S17 going, going almost gone.

kewljason

kewljason

Well-Known Member
I did notice a couple more locations that had S17 games on the main floor switched to h17 in the last week or so. Nothing new there. Seems we have been losing one or two every month here in Vegas. What I didn't realize, until I read it on the other board, was that this was a company wide decision by MGM. No more S17 on main floor. Still some in high limit areas. Disappointing. :sad:
 
Dont know about LV but was in AC this week

I was in AC recently and found S17 games in select casinos. Even low limit S17. I hadnt been to AC in a long time so I dont know if this is an improvement but I was surprised. Maybe there is hope for LV as well.
 
tthree said:
I was in AC recently and found S17 games in select casinos. Even low limit S17. I hadnt been to AC in a long time so I dont know if this is an improvement but I was surprised. Maybe there is hope for LV as well.
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low limit s17 in AC? i say impossible! i thought you could only find that on $25min tables in AC.

Either way, i agree with KJ that the rules are deteriorating in vegas. Im afraid that AP blackjack will soon fizzle out since the ploppy mindset FAR OUTNUMBERS ap's. Casinos have no incentive to offer liberal rules on BJ if there's not a shrewd public that will avoid a bad game. people who play 6:5 are killing US more than they're killing themselves
 
S17 @ mgm

kewljason said:
I did notice a couple more locations that had S17 games on the main floor switched to h17 in the last week or so. Nothing new there. Seems we have been losing one or two every month here in Vegas. What I didn't realize, until I read it on the other board, was that this was a company wide decision by MGM. No more S17 on main floor. Still some in high limit areas. Disappointing. :sad:
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Kewl, this is very disappointing. Do you know if the DD games on the main floor at Mirage and Bellagio have turned yet?
 
kewljason said:
I did notice a couple more locations that had S17 games on the main floor switched to h17 in the last week or so. Nothing new there. Seems we have been losing one or two every month here in Vegas. What I didn't realize, until I read it on the other board, was that this was a company wide decision by MGM. No more S17 on main floor. Still some in high limit areas. Disappointing. :sad:
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Even Aria and Bellagio?
 
If you're not good enough to beat H17 games you're not that good. If other conditions are better the H17 game isn't automatically worse.
 
Bellage and Aria still S17

Mirage changed to H17 for both DD and 6D on the main floor. I couldn't believe it when I saw it myself last week. That even surprised the DD dealer. If the giant chains changed towards worse rules, others will follow, I am afraid.
 
Midwestern said:
low limit s17 in AC? i say impossible! i thought you could only find that on $25min tables in AC.

Either way, i agree with KJ that the rules are deteriorating in vegas. Im afraid that AP blackjack will soon fizzle out since the ploppy mindset FAR OUTNUMBERS ap's. Casinos have no incentive to offer liberal rules on BJ if there's not a shrewd public that will avoid a bad game. people who play 6:5 are killing US more than they're killing themselves
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I agree about the 6:5, but the preceeding statement makes no sense. If AP's outnumbered ploppies do you think the casinos would give us a better game? Not a chance!
 
Blue Efficacy said:
If you're not good enough to beat H17 games you're not that good. If other conditions are better the H17 game isn't automatically worse.
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Im assuming all other things will be equal. And obviously the H17 games can still be beaten, the rule change just means counters will now make less money.
 
Midwestern said:
low limit s17 in AC? i say impossible! i thought you could only find that on $25min tables in AC.
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Tis very much true.

Dealers that deal in casinos with both H17/S17 often get confused. Well, good opportunity to piss off the ploppy with a 18 and you have a 14, and dealer flips over the soft 17, and is about to pay off the guy with 18. Point out to the dealer its a H17 game ;)
 
Gamblor said:
Tis very much true.

Dealers that deal in casinos with both H17/S17 often get confused. Well, good opportunity to piss off the ploppy with a 18 and you have a 14, and dealer flips over the soft 17, and is about to pay off the guy with 18. Point out to the dealer its a H17 game ;)
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Everytime you post something stupid. God kills a kitten. You've killed a lot of kittens Gamblor ;)
 
MeWin$ said:
Everytime you post something stupid. God kills a kitten. You've killed a lot of kittens Gamblor ;)
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Hmm pretty original, where'd you get that from? Also you might want to try googling "incomplete sentences".

Well, the smart often seem stupid to the stupid. Just like how ploppies are certain I'm stupid when I split 9's against a 9.

Everytime you post something pedestrian and uninsightful, God kills a kitten ;)
 
This in itself, is not a devastating developement for me. Although I had a few s17 games in my regular rotation, my list of best games, have all been h17 for several months now. It has been my experience that the few s17 games that remained were 'protected' with lousy penetration. What is more disturbing to me is this continuing trend of going to inferior games. Particularly troubling is the 6-5 sh*t. I had hoped that increasing venues all across the country would force casinos to compete more for customers and maybe offer better games. That certainly hasn't happened here in Vegas. When I see these idiots playing the 6-5 crap I just cringe. My observations are that the older ploppies are still somewhat resistant to it, but the young crowd is accepting it more and more. The 20 somethings that only care about getting drunk, getting laid and losing all their money. Unforetunately that will be enough for it to become the 'norm' over time. :sad:
 
kewljason said:
This in itself, is not a devastating developement for me. Although I had a few s17 games in my regular rotation, my list of best games, have all been h17 for several months now. It has been my experience that the few s17 games that remained were 'protected' with lousy penetration. What is more disturbing to me is this continuing trend of going to inferior games. Particularly troubling is the 6-5 sh*t. I had hoped that increasing venues all across the country would force casinos to compete more for customers and maybe offer better games. That certainly hasn't happened here in Vegas. When I see these idiots playing the 6-5 crap I just cringe. My observations are that the older ploppies are still somewhat resistant to it, but the young crowd is accepting it more and more. The 20 somethings that only care about getting drunk, getting laid and losing all their money. Unforetunately that will be enough for it to become the 'norm' over time. :sad:
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Yes that is the root of the problem- the low standards of the younger people and newer players. It affects everything in LV, not just the poor games but the food, drinks, entertainment, and general coarseness of the environment. There are still plenty of great games, just not there.

The spread of casino gaming isn't necessarily helping, as we're seeing in AC the good rules at the PA casinos haven't made AC follow suit, they just make their games worse because they figure all the players who know the difference aren't desirable customers anyway, PA can have them and AC can degrade their games without risking alienating their remaining players.

As a rule I believe a patron who knows S17 is better than H17 is a patron the LV casinos would rather not have taking up a seat at a $25 BJ game.
 
This is terrible news.

I'm going to Vegas this September; I'm a $50/hand player. Will I still be able to get S17 at that level of play at Aria and Bellagio at least? And if it helps I do gamble during non-peak times generally.

Maybe the MGM Grand still will keep one small S17 pit for green chippers...
 
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