New Double Deck game in WV

O

OneAngryDwarf

Member
#1
#1
Hello all,

Anyone else head to northern WV casinos lately/frequently? Went to Wheeling Island today on a lark and noticed a new 2-deck BJ game. Floor said they just added it today. Was pleasantly surprised to see it has the exact same rules as their regular 8-deck games (3:2, S17, no doubling restrictions, resplit to three), hopefully it will stay that way and they're not just waiting for a new layout or something.

The downside, of course, is terrible penetration--about 1 whole deck's worth, from what I can tell. I can't imagine this being very profitable since each shoe only lasts about 4 hands (with a full table) and the dealer must then do a lengthy hand shuffle each time. Nonetheless, I thought I'd get everyone's opinion, is this still worth playing compared to their regular shoe games (typically about 1 1/2 decks penetration)?

This is my first post, by the way. Like a lot of you folks (I assume) I am a casual basic strategy player who recently got sick of losing and decided to learn counting. I'm still very much a novice but I'm willing to learn and I'm glad to be here!
 
C

cc218

Well-Known Member
#2
#2
I can't say for sure if it is good or not, i'll leave that up to the mathletes on here. Regardless though, it is nice to see something besides 8 deckers. What were the min and max bets on that game?
 
creeping panther

creeping panther

Banned
#3
#3
Dwarf

OneAngryDwarf said:
Hello all,

Anyone else head to northern WV casinos lately/frequently? Went to Wheeling Island today on a lark and noticed a new 2-deck BJ game. Floor said they just added it today. Was pleasantly surprised to see it has the exact same rules as their regular 8-deck games (3:2, S17, no doubling restrictions, resplit to three), hopefully it will stay that way and they're not just waiting for a new layout or something.

The downside, of course, is terrible penetration--about 1 whole deck's worth, from what I can tell. I can't imagine this being very profitable since each shoe only lasts about 4 hands (with a full table) and the dealer must then do a lengthy hand shuffle each time. Nonetheless, I thought I'd get everyone's opinion, is this still worth playing compared to their regular shoe games (typically about 1 1/2 decks penetration)?

This is my first post, by the way. Like a lot of you folks (I assume) I am a casual basic strategy player who recently got sick of losing and decided to learn counting. I'm still very much a novice but I'm willing to learn and I'm glad to be here!
Click to expand...
Play heads up only, be very skilled and aggressive.

CP
 
Automatic Monkey

Automatic Monkey

Banned
#4
#4
OneAngryDwarf said:
Hello all,

Anyone else head to northern WV casinos lately/frequently? Went to Wheeling Island today on a lark and noticed a new 2-deck BJ game. Floor said they just added it today. Was pleasantly surprised to see it has the exact same rules as their regular 8-deck games (3:2, S17, no doubling restrictions, resplit to three), hopefully it will stay that way and they're not just waiting for a new layout or something.

The downside, of course, is terrible penetration--about 1 whole deck's worth, from what I can tell. I can't imagine this being very profitable since each shoe only lasts about 4 hands (with a full table) and the dealer must then do a lengthy hand shuffle each time. Nonetheless, I thought I'd get everyone's opinion, is this still worth playing compared to their regular shoe games (typically about 1 1/2 decks penetration)?

This is my first post, by the way. Like a lot of you folks (I assume) I am a casual basic strategy player who recently got sick of losing and decided to learn counting. I'm still very much a novice but I'm willing to learn and I'm glad to be here!
Click to expand...
If the DD shoe lasts 4 rounds with a full table, the pen is better than 1 deck. Way better. How many DD tables do they have?
 
FLASH1296

FLASH1296

Well-Known Member
#5
#5

IF you use a powerful Level Two Count like Hi-Opt or AO II, Halves,
the game is profitable with a 4 to 1 spread with the good rules.

Play this with one other player or heads-up only !

I would not tackle this game with a Level One Count like Hi-Lo, K.O., etc.
and an unbalanced count is ridiculous to even consider for this game

Note that I mean barely profitable with such a tight spread, and while I have not
run the numbers, I imagine that it would yield perhaps 1.5 units per hour or less.
 
Last edited:
moo321

moo321

Well-Known Member
#6
#6
OneAngryDwarf said:
Hello all,

Anyone else head to northern WV casinos lately/frequently? Went to Wheeling Island today on a lark and noticed a new 2-deck BJ game. Floor said they just added it today. Was pleasantly surprised to see it has the exact same rules as their regular 8-deck games (3:2, S17, no doubling restrictions, resplit to three), hopefully it will stay that way and they're not just waiting for a new layout or something.

The downside, of course, is terrible penetration--about 1 whole deck's worth, from what I can tell. I can't imagine this being very profitable since each shoe only lasts about 4 hands (with a full table) and the dealer must then do a lengthy hand shuffle each time. Nonetheless, I thought I'd get everyone's opinion, is this still worth playing compared to their regular shoe games (typically about 1 1/2 decks penetration)?

