BlackJack School

[Tias858]

As you can see, this is my first post, I'm a huge noob. I was just wondering though, after completing the blackjack school on this website, how prepared would you say I would be to start going to the casinos to profit, rather than gamble as I do now?

Thanks
Boss Hogg Industries

 

[StandardDeviant]

As you can see, this is my first post, I'm a huge noob. I was just wondering though, after completing the blackjack school on this website, how prepared would you say I would be to start going to the casinos to profit, rather than gamble as I do now?

Thanks
Boss Hogg Industries

About as prepared as you would be to fly an airplane after having ridden in one a couple dozen times.

 

[StandardDeviant]

Your Plan

1. Take the course on this site
2. Read several BJ books
3. Learn basic strategy to the point where you know the correct play for all hands
4. Go to your local casino and play using basic strategy for 10-20 hours
5. Practice counting until you can count down a deck in 30 seconds
6. Then introduce counting while flat betting or using small ramps
7. Then learn some camouflage plays
8. Then learn money management and bet sizing
9. Then ramp to higher levels
10. Then learn how to deal with the losing streaks that come with this game

And then you'll be ready to play for profit at the casinos...

 

[kewljason]

1. Take the course on this site
2. Read several BJ books
3. Learn basic strategy to the point where you know the correct play for all hands
4. Go to your local casino and play using basic strategy for 10-20 hours
5. Practice counting until you can count down a deck in 30 seconds
6. Then introduce counting while flat betting or using small ramps
7. Then learn some camouflage plays
8. Then learn money management and bet sizing
9. Then ramp to higher levels
10. Then learn how to deal with the losing streaks that come with this game

And then you'll be ready to play for profit at the casinos...

I disagree with #4. You can take the course, read all you can and practice at home, including raising your beds. Learn everything you can and then when you are are ready, go to to the casino and play small stakes. I don't see where it's necessary to have that extra step in there where you go to the casino and give them more money while practicing basic stategy. BS can be practiced on-line and at home for free.

I also chuckle at #10. No offense to you SD, but you say that as if it's a peice of cake. This is definately the difficult part that can take years and many can never master. I'm not sure how one would go about "learning" this. I think it's something you have to experience.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

As you can see, this is my first post, I'm a huge noob. I was just wondering though, after completing the blackjack school on this website, how prepared would you say I would be to start going to the casinos to profit, rather than gamble as I do now?

Thanks
Boss Hogg Industries

As far as the things you do at the table, you are 100% prepared.

Next step is game selection. Deciding what games you are going to play and how isn't covered in the BJ School. That's what we're here for! What part of Canada do you live in?

 

[Tias858]

haha ya I was aware I had a ways to go, I just wasn't sure what to do to get there
Thanks though, I currently can count a deck in under 30 seconds, know basic strat, and now I have to learn how to bet and all that other stuff. The losing stuff will be probably the toughest to deal with, I'm sure. What great books do you all recommend?
And I am in Edmonton AB, we got a couple casinos here so its a good starting place I guess.

 

[Deathclutch]

As for books depends on what sort of system you want to use. My first book was Blackbelt in Blackjack by Arnold Snyder which was a good base for me to understand the game. The one that helped me the most was Blackjack Bluebook II by Fred Renzey.

 

[Tias858]

and a couple other little questions for you guys/gals.
1. What do you count the dealers first burn card as? Ignore it I'm imagining.
2. If your playing 1v1 against a dealer and you surrender, the dealer doesn't show the face down card, what do you count it as?
3. And in single deck BJ, if another player mucks there cards for whatever reason, what do you count them as?

 

[Tias858]

As for books depends on what sort of system you want to use. My first book was Blackbelt in Blackjack by Arnold Snyder which was a good base for me to understand the game. The one that helped me the most was Blackjack Bluebook II by Fred Renzey.

Thanks, i'll probably pick them up

 

[Finn Dog]

Then learn how to deal with the losing streaks that come with this game

With this also comes an adequate bankroll of 1000 units minimum. 2000 is even better. Just like you wouldn't start a small business with only 2 weeks of capital.

 

[kewljason]

and a couple other little questions for you guys/gals.
1. What do you count the dealers first burn card as? Ignore it I'm imagining.
2. If your playing 1v1 against a dealer and you surrender, the dealer doesn't show the face down card, what do you count it as?
3. And in single deck BJ, if another player mucks there cards for whatever reason, what do you count them as?

You count the cards that you see. The more you see the better. The one's you don't see, you treat the same as the cards behind the suffle point. So not seeing a large amount of cards basically decreases the penetration of the game.

 

[StandardDeviant]

I disagree with #4. You can take the course, read all you can and practice at home, including raising your beds. Learn everything you can and then when you are are ready, go to to the casino and play small stakes. I don't see where it's necessary to have that extra step in there where you go to the casino and give them more money while practicing basic stategy. BS can be practiced on-line and at home for free.

