Ploppies, Ploppies Everywhere

msshay · May 30, 2006

I played bj this weekend in Ok was was stunned by the number of ploppies giving me bad advise.

First was to have split 6's against a dealer's 8. Another was to always take even money against a dealer's A. Was told not to split 9's when the dealer had a low card. Give me a break, ploppies!!!!

My hubby asked if he should split 7's against a dealer's 10. I told him no. A ploppie when on for several minutes how she always splits 7's since it was only 14. Yea, I really want 2 bad hand against a dealer's 10 instead of one.

I saw 2's being split when a dealer had a card higher than 7. Saw other bad splits. Also saw not DD on 11's or DD 10's when the dealer had less than 7. Or standing on 12 to 16 when the dealer had 7 or higher. Sheesh. If you're going to give me bad advise and you play like crap, then you can many all of my bets for me. Learn BS, instead of giving out BS.

Mikeaber · May 30, 2006

Msshay...may I ask where in OK you were playing? Those poor folk that play those casinos (and they literally line up for the slaughter down there!) really do have some strange strategy!

I have been known to donate spare change to KAW in Newkirk when making smoke runs :devil: Even with 'advantage play' it is impossible to expect to come out ahead. I have to admit though that I learned practical application of counting skills at that casino and it only cost me $200 or $300 to do it :laugh:

I know the dealers down there. I taught one of them how to play the game before she became a dealer. Now, she's wanting me to teach her how to count. Most of the time now when I go down there, they invite me to sit in on dealer auditions. Those can be a lot of fun even though you are not betting with real money.

msshay · May 30, 2006

Played at the Cherokee Casino in Catoosa.

I was soooo tempted to split 10's after the ploppy advise to see if I could run them off. lol. But figured that all I'd end up doing was screwing up a winning hand.

Thinking next time of going to NM.

msshay · May 30, 2006

Would love to see a dealer's audition. sounds like fun.

Mikeaber · May 30, 2006

msshay said:

The "auditions" are fun. Hilarious! That's the only time players can get away with ANYTHING in attemts to screw up the auditioning dealer! Capping chips! Muffing cards. We teamed up to distract the dealer so that the guy on First Base could slip cards into the shoe! I once even blatently ask the Pit Boss on third base what she'd drawn on the last hand because I'd lost count! I stacked a handful of white chips on top of a pink $.25 ante chip and then doubled with the same stack structure. The dealer paid me off with RED $5 chips on the bottom :laugh: I had him so confused once with an insurance bet that he almost left his station! He had an Ace up and the pit boss playing 3rd had been dealt a Natural. He asked for "even money" and while she was debating with him on how to do it, I stuck an insurance bet out, then pulled it back, stuck it back out again and then added more than 1/2 my bet to it, reached out and picked up my original bet to "count it" and pulled $15 in Red Chips off of that stack. With all that going on, the auditioning dealer forgot to even check his hole card for a face before asking for decisions! As soon as he dealt the first hit at first base, I reached out and pulled my insurance bet and then added the maximum bet to my bet in the circle! It was a total disaster hand for him. He ended up "calling security" :whip: I insisted that it didn't matter whether he had a blackjack or not now because the hand was a misdeal and no one could lose....at best, they should be offered a chance to pull their bets or play without a chance of losing! The Pit Boss who was evaluating the new Dealer almost was in tears from laughter!

As bad as we jacked around with this guy, they went ahead and passed his audition. But when it was over, he'd dealt only one shoe in the hour it took! He said to his new boss that he though he would be okay as a dealer as long as she kept ME away from him! Poor guy. I wouldn't want to deal to me either! :devil:

msshay · May 30, 2006

Oh man, poor guy. I'm afraid I'd be rolling on the floor, lmao in that situation.

Cass · May 30, 2006

msshay said:

I played bj this weekend in Ok was was stunned by the number of ploppies giving me bad advise.

First was to have split 6's against a dealer's 8. Another was to always take even money against a dealer's A. Was told not to split 9's when the dealer had a low card. Give me a break, ploppies!!!!

My hubby asked if he should split 7's against a dealer's 10. I told him no. A ploppie when on for several minutes how she always splits 7's since it was only 14. Yea, I really want 2 bad hand against a dealer's 10 instead of one.

I saw 2's being split when a dealer had a card higher than 7. Saw other bad splits. Also saw not DD on 11's or DD 10's when the dealer had less than 7. Or standing on 12 to 16 when the dealer had 7 or higher. Sheesh. If you're going to give me bad advise and you play like crap, then you can many all of my bets for me. Learn BS, instead of giving out BS.

Sounds like a regular day at the tables to me. I like how they tell me to ALWAYS take even money, and NEVER take insurance!

msshay · May 30, 2006

Cass said:

I don't understand the logic on that!!!:laugh:

ihate17 · May 31, 2006

Said it before, 99% do not know Basic Strategy

If you study people at the tables, you easily will find out that the player who plays perfect basic strategy is a rarity. You will find some who will hit their 12vs2 but never against 3, or will split their nines properly but never hit soft18 or double it. Or you will find the guy who split those 6's against an 8. And perhaps the worst player at the table is the one telling everyone what they should do.

