PA table games

#1
Apparently they finally signed it into law for table games at what were formerly just "slot parlors" in Pennsylvania a few days ago. I heard that it will take approximately six months to have (table games) up and running, according to a local radio news broadcast. The New Jersey based news broadcast also brought up the point of "Further woes for already ailing Atlantic City casinos".

You have to wonder which path will be taken on the part of the casinos concerned due to increased competition, gouging for higher house advantage across the board or making the casinos more "player friendly"? I know that seeing H17 tables is enough to turn me away and go to the next casino... it's only .22% additional house advantage, right? Doesn't sound like much? Well, it's a LOT. It's enough... it's enough to show me that the casino is out for blood and wants to "fleece 'em for all it's worth"!

If people boycotted H17, CSM's and 6:5 blackjack payouts they would cease to exist, only a matter of time. People are stupid and line up all day long to play this garbage and lose their ass though! It amazes me. Harrah's casinos must put something in the drinks to help people along with being as stupid as is humanly possible. Will they be able to continue to offer such crummy blackjack in a more competitive market?

The flip side of the coin is casinos having lots of very full, very busy blackjack tables and taking a HUGE volume of business away from all the others. It's quite easy! Offer 6 decks or less, S17, 3:2, hand-shuffled games with one deck cut off and then advertise that you offer the best blackjack available in the region because you certainly wouldn't be lying with Harrah's casinos all over! Harrah's AC even has autoshufflers in the $100 min. pit... amazing... but they also have lots of dealers standing there with no players at those tables and both thumbs jammed deep into their anus most of the time in that pit.

Harrah's owned casinos rely upon people being too stupid to know the difference and owning a large enough number of the casinos to control all that goes on. I recall Harrah's "buying out blitz" in which they bought out Caesar's, Bally's, Claridge, Showboat and appeared to have every intent of buying out every casino in AC! Was that the plan? "We own it ALL so we control it all, therefore we can alter the rules of the game to our liking and have no competition... our H17 and 6:5 will be the only game in town so those suckers will have no choice! I KNOW (at the marketing meeting)... let's put a big sign out there over the table that says A WHOPPING 6:5 PAYOUT ON BLACKJACK." (See my post on how marketing meetings go).

Many years ago there were far fewer casinos with much more playable blackjack games. Corporate greed combined with exponentional growth and gains of the gaming industry have made it such that now you must "shop around" carefully to find a playable blackjack game since the game varies so greatly from place to place. Business was so damn good in recent years that you could offer a crummy game and gouge out more HA from a huge volume of people willing to gamble frivolously and that were either just too stupid to know the difference or didn't care. There was no shortage of willing players no matter what the rules of the game. Will the economic situation and increased competition change all that? Will the game of blackjack revert back to having more "player friendly" rules like it did years ago due to increased competition? I think it will... either that or we will have some huge, gutted out and condemned buildings that used to be casinos. I hope Harrah's goes first... a little payback for their cute little rule changes in recent years.

What about those 80 year old slot junkies? As they croak off their children, pissed off about watching their ancient parents pissing away all the inheritance money will likely know better than to spend too much time pumping bills into the money-eating electronic devices. Those have no CHOICE but to become more player friendly... AC has already lost a lot of slot players with PA players playing in these slot parlors popping up in PA and they are building more of them.

While on the subject of slots, which I actually know little or nothing about, I see these things posted all over about "Loosest slots in Atlantic City" in MULTIPLE casinos so---SOMEONE's lying! Just WHO determines this "loosest slot" thing? Is this another marketing meeting staff thing to show to anyone with half a brain that with a whacko statement like that someone is absolutely full of sh*t because 10 out of 12 total casinos claim to have "the loosest slots in Atlantic City"?
 
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Blue Efficacy

Well-Known Member
#2
You do know that H17 is still better than almost all other casino games, right? Sure, it isn't optimal, but no need to call people stupid for playing them.

Remember, a lot of people are out to be entertained, not eke out a 1-2% advantage.
 
#3
Fun fun fun!

I did bring up the possibility of people not CARING about additional house advantage... "money to blow" "money is no object" in there. I see your point, Blue... so go play some H17, CSM's and 6:5 and... "have fun"!
 

shadroch

Well-Known Member
#4
A father and son are walking thru the jungle. Suddenly an angry tiger leaps up and rushs them. The son turns and starts to run. "Are you crazy" asks his father, "we can't outrun a tiger".
Son yells back" I don't have to outrun the tiger, just have to outrun you".

Why offer a good game when your competitors offer crap? Just be less crappy and you're set.
Do you believe 98% of the potential players know or care if the BJ table is H17 or S17. You'll be lucky if some genius in Harrisburg doesn't decide to stick an ante onto every hand to raise even more revenue for the state.
 

Thunder

Well-Known Member
#5
I spoke to one ploppie today and asked him why he wanted to play at Bally's given their garbage games. He says, I prefer the 8 deckers since there isn't as much shuffling. As long as people think like that, well the casinos will be fine lol.
 

daddybo

Well-Known Member
#6
shadroch said:
A father and son are walking thru the jungle. Suddenly an angry tiger leaps up and rushs them. The son turns and starts to run. "Are you crazy" asks his father, "we can't outrun a tiger".
Son yells back" I don't have to outrun the tiger, just have to outrun you".

Why offer a good game when your competitors offer crap? Just be less crappy and you're set.
Do you believe 98% of the potential players know or care if the BJ table is H17 or S17. You'll be lucky if some genius in Harrisburg doesn't decide to stick an ante onto every hand to raise even more revenue for the state.
Shadroch makes a very good point... The real need is to educate John Q Public on The Stupid things not to do in a Casino... They need to know the proper decisions to make regarding which store to play.. the reasons they shouldn't chose the scam stores. They need to know the proper decisions on which games to play and why.

