Need help on CA No-Bust BJ Strategy

[Ten_Seven(R)]

Hi. I live in Northern CA and the cardrooms here offer a game called no-bust blackjack. From what I know it is very hard to beat the game due to the commission on every hand. However, I was wondering if anyone knows the basic strategy for the game and the ev?

Here's my limited understanding of the game based on observation and brochure:
Player vs Agent (assume the agent is the dealer)
8 deck shoe with 8 jokers.
Player recieves 2 cards face up and Agent receives 1 card and doesn't receive the 2nd card until all the players have played their hands
H17
DOA except no soft doubling; no doubling on joker hands
No DAS
Split any pair or ten-value cards once to form 2 hands; can't split hands with Joker
Split Aces receive 1 card
2 Jokers or Joker and Ace (called natural) pays 2 to 1
Joker with non-Joker(s) or non-Ace card(s) is consider 21
All other wins (including splits or double downs) pays even money or 1 to 1
there are no blackjacks in the game
Early surrender since dealer has no hole card; player can't surrender with a joker in his hand and player can't surrender when Agent is showing a Joker
Player must stand on 20 or more
Player must Hit or Surrender on 11 or less
Player has option on 12-19
Agent must stand on Hard 17 or more
Agent must hit Soft 17 or less

Now, the tough part:
Player wins if player doesn't go over 21 and the Agent busts by going over 21
Agent wins if player busts and agent doesn't bust
If both player and agent doesn't bust, the hand closest to 21 wins
If both player and agent have the same value, then it's a push
Agent with Jokers wins all (against player with Joker hand)
When both parties bust, i.e. go over 21:
(a) agent wins if closer to 21
(b) player has a push rather than a loss if player is closer to 21\
(c) agent wins all ties

Translation:
Negatives: 8D with 8 jokers, H17, DOA (no soft doubling), no DAS, No re-splits, Split Aces receive 1 card only. There is no 3:2 blackjack.

Positives: 8 jokers because all wins pay even money unless Player has 2 Jokers or Joker + Ace., which pays 2 to 1 so long as dealer doesn't have a joker (my understanding). Player has option of early surrender. If player busts and dealer busts, player has a push so long as player's value is closest to 21 and doesn't push with agent.

What a F*CKED UP BJ game! I'm interested because they have tournaments and I can invite my friends. I suspect an Joker / Ace side-count should help and the proper (ES) strategy.

 

[zengrifter]

You left out the HARDEST PART...

... THE ANTE! Seriously, the only way to gain an edge at this game is to be the banker, foggitabout it! Seek out Indian casinos that offer the real deal. zg

 

[The Mayor]

place to look

(Dead link: http://www.thewizardofodds.com) _www.thewizardofodds.com_

If you ask, he may have that information handy.

Great site to visit anyway.

--Mayor

 

[Gambleholic]

A partner and I ran some simulations on this game (30 million hands for each removal using KO count). The result is: this game lends the bank an almost 1.5% advantage (1.44 to be exact). The effects of blackjacks are muted (through substantially less frequency), while busting is still harsh (because the bank wins all ties and only PUSHES when you beat them). We estimated the pivot point was about 7. Considering this was an 8-deck shoe, you'd have a lot of waiting to do. There are a few deviations for BS from normal BJ, but simply put, this game is beatable IF you have the bankroll and the stomach to bank >$300/round (safe estimates). Do you have at least $50,000 to put into this venture? More importantly, can I borrow some? ;-)

 

[chexican]

u don't need the bankroll if u play against morons

I believe that the place you are referring to is the lucky derby in citrus heights, i turned 300 into 2500 in three hours banking that game today. There are MANY "amatuers" that play the game, and for that reason, i think that the banker has more than a 1.5% advantage. What I do is bring 1000 with me, if i lose it, i go home, so far, i'm i'm 3 for 3, and have made 4,000

 

[phantom007]

What are you talking about????

If you are referring to a "Player-B/R'd" BJ game, then I do not think that you have it right.

Congrats. on your win!

Your "MORONS" (our PLOPPIES) "pay for the flashing lights and fountains, and comps", in "casino-speak". May the Supreme Being just LOVE them to.....well, "DEATH" would not be productive for CC's/AP's, therefore, LOVE THEM TO PROFITS for the short-term, and lots of FREE RFBA for the long-term.

Our Stores must make PROFITS! CC's/AP's will exist ONLY if their HOST continues to exist and THRIVE as well. Therefore, may I suggest that Morons/Ploppies are nothing but the most welcomed INFESTATIONS!

THEY FEED THE HOST, while WE slowly NIBBLE at their PRIVATES!

So you have plowed into a group of Morons?!....then plow them over!

Or maybe you have just plowed into a "statical deviation"!!!!

BE CAREFUL!

phantom007.

 

[zengrifter]

With the typical player giving you a 3% edge...

... after the house collects its ante, you most certainly have NOT a guarantee of winning. Depending on what the average bet-size is, your RoR could be quite high.

I once lost 90u in a perfect hole-card read over 3hrs - my edge was 10%.

You may in fact be the moron. zg

 

[Automatic Monkey]

Not only that...

A player who plays perfectly has an advantage over the dealer before the ante and the "cooperation" has a basic strategy card and a bankroll that will blow you right out of your chair if you try to bank the game. Remember he is getting a cut of that ante kicked back so you are paying it and he's not. The game probably is backcountable in some way but you can drive to Nevada and back before you get a chance to jump in.