Can someone with CV rate my style of play?

[richiverse]

I use hi-lo with a side Ace-5 count. I use about a 16 point bet spread with my max bet at 200. I will cut this max bet in half if my trip roll gets cut in half and increase it by 25 if i double my trip roll. I use illustrious 18 indexes as well.

The tables I normally play on are 6 deck, manual shuffle, stand on s17 with a 5 to 25 $ minimum.

The way I bet using my counts is to use the true count and add an additional bet for any +1 increment of the ace-5 side count. If the ace-5 count is above +6 but my count is negative I would play 2 hands with double the minimum. I will usually play 2 hands at the table min if the count is negative to burn cards. I'll also burn about $5 an hour on tokes for the dealer and to get the pit boss off my back.

This system has been working EXTREMELY well for me in my last 7 trips. I would like to confirm that there is statistical edge from using this system.

thanks!

 

[RJT]

This too seems to be better placed in the Advanced Techniques forum rather than the card counting forum?

RJT

 

[creeping panther]

Rich

I use hi-lo with a side Ace-5 count. I use about a 16 point bet spread with my max bet at 200. I will cut this max bet in half if my trip roll gets cut in half and increase it by 25 if i double my trip roll. I use illustrious 18 indexes as well.

The tables I normally play on are 6 deck, manual shuffle, stand on s17 with a 5 to 25 $ minimum.

The way I bet using my counts is to use the true count and add an additional bet for any +1 increment of the ace-5 side count. If the ace-5 count is above +6 but my count is negative I would play 2 hands with double the minimum. I will usually play 2 hands at the table min if the count is negative to burn cards. I'll also burn about $5 an hour on tokes for the dealer and to get the pit boss off my back.

This system has been working EXTREMELY well for me in my last 7 trips. I would like to confirm that there is statistical edge from using this system.

thanks!

I would like to commend you on your different approach to beating the game.

We need thinkers such as yourself.:1st:

I also use Hi-LO plus my own variation which I call Hi-LOLO, which is somewhat similar to yours. I, however, only use mine in DD and then only when rested and approaching being in the... ZONE. As with your experience I have found it to be very powerfull in my attacking the DD Game.

CP

 

[richiverse]

After reading about the viability of the Ace-5 count I usually get my brother or another friend to help with that count. I wouldn't be able to keep both counts on my own.

I have a very LOOSE style of play in that my running count and current table action will sway my bias for the dealer card as well as the card I take. It takes a toll on my mind but I find that it helps. I know BS and the indexes and I use it to my advantage.

If thee Ace-5 count is negative I will be more conservative in my betting. If moderately positive I add a chip or 2. In a situation where I've got a decent bet down I'll ask for the exact count to alter my decision.

In my experience, BS is a SOLID reinforcement of what to do in close situations but when the count goes to extremes you gotta go with the probabilities.

In my last 7 trips I've played about 30 hours on avg and have netted 7k in that span. The worst I ever do at a table is either lose VERY little (less than -200, which is very small for my max bet size) or I am up 500 to 2000. There has only been one instance where I lost 1200 in a span of 4-5 hands but I made it all back in the next 10 or so hands.

Last weekend I thought my system was over and done with when I went on a SERIOUS unlucky streak. My trip roll is about 2000 and I had literally burned my first 1700 before making 2300 back for a net of 600 that trip. I am a pretty conservative gambler so I'm still surprised that my system is working. I'm going back in a couple of weeks and will report back my findings. My GUT feeling is telling me that I am making 20%-25% more while using this system vs just HI-LO where the swings are higher and the risk of loss is real. I feel that this system negates those -500 trips and while the risk of being down by x amount is still real, the odds of being up 1-2k are much much higher and more frequent.

 

[rukus]

After reading about the viability of the Ace-5 count I usually get my brother or another friend to help with that count. I wouldn't be able to keep both counts on my own.

I have a very LOOSE style of play in that my running count and current table action will sway my bias for the dealer card as well as the card I take. It takes a toll on my mind but I find that it helps. I know BS and the indexes and I use it to my advantage.

If thee Ace-5 count is negative I will be more conservative in my betting. If moderately positive I add a chip or 2. In a situation where I've got a decent bet down I'll ask for the exact count to alter my decision.

In my experience, BS is a SOLID reinforcement of what to do in close situations but when the count goes to extremes you gotta go with the probabilities.

In my last 7 trips I've played about 30 hours on avg and have netted 7k in that span. The worst I ever do at a table is either lose VERY little (less than -200, which is very small for my max bet size) or I am up 500 to 2000. There has only been one instance where I lost 1200 in a span of 4-5 hands but I made it all back in the next 10 or so hands.

Last weekend I thought my system was over and done with when I went on a SERIOUS unlucky streak. My trip roll is about 2000 and I had literally burned my first 1700 before making 2300 back for a net of 600 that trip. I am a pretty conservative gambler so I'm still surprised that my system is working. I'm going back in a couple of weeks and will report back my findings. My GUT feeling is telling me that I am making 20%-25% more while using this system vs just HI-LO where the swings are higher and the risk of loss is real. I feel that this system negates those -500 trips and while the risk of being down by x amount is still real, the odds of being up 1-2k are much much higher and more frequent.

i think this should be in the voodoo section

 

[creeping panther]

Rukus

i think this should be in the voodoo section

Give the guy a chance.

What do you find Vodoo, because he mentioned badluck?

Badluck=negative variance, flip sides of the same coin.

Now I do not like the fact that he does not play the count system himself but needs a helper. This is a definite cause of concern and that fact in and of itself negates the attractivness of his count system.