I also chuckle at #10. No offense to you SD, but you say that as if it's a peice of cake. This is definately the difficult part that can take years and many can never master. I'm not sure how one would go about "learning" this. I think it's something you have to experience.

I don't disagree with you on #4 KJ, i.e., about learning BS at home first. I should have made that step 3.5 . That said, I still advocate the in casino practice of BS as a step. It's one thing to recall the right plays in the quiet of one's home. It's a bit different to do it in a casino with real money on the line. Playing BS in the casino also helps a bit with #10, as the player will start to get a sense for how the game flows up and down over time.

And we're in agreement on #10. I included that item to indirectly make the very point that you're making explicitly. So many people seem to think that they will realize the EV of the game just because they know how to play, but 50% of all players who play flawlessly will be disappointed in that regard.

I thought about adding #11, "Play enough hours to reach significantly more than N0 hands." :grin:

 

[Tias858]

You count the cards that you see. The more you see the better. The one's you don't see, you treat the same as the cards behind the suffle point. So not seeing a large amount of cards basically decreases the penetration of the game.

Okay that's what I was thinking, thanks for all the advice:grin:

 

[Automatic Monkey]

In Alberta you have some excellent games available. Enjoy!

 

[Tias858]

In Alberta you have some excellent games available. Enjoy!

haha yeeeeaaa
I can't wait until I learn how to smoke the casinos
is it possible to work full time or part time and be a succesfull card counter?
or is it a full time, all day every day job

 

[Automatic Monkey]

haha yeeeeaaa
I can't wait until I learn how to smoke the casinos
is it possible to work full time or part time and be a succesfull card counter?
or is it a full time, all day every day job

Yes, and in fact when you have a job and aren't worried about outright bankruptcy due to losses, you can play more aggressively and win more per hour.

 

[kewljason]

haha yeeeeaaa
I can't wait until I learn how to smoke the casinos
is it possible to work full time or part time and be a succesfull card counter?
or is it a full time, all day every day job

I think you may be getting a bit ahead of yourself here. Since you asked about books earlier, I wanted to mention Modern Blackjack which is a fantastic resource, especially for new players. It covers a wide range of material and is easy to read and understand. Best of all you can read it for free on line, thanks to the generosity of the author. http://www.qfit.com/book/ While there you should check out the entire qfit site. There is a ton of other valuable information and resourses available there.

 

[bj21abc]

Bankroll

There seems to be a consensus - at least in books - of a "one size fits all" bankroll. I guess if you are just starting out you could use a rule of thumb, but I still feel it's wrong to do so.

1. What game you are playing and where ?
2. What is an acceptable WR ? (assuming a realistic rounds/hr figure)
3. What is your counting system ?
which leads us to a betting strategy as well as an SD/100 rounds.

4. What is the purpose of your play (recreation, semipro, pro) ?
5. What will happen if you lose all your BR ? Half of it ? Can you define an acceptable level of risk for losing it all ?
=> and we can then work on RoR

which gives us a real, custom-built BR requirement....
Obviously these are all interlinked and not all answers are straightforwards - but I am a big believer in working out BR (or having someone work it out for you)

D.

With this also comes an adequate bankroll of 1000 units minimum. 2000 is even better. Just like you wouldn't start a small business with only 2 weeks of capital.

 

[daddybo]

Awww come on guys... you all know, in the end, "The School of Hard Knocks" is the best teacher. You really have to get whacked a few times before the learning gets serious. Go Play ... Screw up.. Learn. There is always tomorrow.

 

[kewljason]

There seems to be a consensus - at least in books - of a "one size fits all" bankroll. I guess if you are just starting out you could use a rule of thumb, but I still feel it's wrong to do so.

1. What game you are playing and where ?
2. What is an acceptable WR ? (assuming a realistic rounds/hr figure)
3. What is your counting system ?
which leads us to a betting strategy as well as an SD/100 rounds.

4. What is the purpose of your play (recreation, semipro, pro) ?
5. What will happen if you lose all your BR ? Half of it ? Can you define an acceptable level of risk for losing it all ?
=> and we can then work on RoR

which gives us a real, custom-built BR requirement....
Obviously these are all interlinked and not all answers are straightforwards - but I am a big believer in working out BR (or having someone work it out for you)

D.

In defense of Finn Dog's post concerning 1000 units minimums. I think he was just generalizing in an attempt to impress the need for a large BR. Often people new to counting don't understand this need or have been mislead, as a recent poster BJkid was by reading Revere's book which stated that a 200 unit BR was sufficent. Whether Revere was talking of the good single deck games of the time or just giving misleading money management advise, (which he had been known to do), that info is just not valid today. This 1000 unit minimun, while a generalization is more in line with what is needed.