Building up knowledge before I go

[aneuzil21]

Hey! Thanks for reading!

I've been checking out the forums for a few months now. You guys give some great advice! I'm trying to learn everything I can before hitting a casino to count. Aside from the movie 21 and the book "Bringing Down the House," I've gotten most help reading through these forums and playing at home...and the Strategy Trainer online.

I have a few questions. Let me let you know where I'm at first.

I've been playing Blackjack for about 10 years and have BS down. I started counting about 4 months ago. I can count through a deck in about 30 seconds. I'm a math major and I have a 2 and 3 year old so I can handle the potential distractions...I think. I am justing using basic HI-LO and have been able to rope some family and friends into playing with me so I can practice counting. I am pretty confident that I can sit at a full table and keep up without losing the count.

Here's my first question: Bankroll? Where do I begin? I get the gist, just not the details. I probably wouldn't want to bring more than $300 my first time out...if I want to be able to pay my mortgage. So, how do I bet according to the count? I could use someone to go over betting units with me if you will.

I'm real close to the Grand Victoria in Elgin. They have several 6 deck table and a single deck. I was hoping to go early enough in the day to find a $5 single deck opening. Any advice?

I'm sure I'll be posting a lot here and I really appreciate whatever you guys have to offer.

Thanks,
Angela

 

[zengrifter]

I can count through a deck in about 30 seconds. I'm a math major and I have a 2 and 3 year old so I can handle the potential distractions...I think. I am justing using basic HI-LO and have been able to rope some family and friends into playing with me so I can practice counting. I am pretty confident that I can sit at a full table and keep up without losing the count.

Your speed needs to be under 20 seconds, two at a time face up. (see ZGI) zg

 

[FLASH1296]

Implausible Card Counting in "BJ Hell" [Elgin, IL]



Z.G. and I agree. Twenty Seconds with 99% accuracy.
That is with a simple Level One count e.g. Hi-Lo.

The Grand Victoria's 6 deckers are H17 with 2 decks cut off,
rivaling the nation's worst venue for BJ.

The House Advantage for that game is .63%
Marginal games are are around -.35 to -.40
Good opportunities are around -.30 to -.35.
Excellent games offer -.18 to -.25

Of course, penetration trumps House Advantage, but getting 2 decks cut off of 6 is an absurd 67% penetration.

Guidelines for shoe games:

Marginal: 75%
GOOD: 83%
EXCELLENT: 88%

Their minimum stakes are $15.

At minimum you need a disposable bankroll that is equivalent to (at least) 100 MAX BETS. With such an atrocious game you need to spread 40 to one in order to beat the game. Ergo 40 x 15 x 100 = $60,000; BUT basically this game is NOT beatable.

A young married guy rarely has that much discretionary funds that they can afford to lose without depriving their family of anything.

 

[aneuzil21]

Or woman... (-;

 

[aneuzil21]

Other Casinos?

What about Dubuque, IA? They have 2 casinos and I have family near-by. Anyone know about them?

 

[FLASH1296]

Info for BJ, almost anywhere in North America is to be found in the monthly C.B.J.N. - "Current Blackjack News"

In Iowa there are 7 casinos. All are pretty poor.

You asked about Dubuque, that means:

Diamond Jo

8 tables: 6 decks H17 1.2 decks cut off $5-$500
3 tables: C.S.M.'

You already know that this dreadful excuse for a BJ game offers a House Edge of .63%
BUT at least the penetration was quite good.

I say "WAS" because C.B.J.N. has not had a report on conditions there in the last 5 yrs., 2 months. Not exactly a popular place to play, and the CURRENT conditions could be better or worse. Five Years is an eternity in the world of casinos !

 

[aneuzil21]

So close...

So, I went to the boat yesterday hoping to find a $10-$15 dollar, but minimum's were $25. So, I just stood behind a six deck table and shamelessly counted to see if I could keep up. I kept up just fine, but I now see why everyone says that 3rd base is the best. It gives you a second to breathe. They did cut off at about 2 decks. Dealer hits on soft 17. You can double anything and double after splitting.

I want to try it out when it's a little cheaper and a little slower. They also don't have there single deck table anymore. )-:

I'll keep you all posted!

Thanks again!

 

[aneuzil21]

One more thing...

Does anyone know where I can find a free online game that deals to multiple players? I LOVE the strategy trainer on this site, but a multi-player would be great.

Thanks!

 

[FLASH1296]

aneuzil,

As a newbie you need to focus on table conditions.

A game with 6 or 8 decks that is H17 AND 2 decks cut off is NOT a beatable game.

It cannot be attacked without a huge spread and a commensurate huge bankroll.

