Am I getting compulsive?

[positiveEV]

I recently started to hunt online bonuses. I started with $25 and quickly turned turned it into about $175 with online bonuses. Yesterday I opened an account at a casino that offered a $100 bonus for a $100 deposit with a $2,000 wagering requirement. I started playing $1 a hand and using Oscar's grind.

I know this don't change my EV but at least it can change my standard deviation. I was doing pretty well and was at about $500 at some point. I then decided to use a $5 unit to make it go faster and I was around $650 when I finished my wagering requirement. This is the part when I went crazy.

I told myself "let's continue like that so I don't get labeled as a bonus abuser" and I continued until I was at $1,000. I knew I just told that to myself as an excuse but another part of me told me to keep playing. At $1,000 I looked at my results and I realized I never went under 40 units in a "streak". I decided to bet $10 to make it go faster a hand and then $25 a hand to have it go really quick, and since I had over 40 units I told myself it was almost impossible to loose 40 units with that system as it goes so slowly. I was going crazy because this represents a lot of money for me (still a student) and I hit a peak of $1,400. Then I got a bad streak of win-lose-win-lose-win-lose causing me to raise my bet to follow the system. I was going down and down and I got dealt a pair of four against a 6 that I splitted and resplitted as I kept getting 4s, I reached the split limit and had a few double downs. I had $525 on a single hand at some point and lost everything as the dealer made a 6 cards 21.

I was around $200 after that and decided to bet $50 a hand to get at least as close as possible as I could to that high point. I fluctuated from $100 to $350 and whenever I hit $100 I told myself I would not make any money, whenever I was at $150 I told my self it was under the expected value of the bonus and when I had over $200 I wanted more.

Right now I have $11 left in the account. I can tell myself my initial investment was $25 so it doesn't matter anyway but I keep thinking about that $1,400 high, I just can't believe it. I studied the game for so long and I knew system didn't theoretically worked but my emotions took the control over me and I kept telling myself excuses like "I won't get labeled as a bonus abuser like that".

I know my mistakes, but how did that happened? I knew inside me that I was not supposed to do that but I still did, what went wrong? Am I getting a compulsive gambler?

 

[positiveEV]

By the way, does anyone have a way to make me stop thinking about this $1,400?

 

[shadroch]

Are you gambling your rent? Skipping meals to play a hunch?Using your kids tuition...
It appears you went on a tilt.It happens to almost everyone once in awhile.
Seems like you are aware of the dangers of compulsive gambling and are tracking your behavior.

 

[positiveEV]

Are you gambling your rent? Skipping meals to play a hunch?Using your kids tuition
It appears you went on a tilt.It happens to almost everyone once in awhile.
Seems like you are aware of the dangers of compulsive gambling and are tracking your behavior.

I started with $25 a week ago so it's not like it's going to affect my life. I kind of feel better but I am still pissed at myself

 

[nc-tom]

AF you sound like a pretty smart kid. You answered your own question. Your"emotitions took over".You got greedy which as Shad said has happened to us all. No more emotitions when playing BJ. Remember one of the golden rules, the math never lies.

 

[EasyRhino]

Yeah dude, you went on tilt.

Here's the cardinal rule of online casinos: don't gamble when you don't have the advantage. When you finished the WR, you were done. Cash out. I don't care if you are ahead or behind, just cash out. Any further gambling just costs you money.

So, for the immediate term, you've got $11. Is that big enough to cash out? If so, cash it. If there's a minimum cashout amount ($50?), then bet half your bankroll on each hand and see if you can reach that threshold. If you do, cash out.

My most heartbreaking loss was when I had driven up a balance to around $2000, and was grinding out a large WR at $25 a hand. Went on a hellacious losing streak, and lost it all. (I ended up winning on my next deposit or the one after with that casino, so it came back eventually).

I've kind of forgotten how to play cashable bonuses, but you just pick the bet level you're comfortable with, and stick with it flat betting.

