Foxwoods
- Thread starter Z
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Re: East coast blackjack is the pits
>>If you're a total novice, you may find Foxwoods worthwhile for practice, but >>otherwise I'd rather save my bankroll for trips to Vegas.
Thats essentially my other option, don't take Foxwoods too seriously - just use it for practice for the true "big game". I live within an hour of both CT casinos, so if I can find "good" conditions there I could get there much more often than Vegas. I won't be inclined to try to beat the CT games though if it just isn't worth it (a judgement call).
>>By the way, it's tough to find nickel tables at Foxwoods and the Slum, and >>sometimes there aren't any ten dollar tables either.
You are correct on this, I go to Foxwoods often enough I should have thought of that - I've never played much live BJ though. Nickel tables are always mobbed at both places, I wouldn't even bother playing them. I can do $10 and $15 tables at this point, but any more than that would be tough to stomach until I gain some experience. I can do easy weeknight trips, and I am sure I've seen $10 tables on weeknights before.
Thanks for the input!
>>If you're a total novice, you may find Foxwoods worthwhile for practice, but >>otherwise I'd rather save my bankroll for trips to Vegas.
Thats essentially my other option, don't take Foxwoods too seriously - just use it for practice for the true "big game". I live within an hour of both CT casinos, so if I can find "good" conditions there I could get there much more often than Vegas. I won't be inclined to try to beat the CT games though if it just isn't worth it (a judgement call).
>>By the way, it's tough to find nickel tables at Foxwoods and the Slum, and >>sometimes there aren't any ten dollar tables either.
You are correct on this, I go to Foxwoods often enough I should have thought of that - I've never played much live BJ though. Nickel tables are always mobbed at both places, I wouldn't even bother playing them. I can do $10 and $15 tables at this point, but any more than that would be tough to stomach until I gain some experience. I can do easy weeknight trips, and I am sure I've seen $10 tables on weeknights before.
Thanks for the input!
Re: by TODAY's standards...
>>Foxwoods is not half-bad - the deeper-pene 6D games are barely 1D cuts ($50 min), and the 8Ds are fine with wong-OUT (exit tactics) 1-12+(approx spread) exit at -1 or -2 (depending on system). zg <<
Could I get away with a 1-12+ spread at Foxwoods? With a 1-12 spread and wong-out usage, what appoximate (ballpark) advantage could I exect?
Thanks for the input. These are the kind of research questions I am trying to figure out before exposing myself to enemy fire!
>>Foxwoods is not half-bad - the deeper-pene 6D games are barely 1D cuts ($50 min), and the 8Ds are fine with wong-OUT (exit tactics) 1-12+(approx spread) exit at -1 or -2 (depending on system). zg <<
Could I get away with a 1-12+ spread at Foxwoods? With a 1-12 spread and wong-out usage, what appoximate (ballpark) advantage could I exect?
Thanks for the input. These are the kind of research questions I am trying to figure out before exposing myself to enemy fire!
getting the numbers together
>>... Foxwoods game $10min with early exits discussed elswhere in this thread, req. min $10000 (1000u) for 20% (approx) RoRuin. The Mohegun Sun is notably poorer games than FWs. Some decent games in AC also. zg <<
zg, thanks for the info thus far! I do have a couple of followup questions if you don't mind...
Assumed $10 unit, 1-12 spread, wong-out
Bankroll : 1000 units (appox 20% RoR), $10k
Gain estimate : 2 units ($20) per 100 hands
Is there an approximate hourly (or per 100 hands) standard deviation I can assume?
Also, what will end up being my average bet? I'm thinking in terms of "If I am making $20 (2 units) per hour on average, what % return is that on total wagered?"
Thanks for the help, these are all questions I have been tossing around for a while now... I know they are addressed in the KO book as well as others I have, but I'm trying to get a firm handle on what I should expect.
>>... Foxwoods game $10min with early exits discussed elswhere in this thread, req. min $10000 (1000u) for 20% (approx) RoRuin. The Mohegun Sun is notably poorer games than FWs. Some decent games in AC also. zg <<
zg, thanks for the info thus far! I do have a couple of followup questions if you don't mind...
Assumed $10 unit, 1-12 spread, wong-out
Bankroll : 1000 units (appox 20% RoR), $10k
Gain estimate : 2 units ($20) per 100 hands
Is there an approximate hourly (or per 100 hands) standard deviation I can assume?
Also, what will end up being my average bet? I'm thinking in terms of "If I am making $20 (2 units) per hour on average, what % return is that on total wagered?"
Thanks for the help, these are all questions I have been tossing around for a while now... I know they are addressed in the KO book as well as others I have, but I'm trying to get a firm handle on what I should expect.
Re: getting the numbers together
**My responses -
Assumed $10 unit, 1-12 spread, wong-out
Bankroll : 1000 units (appox 20% RoR), $10k
Gain estimate : 2 units ($20) per 100 hands
Is there an approximate hourly (or per 100 hands) standard deviation I can assume?
**Yes, but I don't have the software or a copy of BJAttack handy to tell you what approx StDv is... probably about 35u+ (sheer guess)
Also, what will end up being my average bet?
**Again, guessing $20
I'm thinking in terms of "If I am making $20 (2 units) per hour on average, what % return is that on total wagered?"
**Another guess - 1%
Thanks for the help, these are all questions I have been tossing around for a while now... I know they are addressed in the KO book as well as others I have, but I'm trying to get a firm handle on what I should expect.
**Expect BIG up/down swings REGARDLESS of which games you primarily choose into. zg
**My responses -
Assumed $10 unit, 1-12 spread, wong-out
Bankroll : 1000 units (appox 20% RoR), $10k
Gain estimate : 2 units ($20) per 100 hands
Is there an approximate hourly (or per 100 hands) standard deviation I can assume?
