how best to exploit a common dealer error

[kewljason]

Interesting. So my ambiguous hand work, that is an attempt to cause a dealer error, like drawing an opposing linesman off side, so under that reasoning it would be cheating.

I like this analogy of what you are doing. I don't want to call it cheating, because it may not (apparently doesn't) fit the technical definition of cheating, plus who am I to decide that. BUT, it's a cheap, not very honorable way to do things. I never liked trying to draw a lineman offsides either. While, not against the rules, what a cheap, low way to pick up a first down. Line up and run a play and gain the yards necessary for the first down for god sakes. :laugh:

 

[SuperSmash]

Dealers are trained to do their job in a certain way and if they fail to, it is at their peril. The most profitable one is when a dealer shows you their cards. If they are dealing properly this will never happen. If they're not, there are people who consider HC to be cheating but it really isn't and the courts have upheld this, even in Nevada. Likewise a good dealer is going to wait until they get a non-ambiguous signal before they expose a card and if they try to anticipate, they are the one who did something wrong.

On the one hand, you're taking more money from the big, bad, evil casino. Cool! On the other hand, the dealer has two options here...
#1: He can continue to deal quickly, hopefully keeping the casino's earnings higher by keeping the game moving. THEN, you end up winning more, and the casino gets mad at the dealer for not waiting for a non-ambiguous hand signal.
#2: He can wait for a non-ambiguous hand signal, slowing down the game and lowering the casino's earnings. THEN, the casino gets mad at the dealer for not keeping the game moving more quickly.

Seems to me you might be putting the dealer in a somewhat awkward and rather jeopardized position. :-\

 

[aslan]

And MOST IMPORTANTLY, don't forget to give back the money that you won.

Oh, yes! Restitution! Do I still have to include the amount in my tithe? :whip: :laugh:

 

[kewljason]

On the one hand, you're taking more money from the big, bad, evil casino. Cool! On the other hand, the dealer has two options here...
#1: He can continue to deal quickly, hopefully keeping the casino's earnings higher by keeping the game moving. THEN, you end up winning more, and the casino gets mad at the dealer for not waiting for a non-ambiguous hand signal.
#2: He can wait for a non-ambiguous hand signal, slowing down the game and lowering the casino's earnings. THEN, the casino gets mad at the dealer for not keeping the game moving more quickly.

Seems to me you might be putting the dealer in a somewhat awkward and rather jeopardized position. :-\

I don't think Monkey will lose sleep over putting the dealer in an awkward and jeopardized position, :laugh: however, your second point is a good one. His actions could slow down the dealer, which again, I don't think he would be too concerned with the lowering of casino earnings, but it would slow an AP's earnings as well. That he might care about. :laugh:

 

[WRX]

Most casinos do not allow backing up of the cards

If the dealer didn't wait for your signal, the casino must and will.

 

[WRX]

For example at my local store I recently saw a guy bet the table maximum, double down 13 and pull an 8. This is a $4000 hand we are talking about.

Just e-mail me the names of the casino and dealer, and shift, and I'll check it out for you.

You know, that guy could have had information, so do him a favor and don't give out a description of him or anything.

 

[WRX]

I have seen someone tip black chips ONCE, and it was because he won the lucky ladies side bet (and he tipped $400 for winning 14k) and then the dealer told him he was cheap for only giving her $400....

This is as good an argument as I've seen for not tipping at all. Or certainly for not tipping as extravagantly as $400, even on a big score, because a dealer who expects a big tip in this situation will never be satisfied with what you give out. You may want to tip modest amounts to assuage your own sense of your social obligation, just like tipping in a restaurant, particularly if dealers pool tips. But don't expect that you'll ever be able to buy the friendship of greedy toke-hustlers, they're just trying to suck every drop of blood out of you before the casino beats them to it.

 

[WRX]

If you're going to tip anything serious, you should just meet the dealer offsite. Like, if I hit a $14k jackpot, I'm not tipping uncle sam and every jagoff on that shift so that poor guy can get $10.

I don't often speak this way of other contributors, but recommending meeting a dealer offsite and handing over cash is horrible advice. I can't think of a better way to get falsely accused of collusion to cheat the casino, if the wrong people see you. In my past lifetime as a dealer, decades ago, I once loaned an acquaintance $100 at the poker table. He played at my blackjack table the next day. Then I met him in the alley, and he paid me back the $100. I realized later that was one of the dumbest things I'd ever done.

 

[WRX]

Want to really make a mess of things with your hands? Sitting at first base, you have the cut card, have a chip in your hand pressed against the right side of the cut card and in your usual drunken state, wantonly slam it down into the shoe. You'll get a preview of things to come, if you know what I mean.

This has been prosecuted as a crime in New Jersey. There's no real good reason anyone should care about my personal opinion of whether this is cheating or a crime. How it's been treated by the people who run courts and prisons is a much more practical consideration.

 

[Sucker]

This has been prosecuted as a crime in New Jersey. There's no real good reason anyone should care about my personal opinion of whether this is cheating or a crime. How it's been treated by the people who run courts and prisons is a much more practical consideration.

And this was not his first conviction. He was also prosecuted for doing it in Connecticut. Not sure whether it was Foxwoods or Mohegan Sun.

And you're also right about it not mattering whether or not any of US consider it cheating. If you're hauled into court, you'll be mainly worried about the opinion of the 12 people sitting off to your left.