S
Snowball
Guest
Just curious, has anyone been to the Morongo Casino Resort and Spa in California? Does anyone know what kind of bj they have there?
Morongo sucks
Morongo has the worst game of all the Indian casinos in southern California. They only offer 8-deck games. They hit on a Soft 17, no surrender, they do allow DAS and they do allow you to replit aces, but you can't continue to hit on them by any more than one card. They hand-shuffle, which is better than the CSM's that are starting to invade the indian joints, but hand shuffling does slow the game to a grinding halt after every shoe. Table ranges are 5-200, 10-500, 15-1000, 25-2000, 50-5000, 100-5000, 500-5000.
I find those last three a bit odd, but that's what they've got. I could be wrong, but by my math, they have a house edge of .61%.
I had a conversation with an employee there who claimed to be a math major, and after doing the sales pitch on the rare resplitting of aces rule, they whispered to me that I should play somewhere else, and that they're ashamed to work there, the game is so bad.
barry
Morongo has the worst game of all the Indian casinos in southern California. They only offer 8-deck games. They hit on a Soft 17, no surrender, they do allow DAS and they do allow you to replit aces, but you can't continue to hit on them by any more than one card. They hand-shuffle, which is better than the CSM's that are starting to invade the indian joints, but hand shuffling does slow the game to a grinding halt after every shoe. Table ranges are 5-200, 10-500, 15-1000, 25-2000, 50-5000, 100-5000, 500-5000.
I find those last three a bit odd, but that's what they've got. I could be wrong, but by my math, they have a house edge of .61%.
I had a conversation with an employee there who claimed to be a math major, and after doing the sales pitch on the rare resplitting of aces rule, they whispered to me that I should play somewhere else, and that they're ashamed to work there, the game is so bad.
barry
Mikeaber
Well-Known Member
Safehouse....the table rules you describe are about what has become "standard" with shoe games except for the 8 decks. Most places I've seen use these rules on 6-deck games. As for resplitting Aces....most of the 6-deck games I've played and that are so common, allow the resplit and do not allow but one card. "Surrender" is quickly becomming extinct too. In fact, I've played only one "real" Blackjack table where surrender was allowed and that was in St Joseph (a Terrible's casino) Missouri. I gave the dealer the surrender signal and she didn't know what I was doing!
SoCal Casinos (Morongo)
that may be the standard in the midwest, but out here, the indians seem to be divided into two camps, hit soft 17 and stand on soft 17. I of course try to only play where they stand on soft 17, but with the exception of morongo, the places that hit on soft 17 allow surrender. That makes it the worst game in SoCal, in my opinion. I have noticed a trend out here. The nicer the joint, the worse the game. Pechanga, San Manuel and Morongo are all beautiful casinos, and Pechanga and Morongo have luxurious hotels and spas, and all 3 hit on soft 17. Augustine and Soboba are affectionately referred to as "trailer parks" by my musician friends who play them, and they aren't exactly the Bellagio, but at least they stand on soft 17 and allow surrender, and they also have very favorable penetration, bordering on 80%. I'll take a .36% house advantage in a dump with fewer amenities over a spa resort with a .61% edge, any day of the week.
that may be the standard in the midwest, but out here, the indians seem to be divided into two camps, hit soft 17 and stand on soft 17. I of course try to only play where they stand on soft 17, but with the exception of morongo, the places that hit on soft 17 allow surrender. That makes it the worst game in SoCal, in my opinion. I have noticed a trend out here. The nicer the joint, the worse the game. Pechanga, San Manuel and Morongo are all beautiful casinos, and Pechanga and Morongo have luxurious hotels and spas, and all 3 hit on soft 17. Augustine and Soboba are affectionately referred to as "trailer parks" by my musician friends who play them, and they aren't exactly the Bellagio, but at least they stand on soft 17 and allow surrender, and they also have very favorable penetration, bordering on 80%. I'll take a .36% house advantage in a dump with fewer amenities over a spa resort with a .61% edge, any day of the week.