The only way to change the stores is to make the everyday consumer more knowledgeable.
 
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21forme

Well-Known Member
#7
Thunder said:
I spoke to one ploppie today and asked him why he wanted to play at Bally's given their garbage games. He says, I prefer the 8 deckers since there isn't as much shuffling. As long as people think like that, well the casinos will be fine lol.
You were talking to one of the casino execs during his break :laugh:
 
#8
Tarzan said:
I did bring up the possibility of people not CARING about additional house advantage... "money to blow" "money is no object" in there. I see your point, Blue... so go play some H17, CSM's and 6:5 and... "have fun"!
That's about it. They do not care, and all the education in the world won't help with that class of gambler that has been generated by today's casinos.

So our best move is to disguise ourselves as them and play 6:5, H17 and CSM... with an advantage!
 

Blue Efficacy

Well-Known Member
#11
H17, while less than optimal, should not be placed in the same class as 6:5 and CSMs. I play some games that are quite good despite the dealer hitting soft 17.
 

Kasi

Well-Known Member
#12
Tarzan said:
Apparently they finally signed it into law for table games at what were formerly just "slot parlors" in Pennsylvania a few days ago. I heard that it will take approximately six months to have (table games) up and running, according to a local radio news broadcast. The New Jersey based news broadcast also brought up the point of "Further woes for already ailing Atlantic City casinos".

You have to wonder which path will be taken on the part of the casinos concerned due to increased competition, gouging for higher house advantage across the board or making the casinos more "player friendly"? I know that seeing H17 tables is enough to turn me away and go to the next casino... it's only .22% additional house advantage, right? Doesn't sound like much? Well, it's a LOT. It's enough... it's enough to show me that the casino is out for blood and wants to "fleece 'em for all it's worth"!

If people boycotted H17, CSM's and 6:5 blackjack payouts they would cease to exist, only a matter of time. People are stupid and line up all day long to play this garbage and lose their ass though! It amazes me. Harrah's casinos must put something in the drinks to help people along with being as stupid as is humanly possible. Will they be able to continue to offer such crummy blackjack in a more competitive market?

The flip side of the coin is casinos having lots of very full, very busy blackjack tables and taking a HUGE volume of business away from all the others. It's quite easy! Offer 6 decks or less, S17, 3:2, hand-shuffled games with one deck cut off and then advertise that you offer the best blackjack available in the region because you certainly wouldn't be lying with Harrah's casinos all over! Harrah's AC even has autoshufflers in the $100 min. pit... amazing... but they also have lots of dealers standing there with no players at those tables and both thumbs jammed deep into their anus most of the time in that pit.

Harrah's owned casinos rely upon people being too stupid to know the difference and owning a large enough number of the casinos to control all that goes on. I recall Harrah's "buying out blitz" in which they bought out Caesar's, Bally's, Claridge, Showboat and appeared to have every intent of buying out every casino in AC! Was that the plan? "We own it ALL so we control it all, therefore we can alter the rules of the game to our liking and have no competition... our H17 and 6:5 will be the only game in town so those suckers will have no choice! I KNOW (at the marketing meeting)... let's put a big sign out there over the table that says A WHOPPING 6:5 PAYOUT ON BLACKJACK." (See my post on how marketing meetings go).

Many years ago there were far fewer casinos with much more playable blackjack games. Corporate greed combined with exponentional growth and gains of the gaming industry have made it such that now you must "shop around" carefully to find a playable blackjack game since the game varies so greatly from place to place. Business was so damn good in recent years that you could offer a crummy game and gouge out more HA from a huge volume of people willing to gamble frivolously and that were either just too stupid to know the difference or didn't care. There was no shortage of willing players no matter what the rules of the game. Will the economic situation and increased competition change all that? Will the game of blackjack revert back to having more "player friendly" rules like it did years ago due to increased competition? I think it will... either that or we will have some huge, gutted out and condemned buildings that used to be casinos. I hope Harrah's goes first... a little payback for their cute little rule changes in recent years.

What about those 80 year old slot junkies? As they croak off their children, pissed off about watching their ancient parents pissing away all the inheritance money will likely know better than to spend too much time pumping bills into the money-eating electronic devices. Those have no CHOICE but to become more player friendly... AC has already lost a lot of slot players with PA players playing in these slot parlors popping up in PA and they are building more of them.

While on the subject of slots, which I actually know little or nothing about, I see these things posted all over about "Loosest slots in Atlantic City" in MULTIPLE casinos so---SOMEONE's lying! Just WHO determines this "loosest slot" thing? Is this another marketing meeting staff thing to show to anyone with half a brain that with a whacko statement like that someone is absolutely full of sh*t because 10 out of 12 total casinos claim to have "the loosest slots in Atlantic City"?
Well, I undersatnd, but, what's 0.2%?

Will I drive to Wheeling for a game that much better so I can save $20 after 100o hands?

Also, you don't mention $unit.

Chances are slots in AC have a lower HA than in PA?

Not even sure what my point was lol.

FWIW, I heard tables could be at Rivers Casino (PGH) in March.

Despite that "six months" stuff lol.

They said they planned for this, had the space for tables ready etc.

Guess time will tell lol.

Could not get proposed definitive rules of table BJ from anyone. Is it maybe in the legislation somewhere?

As everyone probably knows, th current Virtual BJ game available does have H17, offset by LS which helps, and 5-card Charlies. (Is it 7-card Charlies?)
 
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