Cashing out chips, backed off-ID
- Thread starter Cass
- Start date
Once, when I went to the cage with about 3K in chips, I was asked for ID. I asked why and they said they needed to be sure I didn't have a marker out. I pointed to the pit where I was playing and said, "Ask them. I don't have ID on me." They cashed out my chips. No backoff was involved.
Your other option is simply walking out the door and coming back next shift to cash out.
Your other option is simply walking out the door and coming back next shift to cash out.
21forme said:
Once, when I went to the cage with about 3K in chips, I was asked for ID. I asked why and they said they needed to be sure I didn't have a marker out. I pointed to the pit where I was playing and said, "Ask them. I don't have ID on me." They cashed out my chips. No backoff was involved.
Your other option is simply walking out the door and coming back next shift to cash out.
Your other option is simply walking out the door and coming back next shift to cash out.
So just tell them I dont have it on me I guess...Just seems like they always ask for ID when **** is coming down and i usually give it to them
It's very common
I've been hassled for Id around 7 times at the cage. Yes, they will not cash your chips. It's not correct, but Indian casinos have done the same to many patrons. Gaming have never helped me in all of these cases. You have the option to contest your chips later-they will give you some receipt. To be honest, there is very less chance that you can get your money without Id. The best option is: Do not cashout when in heat. If they already had your chips, ask them to return chips. Do not sign the receipt..
I've been hassled for Id around 7 times at the cage. Yes, they will not cash your chips. It's not correct, but Indian casinos have done the same to many patrons. Gaming have never helped me in all of these cases. You have the option to contest your chips later-they will give you some receipt. To be honest, there is very less chance that you can get your money without Id. The best option is: Do not cashout when in heat. If they already had your chips, ask them to return chips. Do not sign the receipt..
If you attempt to cash out more than $10,000 you are legally required to produce I.D., as per federal law. For any amount less, the answer is no, although they will lie to you every single time, and tell you that you legally MUST show it.
The best option is always to just leave, and worry about cashing out later. One additional reason to NOT go to the cage: That's where the best cameras are, and they'll be able to get the best possible picture of you.
The best option is always to just leave, and worry about cashing out later. One additional reason to NOT go to the cage: That's where the best cameras are, and they'll be able to get the best possible picture of you.
Dont show your ID. Just leave and cash them on a different shift. Cass I play in the same joints as you and they all try and give you BS reasons why you have to show ID. Its happened to my playing partners and I several times. Just walk out and you should have no problems. The casinos know they cant do anything.
Per FEDERAL law, all transactions/series of transactions above $10k must have ID.
However, per compliance with gaming regulations, they must start tracking this as low as $3000. It is not to withhold taxes. It really isn't a big deal, and it has nothing to do with the pits. Usually table games and cage don't communicate.
As someone who used to work in a cage, I can tell you you will draw more heat if you refuse and it is really annoying as well... it's better to just show id and try to blend in with the crowd than be one of the few who actually refuses ID.
However, per compliance with gaming regulations, they must start tracking this as low as $3000. It is not to withhold taxes. It really isn't a big deal, and it has nothing to do with the pits. Usually table games and cage don't communicate.
As someone who used to work in a cage, I can tell you you will draw more heat if you refuse and it is really annoying as well... it's better to just show id and try to blend in with the crowd than be one of the few who actually refuses ID.
Cass said:
If i'm playing unrated at a casino and told to go cash out my chips and leave.... They ask for my ID do I need to show it? Will they still cash me out without ID. What do you do in this situation?
Casinos often use cashing out at the cage as an opportunity to get ID, or to get a better photo, or to escalate a backoff into a permanent 86ing. You don't want to give them the chance. If you've been playing unrated, and haven't given a name, the casino has no convenient way to keep a record of your play, and you can probably return on another shift, or a few months later on the same shift. If you stick around after a backoff, only bad things can happen.
Ditto after a big win. Just walk out with the chips if you can. Barrings and backoffs frequently occur at the cage. Don't give management time to get their act together and decide to tell you something you don't want to hear.
$3,000 is a cashout threshold for requesting ID in many casinos. So if you want to remain anonymous, keep cashouts below that level. Once the casino requests ID, even though the casino may have no legal right to do so, you may be put to a choice between complying or walking out with your chips uncashed. If you don't like it, you can complain to the gaming regulatory authorities, but to do so you're going to have to give your name, which immediately gets back to the casino and defeats the purpose.
