/her money. Another good tip practice on your computer every day. When possible. There are good training software avalable on line that can help you train yourself. Long periods away from the game can also play as a defecit on your ability. Good luck...
Say what?! :laugh:
You mean making hunch plays. These “periodic adjustments” are also known as “guesses” and they will hurt you more often than they help you. Following such superstitious beliefs will cost you money.
I like the sound of that “adaptive strategy” approach. It sounds so legitimate, just like “scientific trend analysis.” Unfortunately, neither system has been proven. There is no basis behind the old “flow of the cards” nonsense. There is also no evidence that switching between multiple hands will “dampen” anything, or that a “cycle of bad hands” even exists. That is just more superstition. Perhaps they would not be “bad hands” if you played proper basic strategy.
Sure, but don’t be too anxious to surrender either. If you surrender too many hands then your profit will suffer. Again, stick to the correct basic strategy. Making emotional playing decisions will cost you money – no question.
We don’t generally categorize games as “friendly” or “unfriendly” here. We prefer to look at them as “profitable” or “unprofitable” based on the cards left to be dealt. I have made money from numerous “unfriendly” games. I don’t care how “pleasant” a game is, I only care about how profitable it is. I never leave if there is still money to be made.
There definitely are. And the software always makes the correct decision without falling for hunches or “adaptive” strategies. Perhaps you have been using them improperly…
Ditto.
-Sonny-
P.S. - What does this have to do with comps?
You mean making hunch plays. These “periodic adjustments” are also known as “guesses” and they will hurt you more often than they help you. Following such superstitious beliefs will cost you money.
I like the sound of that “adaptive strategy” approach. It sounds so legitimate, just like “scientific trend analysis.” Unfortunately, neither system has been proven. There is no basis behind the old “flow of the cards” nonsense. There is also no evidence that switching between multiple hands will “dampen” anything, or that a “cycle of bad hands” even exists. That is just more superstition. Perhaps they would not be “bad hands” if you played proper basic strategy.
Sure, but don’t be too anxious to surrender either. If you surrender too many hands then your profit will suffer. Again, stick to the correct basic strategy. Making emotional playing decisions will cost you money – no question.
We don’t generally categorize games as “friendly” or “unfriendly” here. We prefer to look at them as “profitable” or “unprofitable” based on the cards left to be dealt. I have made money from numerous “unfriendly” games. I don’t care how “pleasant” a game is, I only care about how profitable it is. I never leave if there is still money to be made.
There definitely are. And the software always makes the correct decision without falling for hunches or “adaptive” strategies. Perhaps you have been using them improperly…
Ditto.
-Sonny-
P.S. - What does this have to do with comps?
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