What did you do to get banned ,trespassed and flyered?

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pit15

Well-Known Member
Coyote said:
What? What the heck triggered it? Past performance?
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Nope, I didn't give a rating card, and I've never counted cards at this place.

The game was hot, I'll leave it at that.
 
Dyepaintball12

Dyepaintball12

Well-Known Member
The Suburbs said:
My first back-off happened not too long ago at a big store on the east coast. Was a regular (once a week or so) there for the past year or so playing pretty chunky green action ($25-500 spread) with very little cover. After taking ~$50,000 off them on my player's card (plus thousands in comps), I think ultimately they had to review my play based on pretty consistent winning (generally under $3k per visit) over a longer term.

I figured it was only a matter of time, seeing as how I was playing rated. In fact, I was surprised at how long it ultimately took them.

For now, I'm taking a break from BJ there for a bit and will play poker when I go there. I will ultimately play smaller stakes unrated in the future.

That being said, I have a weeklong Vegas trip planned for July and will be playing very aggressively. I am expecting multiple back-offs during the trip.
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Yeah, you need to start hiding your winnings. There's guys on this forum who are way up on the year but the casinos show a loss.

That's how you debate.
 
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pit15

Well-Known Member
Dyepaintball12 said:
Yeah, you need to start hiding your winnings. There's guys on this forum who are way up on the year but the casinos show a loss.

That's how you debate.
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Depending on the EV of your play it may not be possible to rathole enough to cover it. Almost every place tracks black chips, and there's a limit to how much green and red you can take off a game.

What you DO need to do though, is keep track of your lifetime win and stop using a card when it's close to the limit
 
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The Suburbs

Active Member
pit15 said:
Depending on the EV of your play it may not be possible to rathole enough to cover it. Almost every place tracks black chips, and there's a limit to how much green and red you can take off a game.

What you DO need to do though, is keep track of your lifetime win and stop using a card when it's close to the limit
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Indeed. While I did rathole as much as possible, it seemed like the majority of my winnings were from having big positive variance shoes where I would win 1.5k-2k in a shoe, rather than grinding it out. I always figure that it's best to leave a table after a big win rather than stay around and going back to my min bet while trying to rathole more. You just can't easily hide four-figure wins in 15-20 minute timeframe without being blatant about pocketing chips.

Ultimately, I think I was probably able to rathole 10k-15k of my winnings, but I was still a winning player on their records. I don't know the exact number, as I wasn't willing to give them my SSN to find out my +/-.
 
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paddywhack

Well-Known Member
pit15 said:
you can make an educated guess on what the limit is.
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Hate to beat a dead horse here. But how would you go about guessing? And what has educated you to the point of making that guess?

You're just shooting off numbers.....
 
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pit15

Well-Known Member
The Suburbs said:
Indeed. While I did rathole as much as possible, it seemed like the majority of my winnings were from having big positive variance shoes where I would win 1.5k-2k in a shoe, rather than grinding it out. I always figure that it's best to leave a table after a big win rather than stay around and going back to my min bet while trying to rathole more. You just can't easily hide four-figure wins in 15-20 minute timeframe without being blatant about pocketing chips.

Ultimately, I think I was probably able to rathole 10k-15k of my winnings, but I was still a winning player on their records. I don't know the exact number, as I wasn't willing to give them my SSN to find out my +/-.
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You dont give a SSN to get your yearly win/loss...

A typical shift for me is around $1000 in EV, so to take that off the table in green would be 2 entire stacks, and that's just to get to even. Taking 200 bucks in green won't be noticed, taking a grand is 100% likely to be noticed because they'll have to do a fill because of it.

And I'm most likely going to dirty the card before I hit the win limit anyway and once the card is dirty all that ratholing was for nothing.
 
Gamblor

Gamblor

Well-Known Member
pit15 said:
You dont give a SSN to get your yearly win/loss...
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Right, most places I've been too, the pit or host just tells you if you ask. Heck, one host just showed me the screen.

Think with Total Rewards you can just check online (never did it myself).
 
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pit15

Well-Known Member
paddywhack said:
Hate to beat a dead horse here. But how would you go about guessing? And what has educated you to the point of making that guess?

You're just shooting off numbers.....
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50K is a widely accepted number for the win limit on a card. I've heard it from many different people, and I believe there is some validity to it.
 
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tthree

Banned
pit15 said:
I got half shoed last week.

I wasn't counting, and was flat betting table minimum the whole time. Was actually the first time I got half shoed ever.
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You probably got caught ratholing. They know you are up to no good and have probably been assessing all missing chips to you every time you play. If you played with a successful ratholer after that every chip he ratholed is now considered to be in your bank account. They may have you down as winning over a $100,000 by now.
 
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pit15

Well-Known Member
tthree said:
You probably got caught ratholing. They know you are up to no good and have probably been assessing all missing chips to you every time you play. If you played with a successful ratholer after that every chip he ratholed is now considered to be in your bank account. They may have you down as winning over a $100,000 by now.
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Nah, I know exactly why, and it had nothing to do w/ ratholing.
 
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pit15

Well-Known Member
Coyote said:
Nuff said! :cool:
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Anyway, the point of this is sometimes you don't have to do ANYTHING to make the heat come down on you.

In fact, there was heat on the ploppies at that game, they just didn't know it (or care for that matter, ploppies are usually oblivious to everything).
 
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SteveG

New Member
So are you guys saying ALL WINNERS get booted eventually?

I know a good friend that I have accompanied a few times in the last 6 months to a big casino in Vegas. He doesn't count but is up well over 50 over about 10 trips net, winning about 8/10 times. Presumably, from what I've read on here, they just let him be cuz they 'know' it's just a matter of time b4 he donates it all back, right? When, if at all, will they just stop him? Or are the bigger houses OK with it? I was thinking they might be, almost like a loss leader at a strore, in that others will think it's viable for them and will likely give back more than he would take anyway. Thoughts? Thanks Steve
 
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pit15

Well-Known Member
SteveG said:
I know a good friend that I have accompanied a few times in the last 6 months to a big casino in Vegas. He doesn't count but is up well over 50 over about 10 trips net, winning about 8/10 times. Presumably, from what I've read on here, they just let him be cuz they 'know' it's just a matter of time b4 he donates it all back, right? When, if at all, will they just stop him? Or are the bigger houses OK with it? I was thinking they might be, almost like a loss leader at a strore, in that others will think it's viable for them and will likely give back more than he would take anyway. Thoughts? Thanks Steve
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No, winning 50K (or whatever the number for that particular store may be) does not mean they automatically toss you out. It means it might trigger a win based skills check. So if you are counting, or you have something else going on, there's a good chance they'll figure it out.

It's like any other skills check. If they see you doing something they'll put an end to it, if you're just a lucky sucker, they let you keep playing.
 
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