This is my first post, by the way. Like a lot of you folks (I assume) I am a casual basic strategy player who recently got sick of losing and decided to learn counting. I'm still very much a novice but I'm willing to learn and I'm glad to be here!
Click to expand...
Hey, maybe the other casinos in the area will get double deck too! And maybe they'll comp more than 8 cents an hour in the poker room! (not exagerating on that, either).
 
FLASH1296

FLASH1296

Well-Known Member
#7
#7
moo321,

You said: "maybe the other casinos in the area will get double deck ..."

Errrr ... I could not agree more, but what casinos are in the area ?
 
creeping panther

creeping panther

Banned
#9
#9
Flash

FLASH1296 said:

IF you use a powerful Level Two Count like Hi-Opt or AO II, Halves,
the game is profitable with a 4 to 1 spread with the good rules.

Play this with one other player or heads-up only !

I would not tackle this game with a Level One Count like Hi-Lo, K.O., etc.
and an unbalanced count is ridiculous to even consider for this game

Note that I mean barely profitable with such a tight spread, and while I have not
run the numbers, I imagine that it would yield perhaps 1.5 units per hour or less.
Click to expand...
I am just a level one kinda guy, who uses an ace side on DD. Hi-Lo-Lo.

I have played with skilled AP's using level 2 counts and there was basically no difference at all, in fact I would say I did better than the others.

Maybe sometime you and I will be at the same DD table and we will see who comes out on top, a lowly level 1 guy.. or you, the Master of the Level 2's.:)

CP
 
C

cc218

Well-Known Member
#12
#12
FLASH1296 said:
moo321,

You said: "maybe the other casinos in the area will get double deck ..."

Errrr ... I could not agree more, but what casinos are in the area ?
Click to expand...
in that area you would also have Mountaineer close by so that could create some decent competition between the 2 of them.
 
F

farookhbj

Active Member
#14
#14
re:

Actually, the penetration seems to vary. When I was there, the dealer dealt through the whole shoe and had to do the shuffle procedure on the discards to finish the hand. Granted, it was a mistake. On average, it's close to 70 %.
 
A

Albee

Well-Known Member
#15
#15
How many 2-deck tables?

Is there one, two or more double deck tables there?

Do they have them open all the time, or do they close them when it slows down?

Cards dealt up or down?

how was the heat??
 
F

farookhbj

Active Member
#17
#17
re:

They currently have 2 tables running during the week. I haven't been there during the weekend. Table limits are $5-300. For the past couple weeks, they have been open all throughout the day during the week. Cards are dealt from a shoe like a traditional shoe game. S17, DAS, Double any 2 cards. The heat from what I can tell is non existent. People obviously aren't used to DD games. Most I talked to didn't like it because it "messed with the flow" due to the constant shuffling. Some dealers are telling the players it's a bad game and were complaining about having to shuffle after a few hands.. I didn't notice any heat whatsoever. Only heat I saw was on the poor dealers who weren't used to dealing a DD game and were making mistakes.
 
Sharky

Sharky

Well-Known Member
#18
#18
Albee said:
Is there one, two or more double deck tables there?

Do they have them open all the time, or do they close them when it slows down?

Cards dealt up or down?

how was the heat??
Click to expand...
2 games, mostly full...difficult to sit on w/e and forget backcounting or 2 positions - pit expects (demands) you to let another waiting player vs. playing 2 spots.

Cards are up and there IS some heat...pit will tell dealers to cut "at least half the cards OUT". Sometimes they will only deal 2 rounds then shuffle, regardless of the cut card if they are suspicious of you.

Overall, the good rules are offset by the weak pen and low max ($300) to make any serious dough.

Fun to play though as there are some of the WORST bj players I have ever saw...yet they tell me how I played wrong and cost the table...LOL too F@%#$ funny.

I have yet to play w/ someone who understands the diff between a 2 deck and 8 deck strategy. They all pull out those color coded cards...like bringing a knife to a gun battle!!!

I told one cat, wearing a golf shirt, that him telling me how to play BJ is like him telling Tiger Woods how play golf.

I have made $$ there, but not worth the drive for me. Weak comps to boot!!!
 
Sharky

Sharky

Well-Known Member
#20
#20
FLASH1296 said:
Have you actually heard a pit critter instruct a dealer to cut off 50% ?
Click to expand...
Plenty, they whisper into the dealers ear from behind...but often the dealer will say "cut over half the cards?!??!!" aloud..which is funny. I have had relief dealer come to the table and the current dealer will say "you have to see the pit b4 you can deal here".

Also, the first time I experienced the 2 round reshuffle I mentioned to the dealer that the cut card hasn't come out yet and she said she was under a "directive". WTF??
 
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