Bad players make the game worse for an AP

[pit15]

Players who do things like hit stiffs vs bust cards, split 10s, and hit hard 17 make the game worse for an AP.

Why?

They take up more cards, which takes time to deal the cards to them, takes time for the dealer to check to make sure they're sure, and causes less rounds to be dealt per shoe (so more shuffles per hand you see).

They also cause people to leave the table which means more time spent coloring up and buying in.

 

[bigplayer]

Players who do things like hit stiffs vs bust cards, split 10s, and hit hard 17 make the game worse for an AP.

Why?

They take up more cards, which takes time to deal the cards to them, takes time for the dealer to check to make sure they're sure, and causes less rounds to be dealt per shoe (so more shuffles per hand you see).

They also cause people to leave the table which means more time spent coloring up and buying in.

First, not all bad players play the same way, some refuse to bust out and thus never hit stiff hands. Regardless of how they play, other players at the table do hurt the card counter more in + counts than they help you in - counts. Thus when the opportunity comes to sit out in negative count rounds, make phone calls, take bathroom breaks, drop to 1 hand, talk the other guy into adding a hand to "change the flow" and other techniques I feel zero guilt and take full advantage.

 

[zengrifter]

Players who do things like hit stiffs vs bust cards, split 10s, and hit hard 17 make the game worse for an AP.

They take up more cards, which takes time to deal the cards to them, takes time for the dealer to check to make sure they're sure, and causes less rounds to be dealt per shoe (so more shuffles per hand you see).

They also cause people to leave the table which means more time spent coloring up and buying in.

Disagree on all points. zg

 

[Shoofly]

Players who do things like hit stiffs vs bust cards, split 10s, and hit hard 17 make the game worse for an AP.

Why?

They take up more cards, which takes time to deal the cards to them, takes time for the dealer to check to make sure they're sure, and causes less rounds to be dealt per shoe (so more shuffles per hand you see).

They also cause people to leave the table which means more time spent coloring up and buying in.

Remember, if it weren't for these people, the casino couldn't afford to offer the game.

 

[gamblingghost]

Hmm, complainin about ploppies. I think nice ploppies are wonderful! They can be used in many ways. They do the craziest things! They are absolutely neccessary for there to be BJ. We NEED them!! So, just find ways to take advantage of it.

 

[Dyepaintball12]

They may make the game slower which gives you less EV per hour, but that's it.

 

[kewljason]

What about the value of free entertainment? Nothing better than watching some ying-yang split his 6's vs the dealer 10 and get a double down opportunity on both and watch him win both doubledowns when the dealers busts. :laugh: Priceless! If you are lucky you will get one that glowingly explains his rationale, by stating that the only way to win is to go against the book. After all the books were written by the casinos. :laugh: Can't buy that kind of entertainment.

 

[Sucker]

It's a double-edged sword. Sometimes they help, sometimes they hurt. A ploppy will often provide cover for an AP's stinky plays. When I see a ploppy split 5's; it makes it look much more natural in case I have to make the exact same split a couple of hands later.

 

[alwayssplitaces]

We should never split fives no matter what the count is. Ploppies split tens all the time.

 

[Blue Efficacy]

We should never split fives no matter what the count is.

This isn't something you should ever do, if you're just a card counter.

 

[Sucker]

This isn't something you should ever do, if you're just a card counter.

Absolutely correct.

 

[Helotes]

Playing with ploppies is comical at times. But it does seem that I play better with APs. Ploppies seem to bring bad mojo.

 

[zengrifter]

We should never split fives no matter what the count is.

Ploppy humor? zg

 

[Mewtwo]

I believe there are times that what a ploppy may do that "hurts" you in positive counts is more than made up for by other actions (or non-actions) that ploppy takes.

I loooooove playing with ploppies that are scared to make full doubles, and allow me to fill in the remaining portion of the double. So, so much +EV there.

 

[BigEd]

Players who do things like hit stiffs vs bust cards, split 10s, and hit hard 17 make the game worse for an AP.

Why?

They take up more cards, which takes time to deal the cards to them, takes time for the dealer to check to make sure they're sure, and causes less rounds to be dealt per shoe (so more shuffles per hand you see).

They also cause people to leave the table which means more time spent coloring up and buying in.

And people like you can take some of the enjoyment out of the experience, which is what the majority are there to do.

Ed

 

[pit15]

And people like you can take some of the enjoyment out of the experience, which is what the majority are there to do.

Ed

Well for the type of AP that I do, it's quite often that someone's occupying the seat that I need. So yes, I actively try to make people miserable/uncomfortable so they leave.

One time there was a guy (the degenerate type who plays the entire shift) in a seat that was worth about 800 bucks to me. So I take the spot next to it, sit as close to him as i can and refuse to move over when he asks. I offered to switch seats so he can have more space, he said he likes that spot so I stay put. He asks 2 more times before finally getting the hell out

When you're in a situation where you lose money for every hand a ploppy plays in that seat you tend to view them differently. Especially when the game is a $5 table and there's some asshole there who plays for hours to lose the $200 in grocery money that they can't afford to lose.

I don't see how it's "fun" or "entertaining" to sit at a casino table and play a game with a house edge. Watching a movie is entertaining. Going to the bar is fun. Losing your ass at a casino game isn't and I have no respect for people who gamble.

 

[alwayssplitaces]

As I said in another thread, I once had a dealer who only cut out .5 of a deck out of a 6 deck shoe. We were down to the last card which had to be a 7, 8, 9, 10, or ace because the running count was +1. Either the last card was a 10/ace or the dealer had a 10/ace. Ploppy at third base had a 15 and the dealer showed an 8. I had a max bet on 2 spots (which became 3 max bets because I split aces on one spot). My max bets were 2 21's and a 20 so it was a certain win if the ploppy didn't hit his 15. He was certain to bust or get an ace to make 16. If he stayed he would have a 50% chance of winning. I told him not to hit but the idiot wouldn't listen. He hit and busted and we ran out of cards. The dealer had a stiff and would have busted with the final ten and everyone would have won. The pit boss ruled the hand dead, pushed everyone's hands (even someone who had a natural) and made the dealer cut out 1.5 decks from then on. I was steaming at that idiot, he got the clue and left the table.

When I was playing in Vegas last week single and double deck overnight, I wanted to play heads up. Whenever someone joined my empty table, I'd tell them to wait for the shuffle (in a + count) or leave immediately for an empty table (in a - count). I just wanted to play heads up since I'd get half as many rounds with just one other person. And if there were 2 others at my table and the others had at least one player, I would spread to all the empty spots in a +2 or greater count and wong out at a - count. The pit boss had the impression that I was a crazy, losing player so I didn't get backed off for that. If the ploppies didn't leave because I was constantly changing the number of hands I play, they'd leave because they lost (and they'd lose faster with me since they're playing more rounds at - counts and fewer rounds at + counts). One time an (attractive) woman sat at my table. I asked her if she would leave if I split tens, and she said that she would. Just a few rounds later, the count's high and I get a 20 vs 6. I split and resplit the face cards, and sure enough she left and I feel no remorse.

 

[QFIT]

Other drivers are bad because they cause traffic.

 

[Coach R]

There are just as many negative counts as there are positive counts. Those ploppies help when they take those hits against a bad count. It slows the game at times, but that give you a little time to cover your counting w/ small talk.

 

[Shoofly]

I disagree that the biggest ploppy mistakes are hitting when they should stand. The biggest ploppy mistakes I see are standing on stiffs when they should hit, and standing on A7 when they should hit or double.