When playing any bonus where you have to be aggressive, it's useful to determine, in advance, some following numbers:
- The "target balance" which you try to hit on your initial runup. Unless you're a nuclear level pro, this should be at least 2x what you start with, but not more than 4x.
- the "grind bet". If you need to grind through the WR, what bet do you want to use? It should be smaller than your kamikaze bet, but after that point it's just a tradeoff between variance and your time. For me, even with $40,000 WRs, this rarely exceeds 2x$25.
- The "minimum acceptable balance". If you dip below this while grinding the WR, then you go kamikaze again, trying to re-reach the kamikaze amount. This is sometimes necessary with sticky bonuses.

And, if you're jedi-level online husltler, then you figure out, in advance,how much you want to exceed the wagering requirement by, and with what type of play. Or, you can take the much simpler route, and just cash out.

We all have breakdowns in discipline. Two days ago I had a random $10 freechip at one casino. I sat down and started playing while only having a murky idea of what my target balance was. It probably should have been $50 (the min cashout amount), but I kept riding the streak up to $100, telling myself that I was going to grind out the balance on roulette, and I didn't want to significantly risk dipping below the min cashout amount. That's kind of reasonable, and kind of tiltish.

 

[Sonny]

I know my mistakes, but how did that happened? I knew inside me that I was not supposed to do that but I still did, what went wrong? Am I getting a compulsive gambler?

It sounds like you just got caught up in the excitement. Let’s face it, playing BS for hours on end is boooooring! It’s only natural to want to speed things up by burning through the wagering requirements faster when you’re ahead. It’s also very easy to get excited by a winning streak and press your luck. But you have to keep your emotions in control. A winning streak can make you feel invincible, but don’t get fooled. You’re always more likely to lose the next hand. You’re always the underdog.

As long as you can control your impulses you will not become a compulsive gambler. When you feel yourself getting emotional (either good or bad) you have to “snap out of it” and become logical again. When you feel yourself going “on tilt” and not playing the way you know you should, you need to stop. You might want to try limiting your online sessions to 15-20 minutes and forcing yourself to take a short break. That will give you a chance to regain your composure, and the game will still be there when you are ready to play again. Sometimes it only takes a few minutes to realize that you were starting to lose control.

If you find that you can’t walk away from the game when you know that you need to, then you will know that you have a serious problem.

-Sonny-

 

[Automatic Monkey]

This is why I've said there's a place for progressions in online play. They do relieve boredom to a slight degree and can help you get through a WR faster. You can design a progression to get your play in faster when you've had good variance and improve your chances of salvaging something when you've had bad.

Also importantly, a progression makes you look like a gambler and not an AP if someone is looking at your betting history.

 

[ScottH]

I know this don't change my EV but at least it can change my standard deviation.

Yeah, it INCREASES your variance, as you seen. You can win a lot, or lose a lot with any system. Why wouldn't you just play the lowest variance strategy of flat-betting one dollar until you get to 2000?

I told myself "let's continue like that so I don't get labeled as a bonus abuser"

Every bonus I played I flat-bet the minimum until I EXACTLY hit the WR and quit. It was never a problem.

 

[ScottH]

I started with $25 a week ago so it's not like it's going to affect my life. I kind of feel better but I am still pissed at myself

I'll bet that you will do this again... anyone want to take that bet?

 

[Sonny]

I'll bet that you will do this again... anyone want to take that bet?

We're betting on whether he will become a compulsive gambler? What does that make us? :joker:

-Sonny-

 

[ScottH]

We're betting on whether he will become a compulsive gambler? What does that make us? :joker:

-Sonny-

It depends on which side you take! :joker:

 

[Sonny]

It depends on which side you take! :joker:

Well said.

-Sonny-

 

[nightspirit]

Am I getting a compulsive gambler?

hey AF, check this out http://www.gamblersanonymous.org/20questions.html

I hope, it's nothing serious . . .but they will help you if you answer more than 7 questions with yes.