Mikeaber
Well-Known Member
Safehouse said:
Me too. In Kansas and in the KC, Missouri area, I know of only one casino that stands on 17's (Sac & Fox). None of them offer a respectable double-deck game so the pickin's are pretty much just the 6-deck games at something like .62%. Except for Sac & Fox with the .42% game. It is also, by the way, the only one that is hand shuffled and I'd MUCH rather play at a hand shuffled table! Call me crazy, but I find it extremely difficult to beat or even break even on Shuffle Master tables. At least that's been the rule on my last three trips!
I think I mentioned it here that I got my butt kicked all last weekend until the dealer dropped the cards and had to hand shuffle them. On that shoe, I won back about 1/3 of what I'd lost the rest of the weekend!
their limits are really shitty now. they are 10-500, 15-500, 25-1000, 50-2000, and 100-2000. I didn't see anything higher, not even in the high roller room.
ihate17
Well-Known Member
Did Soboba go back to S-17
Perhaps 6-8 months ago Soboba destroyed their games going to H-17, are you saying they have returned to S-17?
ihate17
Perhaps 6-8 months ago Soboba destroyed their games going to H-17, are you saying they have returned to S-17?
ihate17
Sonny
Well-Known Member
That post was from 2005 so it was before the switch. I think Soboba is still H17. :flame:
-Sonny-
chenlizhen
New Member
I was at Soboba in January 2008. The shoe game is still hit soft 17, but I think they do have surrender and DAS and RSA. The penetration is about 65%, as their procedure, after the player cuts and the dealer moves the back chunk to the front, is to lop off anything past the width of one cut card.
Mimosine
Well-Known Member
i think sonny was referring to their DD game. did you check that out as well??
chenlizhen
New Member
Ah. H17, no DAS, no RSA, no surrender, ~60% penetration, uncrowded even on a Sunday afternoon. I suspect they can take the losses but not the wins, as I got crushed there twice (>11k total) but got prematurely shuffled on by a young, fat, bald, Caucasian pit boss when I bumped my bet from $50 to $100.
Mimosine
Well-Known Member
thanks for the info. that game used to be playable as a S17 game, but one of the members on here discovered about a year ago that they switched it to H17, if i recall that raised the house edge to an unacceptable 0.75.
i don't even want to ask how you lost 11k there, i'll assume that you are betting appropriately for your bankroll. i might check the place out again soon, since i don't live THAT far away, but it really is in the middle of nowhere....
ihate17
Well-Known Member
Probably me
I think it was last spring. I called Soboba and while not really asking direct questions, did ask if their blackjack games had changed any and when told they were exactly the same I made reservations to stay a night in one of Hemet's motels.
Of course the first thing I noticed when entering the pit area were the new felts, with the new rules. Disappointed and with h-17 and double on 10 and 11 only and no DAS, their double deck game became the worse one I know of in California (I believe a tie) and their shoe game rules became average. Since pen can be found in the place I did play for a bit before heading off in the area of Palm Springs.
Since then I have not returned and I am glad to hear that their double deck is not busy (I had heard earlier that it was busy), but if it was more convient I would still take advantage of some of their blackjack promotions that they used to run.
ihate17
I think it was last spring. I called Soboba and while not really asking direct questions, did ask if their blackjack games had changed any and when told they were exactly the same I made reservations to stay a night in one of Hemet's motels.
Of course the first thing I noticed when entering the pit area were the new felts, with the new rules. Disappointed and with h-17 and double on 10 and 11 only and no DAS, their double deck game became the worse one I know of in California (I believe a tie) and their shoe game rules became average. Since pen can be found in the place I did play for a bit before heading off in the area of Palm Springs.
Since then I have not returned and I am glad to hear that their double deck is not busy (I had heard earlier that it was busy), but if it was more convient I would still take advantage of some of their blackjack promotions that they used to run.
ihate17