8,8 vs 10

[dpmonk2003]

I know the correct play for this (even with the surrender rule) is to still split your 8's vs a 10, but I really don't understand it. Also I used to think you were supposed to surrender because I could swear in casino verite I was told to surrender with dual 8's vs the 10. I believe I had only the illustrious 18 on, but I must of had it on full indices. Anyways can someone run a calculation on this play because it really seems to me like surrendering 8,8 vs a 10 is the best option. Also if anyone cares to I'm curious at what point with the count does surrendering become your correct play.

 

[sagefr0g]

I know the correct play for this (even with the surrender rule) is to still split your 8's vs a 10, but I really don't understand it. Also I used to think you were supposed to surrender because I could swear in casino verite I was told to surrender with dual 8's vs the 10. I believe I had only the illustrious 18 on, but I must of had it on full indices. Anyways can someone run a calculation on this play because it really seems to me like surrendering 8,8 vs a 10 is the best option. Also if anyone cares to I'm curious at what point with the count does surrendering become your correct play.

i surrender a pair of eights against ten if tc>=1

 

[EasyRhino]

Not exactly related, but I got in an argument with a buddy and realized that I was misplaying basic strategy on my usual 6D H17 LS game vs dealer Aces.

With 8s, I was splitting, and should have surrendered, with a 16 or 17, I was standing, should have surrendered.

I'm such a dope.

 

[Renzey]

8/8 vs. 10

With 8/8 vs. 10, after adjusting for pushes;
Hitting wins 23% and loses 77% (54% net loss).
Splitting wins 76 and loses 124 of the 200 new hands (48% net loss).
Surrendering loses half every time (50% net loss).
Correct Basic Strategy Play -- Split

 

[MGP]

With 8/8 vs. 10, after adjusting for pushes;
Hitting wins 23% and loses 77% (54% net loss).
Splitting wins 76 and loses 124 of the 200 new hands (48% net loss).
Surrendering loses half every time (50% net loss).
Correct Basic Strategy Play -- Split

Actually he was right vs Aces; the EV for H17 6D SPL3 8,8 vs A is -0.514035 so it is correct to Surrender not split.

For the above rules you should also be surrendering 15-17 against A, and 15-16 vs 10 and 16 vs 9 although splitting 8's for 2-Ten.

 

[dpmonk2003]

With 8/8 vs. 10, after adjusting for pushes;
Hitting wins 23% and loses 77% (54% net loss).
Splitting wins 76 and loses 124 of the 200 new hands (48% net loss).
Surrendering loses half every time (50% net loss).
Correct Basic Strategy Play -- Split

thanks I was curious to see the actual numbers.