itakeyourmoney
Well-Known Member
Do you report your winnings to the IRS? Please share your thoughts as I am unsure whether or not this is necessary.
Report winnings to the IRS?
- Thread starter itakeyourmoney
- Start date
"Absolutely"
Note that while I voted "absolutely," it is somewhat hypothetical as I have yet to have a net gain that would be taxable.
Also, for those not reporting gains, do you play with a player's card? Does your player's card account record indicate a gain and you still choose not to report it?
Note that while I voted "absolutely," it is somewhat hypothetical as I have yet to have a net gain that would be taxable.
Also, for those not reporting gains, do you play with a player's card? Does your player's card account record indicate a gain and you still choose not to report it?
itakeyourmoney
Well-Known Member
I was curious as to whether or not this was a net thing. Like say you win $10,000 one weekend, but then lose $9,000 the next, would you be required to pay taxes on the $10,000 win or just the $1,000 net win?
moo321
Well-Known Member
No one is really even sure. I've talked to several CPA's about it, and read several opinions from tax attorneys, and they're contradictory. Some say to report all session wins, some say only to report net, some say to report gross and write off losses.
Our tax code is a cluster****.
My advice is to report something if you won more than a few hundred dollars.
I'm not sure what sort of CPAs you ran this past. It seems fairly clear to me. At years end, you total up your winnings and then you total up your losses. You subtract the losses from the winnings and the remainder is taxable. You must itemize in order to deduct any losses, and you fill out a schedule form to deduct gambling losses.
It's a good idea to keep a gambling diary, and be sure to get W/L statements from your casinos- esp. if you get 1099s from them.
For 99.9 % of us, we can't deduct expenses-airlines, cars, rooms or meals.
It's a good idea to keep a gambling diary, and be sure to get W/L statements from your casinos- esp. if you get 1099s from them.
For 99.9 % of us, we can't deduct expenses-airlines, cars, rooms or meals.
daddybo
Well-Known Member
Irs
I think what I'm saying is correct.. it's the way I've been doing it.
Casinos don't usually report wins unless they give you a 1099 on it. If you have large cash-ins ($10,000) at the cage they will file a CTR (cash transaction report). if you make suspicious multiple cash-ins that may be close to $10,000, they can file a SAR (Suspicious Activity Report). These limits may have been lowered recently by the current administration... not sure about it.
Having said that.... If I'm not mistaken the IRS says you are supposed to report any and all income (wins). Also you should keep a log of all your play so you can report your losses also. You can only deduct gambling loses against gambling income.
I think what I'm saying is correct.. it's the way I've been doing it.
Casinos don't usually report wins unless they give you a 1099 on it. If you have large cash-ins ($10,000) at the cage they will file a CTR (cash transaction report). if you make suspicious multiple cash-ins that may be close to $10,000, they can file a SAR (Suspicious Activity Report). These limits may have been lowered recently by the current administration... not sure about it.
Having said that.... If I'm not mistaken the IRS says you are supposed to report any and all income (wins). Also you should keep a log of all your play so you can report your losses also. You can only deduct gambling loses against gambling income.
Adm. Buckles
Member
You Better
I will probably never win enough money in the near future to warrant reporting gambling winnings to the IRS. But if and when I do you can bet I will be reporting all income from gambling. I don't think trying to beat the IRS is an advantage play because no matter what the odds you will always lose.:grin:
I will probably never win enough money in the near future to warrant reporting gambling winnings to the IRS. But if and when I do you can bet I will be reporting all income from gambling. I don't think trying to beat the IRS is an advantage play because no matter what the odds you will always lose.:grin:
I'm not sure the IRS is as good at its job as you think, but I agree with the sentiment.
You subtract losses from wins for the calendar year and if you have a net win you report it. If you have a net loss you can't report it (or gambling related expenses) unless you declare your occupation as a professional gambler and make a singificant portion of your income from it.
Just the fact that some CTRs have been generated at the casino means nothing in terms of gambling income not being reported. The IRS sees the CTRs and the location where they occurred and knows that gambling is a negative expectation "hobby," so a gambling gain happens less often than a loss.
Just the fact that some CTRs have been generated at the casino means nothing in terms of gambling income not being reported. The IRS sees the CTRs and the location where they occurred and knows that gambling is a negative expectation "hobby," so a gambling gain happens less often than a loss.
daddybo
Well-Known Member
I agree.. I included that (about the CTR) in case someone might need to know it... if you know what I mean. :eyepatch:
callipygian
Well-Known Member
Read this, and then re-read it.
(1) Gambling winnings are lumped in with regular income; winning $100 at the tables is no different from getting a $100 bonus from your employer.