Good points
Good points WRX.
WRX said:
Some who have responded seem to have overlooked the part of Cass' question explaining that the casino said to "cash out my chips and leave." In that situation, if at all possible, don't cash your chips, just pocket them and walk quickly and quietly out the door. You can come back later, and cash your chips a little at a time, or get friends to help.
Casinos often use cashing out at the cage as an opportunity to get ID, or to get a better photo, or to escalate a backoff into a permanent 86ing. You don't want to give them the chance. If you've been playing unrated, and haven't given a name, the casino has no convenient way to keep a record of your play, and you can probably return on another shift, or a few months later on the same shift. If you stick around after a backoff, only bad things can happen.
Ditto after a big win. Just walk out with the chips if you can. Barrings and backoffs frequently occur at the cage. Don't give management time to get their act together and decide to tell you something you don't want to hear.
$3,000 is a cashout threshold for requesting ID in many casinos. So if you want to remain anonymous, keep cashouts below that level. Once the casino requests ID, even though the casino may have no legal right to do so, you may be put to a choice between complying or walking out with your chips uncashed. If you don't like it, you can complain to the gaming regulatory authorities, but to do so you're going to have to give your name, which immediately gets back to the casino and defeats the purpose.
Casinos often use cashing out at the cage as an opportunity to get ID, or to get a better photo, or to escalate a backoff into a permanent 86ing. You don't want to give them the chance. If you've been playing unrated, and haven't given a name, the casino has no convenient way to keep a record of your play, and you can probably return on another shift, or a few months later on the same shift. If you stick around after a backoff, only bad things can happen.
Ditto after a big win. Just walk out with the chips if you can. Barrings and backoffs frequently occur at the cage. Don't give management time to get their act together and decide to tell you something you don't want to hear.
$3,000 is a cashout threshold for requesting ID in many casinos. So if you want to remain anonymous, keep cashouts below that level. Once the casino requests ID, even though the casino may have no legal right to do so, you may be put to a choice between complying or walking out with your chips uncashed. If you don't like it, you can complain to the gaming regulatory authorities, but to do so you're going to have to give your name, which immediately gets back to the casino and defeats the purpose.
Good points WRX.
WRX said:
Some who have responded seem to have overlooked the part of Cass' question explaining that the casino said to "cash out my chips and leave." In that situation, if at all possible, don't cash your chips, just pocket them and walk quickly and quietly out the door. You can come back later, and cash your chips a little at a time, or get friends to help.
Casinos often use cashing out at the cage as an opportunity to get ID, or to get a better photo, or to escalate a backoff into a permanent 86ing. You don't want to give them the chance. If you've been playing unrated, and haven't given a name, the casino has no convenient way to keep a record of your play, and you can probably return on another shift, or a few months later on the same shift. If you stick around after a backoff, only bad things can happen.
Ditto after a big win. Just walk out with the chips if you can. Barrings and backoffs frequently occur at the cage. Don't give management time to get their act together and decide to tell you something you don't want to hear.
$3,000 is a cashout threshold for requesting ID in many casinos. So if you want to remain anonymous, keep cashouts below that level. Once the casino requests ID, even though the casino may have no legal right to do so, you may be put to a choice between complying or walking out with your chips uncashed. If you don't like it, you can complain to the gaming regulatory authorities, but to do so you're going to have to give your name, which immediately gets back to the casino and defeats the purpose.
Casinos often use cashing out at the cage as an opportunity to get ID, or to get a better photo, or to escalate a backoff into a permanent 86ing. You don't want to give them the chance. If you've been playing unrated, and haven't given a name, the casino has no convenient way to keep a record of your play, and you can probably return on another shift, or a few months later on the same shift. If you stick around after a backoff, only bad things can happen.
Ditto after a big win. Just walk out with the chips if you can. Barrings and backoffs frequently occur at the cage. Don't give management time to get their act together and decide to tell you something you don't want to hear.
$3,000 is a cashout threshold for requesting ID in many casinos. So if you want to remain anonymous, keep cashouts below that level. Once the casino requests ID, even though the casino may have no legal right to do so, you may be put to a choice between complying or walking out with your chips uncashed. If you don't like it, you can complain to the gaming regulatory authorities, but to do so you're going to have to give your name, which immediately gets back to the casino and defeats the purpose.
Just Leave!!!