So as Cass said, you witnessed a perfectly normal day in a casino, especially a casino away from downtown Vegas. At some point you will do something you think is completely normal and correct in basic strategy and the cards will fall against you and the whole table will blame you. If you happen to count cards, this can be a good thing, thinning out the table.

ihate17

ScottH · May 31, 2006

msshay said:

Always taking even money won't cost you very much money, but it will cost you some.

shadroch · May 31, 2006

Thats it,in a nutshell. Taking even money,you always get a payout. Taking the insurance bet,you lose more than you win,so you see the difference. Even though they are pretty much the same bet,the one costs you real money,while the other costs you nothing out of pocket,you just win less.Its faulty logic,but I can understand how people can see it that way.
Taking even money or insurance on your BJ is the only sure bet in the casino. It also is one of the worse bets,but it is the only sure bet.

zengrifter · May 31, 2006

shadroch said:

Its not so bad, not as bad as the early books made it out. Nowadays many/most counters take even money most of the time because it looks like normal ploppie and it costs very little. zg

ScottH · May 31, 2006

zengrifter said:

Do you always take even money zg?

I think I will start taking even money because some of the dealers "expect" the 50 cents in change as a tip when getting a BJ betting 5 dollars. Also, as my friend found out, some dealers get annoyed when you have them color up a whole bunch of quarters and dollar chips.

zengrifter · May 31, 2006

ScottH said:

No. And I usually DON'T tip the 50 cents. I like to stack up the solver and bet it. Or occaissionally I MIGHT bet some of it for the dealer. And the cocktail waitress always gets some - but not always the dealer. zg

ScottH · May 31, 2006

zengrifter said:

Yeah, on second thought I will just refuse even money and not give the change to the dealer. At the casino I went to not taken even money actually worked as a cover play. It should be the opposite, but the dealers there didn't know BS. The dealer would make fun of me every time I refused even money, hit my 12 vs a 2 or 3, when I doubled a soft 18, etc. The dealer's thought I was an idiot, while I was playing BS. I don't think they could spot a counter if their life depended on it. The first time I went I only flat-betted, and after the first shoe the pit boss completely ignored the table. So if I just flat-bet for 1 shoe I could probably get away with a lot for the rest of the session. Actually, I think I will just blast away without any cover from the start. That is what you recommened for a 5u bettor right?

msshay · May 31, 2006

What surprised me wasn't so much the playing. I expected that not everyone won't know bs, but what surprised me was how freely people gave out bad advise thinking that they were bj experts. :laugh:

Mikeaber · May 31, 2006

msshay said:

There's nothing wrong with Ploppies. I've come across some who did know BS at least as well as I know it. Shoot, I Plopped for years and had a blast getting drunk and hooting it up while losing a little and chalking it up to entertainment.

In any other casino in the US, it is the ploppies who keep the casinos in business....expecially those who can tap into the Supernatural to make decisions and who have developed their own "basic strategy". I said IN ANY OTHER casino in the US OTHER than Oklahoma. The casinos down there in OK make their money strictly off of the ante. They then have to pay taxes on the ante! The table wins are supposed to be split 80% to the patrons of the casino and 20% back to the State. So, Ploppies are actually funding the State's School system and Highway maintenance! That 80% back to the players usually takes the form of a drawing every once in a while. The latest one I'm aware of was for a jet-ski...woopee! That probably ate up at least 5% of that 80% AND, it is a drawing that is NOT limited just to Blackjack players! Any slot machine junkie can enter it too! I'd much rather see them be required to offer monthly tournaments.

Actually, I'd rather see them do away with that damned ante all together! It amounts to Casino RAPE or at least assault with a deadly weapon with the intent to kill!

Cass · May 31, 2006

Even Money

ScottH said:

Yeah, on second thought I will just refuse even money and not give the change to the dealer. At the casino I went to not taken even money actually worked as a cover play. It should be the opposite, but the dealers there didn't know BS. The dealer would make fun of me every time I refused even money, hit my 12 vs a 2 or 3, when I doubled a soft 18, etc. The dealer's thought I was an idiot, while I was playing BS. I don't think they could spot a counter if their life depended on it. The first time I went I only flat-betted, and after the first shoe the pit boss completely ignored the table. So if I just flat-bet for 1 shoe I could probably get away with a lot for the rest of the session. Actually, I think I will just blast away without any cover from the start. That is what you recommened for a 5u bettor right?

Even money is the same as taking the insurance bet, and both should be done at the proper count for the system you are using.

msshay · May 31, 2006

Mikeaber said:

There's nothing wrong with Ploppies. I've come across some who did know BS at least as well as I know it. Shoot, I Plopped for years and had a blast getting drunk and hooting it up while losing a little and chalking it up to entertainment.

In any other casino in the US, it is the ploppies who keep the casinos in business....expecially those who can tap into the Supernatural to make decisions and who have developed their own "basic strategy". I said IN ANY OTHER casino in the US OTHER than Oklahoma. The casinos down there in OK make their money strictly off of the ante. They then have to pay taxes on the ante! The table wins are supposed to be split 80% to the patrons of the casino and 20% back to the State. So, Ploppies are actually funding the State's School system and Highway maintenance! That 80% back to the players usually takes the form of a drawing every once in a while. The latest one I'm aware of was for a jet-ski...woopee! That probably ate up at least 5% of that 80% AND, it is a drawing that is NOT limited just to Blackjack players! Any slot machine junkie can enter it too! I'd much rather see them be required to offer monthly tournaments.

Actually, I'd rather see them do away with that damned ante all together! It amounts to Casino RAPE or at least assault with a deadly weapon with the intent to kill!

Gotta agree with you on the ante!

Automatic Monkey · May 31, 2006

zengrifter said:

It also has a worthwhile variance reducing effect, so I'll take even money on borderline insurance decisions when I have a BJ.

Ploppies, Ploppies Everywhere

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