Presuming a $15 minimum you'll need a bankroll of $60,000 - $75,000

Then, when you are sen to be spreading 30 or 40 to 1 you are tapped on the shoulder and told to "take a hike".

 

[aneuzil21]

I hear ya, but I need to practice somewhere other than my kitchen??? What do you recommend? Can I just back-count and jump in for a few hands when the count is high and jump out when it drops?

I really want to be able to do this. I have to build up $$$ though.

I can't imagine that serious counters all start with a $20K bankroll, right? Guide me, wise one...lol.

 

[FLASH1296]

Serious Counters only become "serious" after they go broke trying to count cards with an inadequate bankroll.

Most give up the efforts to defy mathematics - betting while undercapitalized.

A select few (certainly less than 1 %) become "serious" and learn that, like any business, BJ requires considerable capital.

 

[Billy C1]

Dubuque

You actually have 2 choices in Dubuque. Diamond Jo opened their new casino this month and the Greyhound Park dog track has an attached casino.

Billy C1

 

[aneuzil21]

Another one...

O.K. How quickly to you use your max bet? If you sit down at a 6 deck table, say $10 minimum units, and after 1 deck, the count is at a +10, do you bet your max units only 1 deck in?

 

[FLASH1296]

Where you are in the shoe is of NO consequence whatsoever.

What True Count you use to bet that much is important.
It is different depending on several variables.

 

[Billy C1]

Where you are in the shoe is of NO consequence whatsoever.

What True Count you use to bet that much is important.
It is different depending on several variables.

???????? I thought true count meant true count!

Billy C1

 

[Billy C1]

Sorry FLASH1296--------disregard post #15

Billy C1

 

[FLASH1296]

aneuzil21

Here is my advice to you:

It is clear that you actually do not know the first thing about Card Counting.

What you need to know is that "practice" at playing hands is not important at this early stage in your education and training.

You need to be able to count down a deck VERY quickly and with 99% accuracy.

You need to understand Basic Strategy for all games, and focusing on your home base, be able to make 100% accurate decisions instantaneously.

THAT practice you need.

Meanwhile, go to BJ21.com and study the archives there so that you can LEARN everything that you need to LEARN.

Nothing worthwhile comes easy. Effort and Study are required.

So ... go to: http://bj21.com/

Look at the left side of the page and note where it says "Card Counting"

... now begin your journey.

 

[Blue Efficacy]

You're lucky enough to be a woman. Use that to your advantage. Pit critters will be less suspect of you. Also, if you're attractive you can use flirting to your advantage. This can deflect heat if the pit critters are certain types of personality, also it can help convince chickens to sell you doubledowns and splits.

 

[FLASH1296]

Extra [Sincere] Advice.

Also there are just a few books that you need to read.

Most important is - "Blackjack Attack" (3rd edition) by Don Schlesinger.

If you cannot afford to read or are unwilling to study, you will not succeed.

If you cannot easily part with $25 (at this time), you can obtain a used
copy for just $12, the price of a mediocre dinner that will just turn to sh*t.
Less than a minimum bet in the casino that you mentioned.

http://product.half.ebay.com/Blackjack-Attack_W0QQprZ45409858QQtgZinfo

"Get with the program", son.

 

[Martin Gayle]

O.K. How quickly to you use your max bet? If you sit down at a 6 deck table, say $10 minimum units, and after 1 deck, the count is at a +10, do you bet your max units only 1 deck in?

DO NOT TRY TO COUNT CARDS WITH MONEY ON THE TABLE UNTIL YOU DO NOT NEED TO ASK THIS QUESTION!!!!!!

If you need your money in action then go for it. Flat bet at the table minimum. Make sure you know how to interact with players, dealers, give hand signals etc. Play basic strategy with the distractions of a casino. Do not even think about max bets or $60,000 bankrolls...yet. Learn how to play black jack. You might not like it. Casino gambling, like LSD, isn't for everyone but everyone should try it.

Work on your counting at home. Try to count a deck down over commercial breaks, when you are sitting on the toilet, when you are driving, at job interviews, while you are applying for another mortage. Also, read, read, read. There are lots of books. I recommend Arnold Snyder's Blackbelt in Blackjack - it is relavant and will lead you from the basics, through a level 2 count, right through to inspiring you into pro-team play, shuffle tracking etc.

Don't become discouraged, it is hard at first, the learning curve is drastic, do not expect to get rich over night, but you will get better every night and will learn something everytime out. Counting cards is a grind, it's not like Rain Man. With a reasonable $5000 replenishable bank roll and half Kelly betting, expect to make $5-$10/hr (one or two bets if you play everyhand). Nothing to quit you day job over but it is more fun. It;s not all about the money, the money is just a way to keep score.