Anytime you are backed off you should just LEAVE with your chips. Sell them to a friend or come back in a few days on a different shift and cash them out in smaller increments. Don't let the pit color you up to any denomination hard to cash. The best photos of you come at the cage. The best chance for the casino to abuse you for your ID is at the cage...this is where they have the most leverage. Wonder why they almost never ask you for ID in the pit? You have the leverage when you have cash. When you have chips they have the leverage.
Just leave
Cass said:
If i'm playing unrated at a casino and told to go cash out my chips and leave.... They ask for my ID do I need to show it? Will they still cash me out without ID. What do you do in this situation?
Just leave
I've cashed >$5k at an Indian casino and refused ID. They did cash me out, but I believe I overheard the cashier telling her supervisor (who had to be present for that size cashout) that I lied to her, so I suspect a SAR may have been filed, and I know they called the pit as I was leaving. I later learned from another AP that several other players have been backed off after winning approximately what I won that session, so I was likely pushing my luck at that place that trip anyway. It will be a few months before I make it back there, so hopefully no one will remember me then.
At another place where I am well known to the table games staff, I recently tried to cash in just over $3k in chips and was asked for ID. I'm known there and play on my real name, etc., so I gave the cashier my ID, but not before complaining that it shouldn't be required because they already have it on file. Then she handed me a form to fill out. A W9! They wanted me to provide my SSN just to cash the chips! She told me it was required for any cashout over $2500. Internal procedure. I raised hell but eventually gave in and filled out the form, only because this place already had my SSN on file from a previous session and because I thought I'd already made enough of a scene. In the future I'll probably keep cashouts below $2500 at that place, but I won't hide that fact since I feel in this case that being open about it will be less suspicious since it will be clear that I'm not trying to trick them or hide anything from them. Besides, the table games staff will already know my session result, so there's nothing left to hide.
Note that neither of these situations involved a backoff, so obviously it isn't a lot of help to you, but it does illustrate that different places have very different tolerances for (relatively) large cashouts.
At another place where I am well known to the table games staff, I recently tried to cash in just over $3k in chips and was asked for ID. I'm known there and play on my real name, etc., so I gave the cashier my ID, but not before complaining that it shouldn't be required because they already have it on file. Then she handed me a form to fill out. A W9! They wanted me to provide my SSN just to cash the chips! She told me it was required for any cashout over $2500. Internal procedure. I raised hell but eventually gave in and filled out the form, only because this place already had my SSN on file from a previous session and because I thought I'd already made enough of a scene. In the future I'll probably keep cashouts below $2500 at that place, but I won't hide that fact since I feel in this case that being open about it will be less suspicious since it will be clear that I'm not trying to trick them or hide anything from them. Besides, the table games staff will already know my session result, so there's nothing left to hide.
Note that neither of these situations involved a backoff, so obviously it isn't a lot of help to you, but it does illustrate that different places have very different tolerances for (relatively) large cashouts.
Don't make waves
I believe the IRS requires that any cashier, of any business, track, in house any cash transaction in excess of $3000, and report to the IRS, DEA and Secret Service one, or any combination of transactions that exceed $10,000 in a 24 hour period. If that report (IRS form 106, 106-N in Nevada) is filed for multiple transactions in a 24 hour period, a Suspicious Activity Report (IRS form SAR) is also filed because of the percieved risk of currency "structuring." It is illegal to "structure" transactions to circumvent the Currency Transfer Report (106-N) from being filed. The claim is this creates the apperance of money laundering, tax evading, or drug proceeds.
Yes, I speak from experience. I have found it best to comply with an ID request and leave the house with the cash. Making as little noise as possible buys you the best odds of being able to play in that Casino again later on.
Under no circustances do you comply with a request or demand to be detained on the premises!
I believe the IRS requires that any cashier, of any business, track, in house any cash transaction in excess of $3000, and report to the IRS, DEA and Secret Service one, or any combination of transactions that exceed $10,000 in a 24 hour period. If that report (IRS form 106, 106-N in Nevada) is filed for multiple transactions in a 24 hour period, a Suspicious Activity Report (IRS form SAR) is also filed because of the percieved risk of currency "structuring." It is illegal to "structure" transactions to circumvent the Currency Transfer Report (106-N) from being filed. The claim is this creates the apperance of money laundering, tax evading, or drug proceeds.
Yes, I speak from experience. I have found it best to comply with an ID request and leave the house with the cash. Making as little noise as possible buys you the best odds of being able to play in that Casino again later on.
Under no circustances do you comply with a request or demand to be detained on the premises!