(2) That some gambling winnings are withheld and others aren't (a common complaint) is irrelevant to your eventual tax liability. You can get a tax refund if you end up losing your winnings just as you can get a tax refund if you end up having a baby and getting extra deductions. Uncle Sam earns interest on your withholding - deal with it.
(3) That you file a CTR is irrelevant to your tax liability. If you buy in for $20,000 and cash out $10,000 you still have to file a CTR. As the name suggests, it's there to track cash, not to track winnings.
(4) Not reporting your gambling earnings is equivalent to lying about your income, and it's tax fraud. That people do it regularly (tips, for instance, are self-reported and generally assumed to be underreported) is irrelevant.
(5) Tax structure sucks for gambling because you can't roll over losses. So if you make a 3-day trip to Vegas over the New Year holiday, win big on December 31, and lose big on January 1, you pay taxes on what you won on December 31 even if the trip were even. However, don't use "I hate our tax structure" as an excuse to commit tax fraud - voice your concerns in November during voting season, not April during tax season.
(6) I have no ethical qualms about simply subtracting my (undocumented) losses from my (undocumented) wins and simply reporting the net as a win - that being said, I play for very small stakes compared to my non-gambling income and my net gambling wins are less than my bank interest, so if the IRS wants to chat with me that's the least of my worries. The proper thing to do is to document everything (use an Excel spreadsheet, print it out monthly, and sign it if you need to) and file the Schedule as shadroch pointed out. I consider this more of a moral issue than a legal one - it's up to your conscience/soul.
daddybo
Well-Known Member
I know somebody that had this happen... I think he's still going round and round with the IRS. :flame:
callipygian
Well-Known Member
I predict he's going to lose. It's a non-ideal system but it's unambiguous in terms of clarity. There's not much leverage your friend has except to beg, "Please?"
daddybo
Well-Known Member
He won a big jackpot on a slot machine. it was late on Dec 31st. his argument was although he actually won the money on the 31st .. he didn't collect it until the 1st of January. Which is a legitimate argument in cash accounting. Apparently the paperwork reflected the actual winning time and not the collection time...
He's harder headed than I am.. I would just have paid the tax and the penalty and gotten over it. :laugh: After all, he still came out ahead.
Adm. Buckles
Member
What classifies "really high"
How much money is "really high?"
I am just a casual player so really high for me would be a yearly salary in a part time minimum wage job. It seems if someone makes more than 5,000 dollars a year gambling and they don't report the extra income an IRS audit would be devastating to their bankroll.
How much money is "really high?"
I am just a casual player so really high for me would be a yearly salary in a part time minimum wage job. It seems if someone makes more than 5,000 dollars a year gambling and they don't report the extra income an IRS audit would be devastating to their bankroll.
Automatic Monkey
Banned
Let's get this straight- we have a guy who calls himself "itakeyourmoney" and has as his avatar a picture of a Communist... and he's asking us if we are complying with the IRS?
And we are answering.
Yes, sir, every penny! In fact I bring my tax accountant with me to the casino and he verifies my records for every session. Comps too.
And we are answering.
Yes, sir, every penny! In fact I bring my tax accountant with me to the casino and he verifies my records for every session. Comps too.
Katweezel
Well-Known Member
Nuts and bananas for the IRS
Let's get this straight - we have a guy who calls himself: "Automatic Monkey" and has as his avatar a picture of a chimp toting what looks like a sawn-off shotgun... and he's claiming to be up to date with the IRS? :cat:
itakeyourmoney
Well-Known Member
It's in quotes because I figured the exact amount would differ from person to person.Adm. Buckles said:
1. My name is supposed to be in reference to my taking the casino's money (at this point it's still more of an ambition than a reality lol)
2. Noam Chomsky is not a communist.
3. What do you think I'm some kind of tax hound running around making sure everyone "pays their dues"? lol, Regardless of my political views, I don't care if people pay their taxes for their blackjack winnings -- besides, it would be much better for someone to donate that money to UNICEF.
moo321
Well-Known Member
Well, it's not totally clear. I've heard some people say this, but others said you should list all wins as income and then write off losses. For example, if you hit a $15k jackpot, but were a net loser for the year and didn't report, the IRS could very well come calling.
callipygian
Well-Known Member
That's only because you would receive a W-2G for your $15,000 jackpot and you legally can't fail to report that.
If you put a penny into a slot machine and win $1 on one trip and then lose four quarters on your next trip, the proper thing to do is to report winnings of $1 counteracted with a loss of $1. But it's fine (IMO) to just put $0 for each.
In the space between "I sunk my loose change into a slot machine" and "I won enough to generate a W-2G" is the "it's up to your conscience" zone.