 

[Sonny]

I hope, it's nothing serious . . .but they will help you if you answer more than 7 questions with yes.

Whew! I got exactly seven. That means I'm not addicted!

Did gambling affect your reputation?

Yes. In fact, it earned me a position as “Super Moderator.”

Have you ever felt remorse after gambling?

Yes, after finding out that every dealer at the Texas Station was giving 50% penetration.

After losing did you feel you must return as soon as possible and win back your losses?

Yup, although usually I’ll play at another casino until the shift change.

After a win did you have a strong urge to return and win more?

Same as above.

Were you reluctant to use "gambling money" for normal expenditures?

Of course! My bankroll is completely separate from my other accounts. Isn’t that how it’s supposed to be? I don’t want to gamble with money from my checking account.

Did you ever gamble longer than you had planned?

Yes, when I stumbled onto a few nice promotions.

Did gambling cause you to have difficulty in sleeping?

Sure. How can anyone sleep the night before a big Vegas trip?

-Sonny-

 

[Automatic Monkey]

Got you beat- 12 out of 20!

"Have you ever committed, or considered committing, an illegal act to finance gambling?"

Sure, every online bonus I've ever cleared.


"Did gambling make you careless of the welfare of yourself or your family?"

Yes. Overeating at buffets, driving too tired between stores, taking risks with casino security and the local criminal element.


"Did you ever gamble longer than you had planned?"

Yes, I was getting RO7 and no heat, couldn't just walk away.


"After losing did you feel you must return as soon as possible and win back your losses?"

Yes, I don't like losing.


"After a win did you have a strong urge to return and win more?"

Why not, if I'm getting a good game.



I wonder if the compulsive gambling community really believes we can beat the games, or that we are just suffering from the same kind of delusions they did. Not the kind of thing we should just ask, for they have a sickness and I wouldn't want to come across as messing with them.

 

[waveslider]

Glad to See Its not only Me

I took 1000 ran it to 5250, cashed out 4000, played with 1250, ran it down to 7 measley dollars ran it back up to 6500, ran it down to 0, cashed back in the 4000 in 1000 increments bought back in for another 2500 then another 500 ran it to 7000 plus cashed that out lost the rest bought in for 250 plus bonus ran that to 1750 ran it down to 0 .........still waiting three weeks later to get the check for 7000 baking problems they say????

 

[moo321]

I wouldn't worry about it. I used to go on tilt all the time at casino bonuses. As long as you can make yourself stop when the WR is done, and you NEVER EVER deposit without a bonus, you should be fine.

 

[iwantblackjack]

Got you beat- 12 out of 20!
I wonder if the compulsive gambling community really believes we can beat the games, or that we are just suffering from the same kind of delusions they did. Not the kind of thing we should just ask, for they have a sickness and I wouldn't want to come across as messing with them.

It's all emotional; and the compulsive gambling (CG) community are usually "dominated by an irresistible urge to gamble". They, too, think they can beat the games. They, too, are emotionally thinking that the game is beatable with counting and proper bets and BS. But, i do think they sometimes get entrenched in the CG that they dont leave when a shoe is at bad counts. Oh well. What AF described, sounds like the definition of CG, because they "must always return to win more; no amount is sufficient"; so they raise their min bets.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

I wouldn't worry about it. I used to go on tilt all the time at casino bonuses. As long as you can make yourself stop when the WR is done, and you NEVER EVER deposit without a bonus, you should be fine.

That's usually the way it's done now. In the good old days of bonus hustling when the bonuses were great but it was harder to get money out, you would always give them a bit more than the WR. If you are getting good recurring bonuses sometimes you would give them a big deposit and a little play without a bonus just to keep yourself in good standing as a customer. All of this is the online equivalent of cover play.

Still, if you are counting on cover play to make money and not treating it as a business expense, you're gambling and possibly in danger of hurting your AP profitability.