**Yes, but I don't have the software or a copy of BJAttack handy to tell you what approx StDv is... probably about 35u+ (sheer guess)
Also, what will end up being my average bet?
**Again, guessing $20
I'm thinking in terms of "If I am making $20 (2 units) per hour on average, what % return is that on total wagered?"
**Another guess - 1%
Thanks for the help, these are all questions I have been tossing around for a while now... I know they are addressed in the KO book as well as others I have, but I'm trying to get a firm handle on what I should expect.
**Expect BIG up/down swings REGARDLESS of which games you primarily choose into. zg
Re: by TODAY's standards...
When I played there I never did 1-12. I usually spread 1-8 on two hands and wong out at -1 TC.
I also had dealer info provided by other players and yes sometimes there were dealers who cut 1 deck or less off of eight. With the size of the place and three shifts to play you should keep a log of the dealers you run across and take notes. Before long you will know which tables to play at.
If you join Green Chip or Green Belt you might want to ask some Foxwood questions to Jpdave13. He helped me alot when I started out.
When I played there I never did 1-12. I usually spread 1-8 on two hands and wong out at -1 TC.
I also had dealer info provided by other players and yes sometimes there were dealers who cut 1 deck or less off of eight. With the size of the place and three shifts to play you should keep a log of the dealers you run across and take notes. Before long you will know which tables to play at.
If you join Green Chip or Green Belt you might want to ask some Foxwood questions to Jpdave13. He helped me alot when I started out.
Mohegan no mid shoe entry
I was at Mohegan a few months ago and I noticed there were "no mide shoe entry" signs up all over the place. However, it would be extremely difficult to wong in at foxwoods b/c they keep closing tables unless they are full.
I am in the same boat as you Zagger. I am just learning to count and want to use foxwoods as practice, very tough to find $5 tables at FW, but there are 10's. I plan on doing a lot of practice on the computer.
After reading Wong, I learned the Hi-Lo count. I can count a single deck face up 2 at a time in 15 secs easily. I haven't done any practice w/ indices or true count conversion yet. Before going any further I think I am going to read up on an unbalanced count as this seems a lot easier.
Pal
I was at Mohegan a few months ago and I noticed there were "no mide shoe entry" signs up all over the place. However, it would be extremely difficult to wong in at foxwoods b/c they keep closing tables unless they are full.
I am in the same boat as you Zagger. I am just learning to count and want to use foxwoods as practice, very tough to find $5 tables at FW, but there are 10's. I plan on doing a lot of practice on the computer.
After reading Wong, I learned the Hi-Lo count. I can count a single deck face up 2 at a time in 15 secs easily. I haven't done any practice w/ indices or true count conversion yet. Before going any further I think I am going to read up on an unbalanced count as this seems a lot easier.
Pal
Re: Mohegan no mid shoe entry
Wonging in at Foxwoods is pretty difficult. Less so in the early morning hours or around noon when they start opening additional tables in the old casino.
The thing to remember about these eight deck games is that when the count goes positive it can stay there for quite a while, escpecially if you are playing heads up. So the idea is not only to wong in on the table but get rid of some of the other players at the same time.
My favorites were to wong in at third base and then hit 13 or 14 against a dealer 5 or 6 and take the dealer's bust card. Once or twice and the whole table leaves. Or wong in at second base to a table of heavy smokers and tell them you're allergic to smoke and make awful faces and nasty comments when they reach for the cigs.
Wonging in at Foxwoods is pretty difficult. Less so in the early morning hours or around noon when they start opening additional tables in the old casino.
The thing to remember about these eight deck games is that when the count goes positive it can stay there for quite a while, escpecially if you are playing heads up. So the idea is not only to wong in on the table but get rid of some of the other players at the same time.
My favorites were to wong in at third base and then hit 13 or 14 against a dealer 5 or 6 and take the dealer's bust card. Once or twice and the whole table leaves. Or wong in at second base to a table of heavy smokers and tell them you're allergic to smoke and make awful faces and nasty comments when they reach for the cigs.
Was Your Question Answered?
It was Foxy where I got my first exposure to playing other peoples hands, and to surrender. I am faced with 8 deckers in Ontario, so I am very familiar with the game, its shuffle, and the opportunites the game can present. The gent that used to play other players hands with them has been barred. He can't even buy cigarettes in the place now!
The diff between 6 and 8 decks is around -.03, so I would never divide the running count (balanced counters) by any more than 6 to get a true count for betting purposes. This will help you get into your spread a little quicker during the first two decks of the game. Once you are at 6 decks you can begin to divide your RC by decks left.
Learn to track cards thru the shuffle if you can. The swing of the game will freak you out unless you get into a winning streak and never have to look back, which can but will seldom happen.
With games like this 1 1/2 hours away from me I prefer to travel by cable connection to the nearest single deck game that offers a 100% bonus.
It was Foxy where I got my first exposure to playing other peoples hands, and to surrender. I am faced with 8 deckers in Ontario, so I am very familiar with the game, its shuffle, and the opportunites the game can present. The gent that used to play other players hands with them has been barred. He can't even buy cigarettes in the place now!
The diff between 6 and 8 decks is around -.03, so I would never divide the running count (balanced counters) by any more than 6 to get a true count for betting purposes. This will help you get into your spread a little quicker during the first two decks of the game. Once you are at 6 decks you can begin to divide your RC by decks left.
Learn to track cards thru the shuffle if you can. The swing of the game will freak you out unless you get into a winning streak and never have to look back, which can but will seldom happen.
With games like this 1 1/2 hours away from me I prefer to travel by cable connection to the nearest single deck game that offers a 100% bonus.