But Vodoo, I don't see it.

CP

 

[rukus]

Give the guy a chance.

What do you find Vodoo, because he mentioned badluck?

Badluck=negative variance, flip sides of the same coin.

Now I do not like the fact that he does not play the count system himself but needs a helper. This is a definite cause of concern and that fact in and of itself negates the attractivness of his count system.

But Vodoo, I don't see it.

CP

all of this:

In my last 7 trips I've played about 30 hours on avg and have netted 7k in that span. The worst I ever do at a table is either lose VERY little (less than -200, which is very small for my max bet size) or I am up 500 to 2000. There has only been one instance where I lost 1200 in a span of 4-5 hands but I made it all back in the next 10 or so hands.

Last weekend I thought my system was over and done with when I went on a SERIOUS unlucky streak. My trip roll is about 2000 and I had literally burned my first 1700 before making 2300 back for a net of 600 that trip. I am a pretty conservative gambler so I'm still surprised that my system is working. I'm going back in a couple of weeks and will report back my findings. My GUT feeling is telling me that I am making 20%-25% more while using this system vs just HI-LO where the swings are higher and the risk of loss is real. I feel that this system negates those -500 trips and while the risk of being down by x amount is still real, the odds of being up 1-2k are much much higher and more frequent.

. seems like a pretty mathematically rigorous proof of the "system" to me. in fact, rigorous enough to be put in the advanced techniques section.

 

[creeping panther]

Rukus

all of this:
. seems like a pretty mathematically rigorous proof of the "system" to me. in fact, rigorous enough to be put in the advanced techniques section.

This is not the Inquisition.

Sure he makes some claims not backed up by anything, that was evident in the first post, but Thorp also had many of the same feelings when he first took a stab at AP play.

The guy is using math to attack the game and then going out on a limb on parts of it, but he is venturing out and trying something different...it is called research.

I, for one, am happy to read what he has to say, I have an open and curious mind. No harm has been done.

CP

 

[rukus]

This is not the Inquisition.

Sure he makes some claims not backed up by anything, that was evident in the first post, but Thorp also had many of the same feelings when he first took a stab at AP play.

im not trying to argue with you here and im not saying any real harm has been done, only that this seems to be in the wrong section of the board.

The guy is using math to attack the game and then going out on a limb on parts of it, but he is venturing out and trying something different...it is called research.

if you ask me, id characterize progression system players as "going out on a limb" and "trying something different" as well. (not equating the OPs system to progression betting schemes at all, just saying that in my head his system is no advanced technique and may not even be mathematically advantageous either.)

im done with this, see RJT's other post in this section.

 

[Pro21]

Don't the administrators have the ability to move threads?

Doesn't the Hi Lo have like a 98% betting efficiency? What do you think you will gain by adding A/5 count? My bet is less than you will lose by making mistakes trying to do both.

 

[moo321]

Don't the administrators have the ability to move threads?

Doesn't the Hi Lo have like a 98% betting efficiency? What do you think you will gain by adding A/5 count? My bet is less than you will lose by making mistakes trying to do both.

I would actually recommend side counting aces or sevens rather than the ace-five count. But if you're gonna side count aces, why use hi-lo at all?

 

[FLASH1296]

Using an Ace-Five side count to buttress Hi-Lo is O.K. inasmuch as it has (some) value.

However, I would certainly recommend investing all of that effort in learning a stronger count.

As you play shoe games, the ZEN COUNT is the way to go. R.P.C is another fine choice.

 

[richiverse]

Using an Ace-Five side count to buttress Hi-Lo is O.K. inasmuch as it has (some) value.

However, I would certainly recommend investing all of that effort in learning a stronger count.

As you play shoe games, the ZEN COUNT is the way to go. R.P.C is another fine choice.

Right, thanks! I've played many 100's of hours of Blackjack and am noticing a significant increase in wins using this system. I am still skeptical of it given the 7 trip streak which I've never gotten close to playing just hi-lo.

If I am alone playing I will give the zen count a shot. I think I'll be able to get er done. Is there any way I should be playing differently than hi-lo with the zen count?

One thing I am amending given the last bit of bad luck is to win $500 first within a max bet of 100 before uping it to the normal 200. Unlucky streaks will happen under any system and what better way to pad it then decreasing ur max bet slightly at the get go.

thanks again guys.

 

[richiverse]

I played again at Ceasars and Wild Wild West with another friend helping me out (wasn't that great a counter) with sub-optimal results. In about 16 hours or so of play I only made $250 net. I also made $350 net the next day at mohegan sun.

Not a stellar week but I did play 3 poker tournaments and I kept the streak alive at 9 trips.

From my observations:
- I play at 10-15 min tables. I should really be betting 25 when the true count is -1 or better and more towards the minimum when it is lower.
- Sticking to your max bet is vital.
- Playing conservatively when you are down is far superior to chasing your losses.
- Get rest, eat well, and don't play longer than 6 hour sessions.
- never ever ever ever leave a table at a positive count.
- Do play moderately aggressively when you are up and the count is astronomical.

For relaying the A-5 count from your friend. Say the number in french or japanese or whatever language you think most of the dealers/pit bosses won't know. It WILL sound foreign enough to them to ignore it.

So overall I was not pleased with the results and I think it's a function of the minimum of which I played. I have adjusted accordingly and will be going back to AC in 2 weeks. I plan on making something like 60-120/hr in about 10-20 hours of play. I will stick to the 10-15 min tables because there is value in staying at the table in good conditions and just burning cards.

I will try practicing on the zen count, haven't had much time but it's def harder than hi-lo.