Single Deck Disaster

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bigbjfan

Well-Known Member
#1
#1
Hello,

I have been studying and practicing/playing BJ for the past six months and got BS down and had been doing well. Then, I thought I had counting down so I went to play some single deck, cards face-down this past weekend. I had a heck of a time counting because of the speed and short time I had to see the cards! Those dealers were fast!

I also took a novice friend that I was trying to help and that didn't help either. Anyhow, I lost my alloted $$$ that evening but need to ask what is the best way to practice to speed up my counting abilities? computer simulator, more actual casino play?

Thanks
 
Mikeaber

Mikeaber

Well-Known Member
#2
#2
bigbjfan said:
Hello,

I have been studying and practicing/playing BJ for the past six months and got BS down and had been doing well. Then, I thought I had counting down so I went to play some single deck, cards face-down this past weekend. I had a heck of a time counting because of the speed and short time I had to see the cards! Those dealers were fast!

I also took a novice friend that I was trying to help and that didn't help either. Anyhow, I lost my alloted $$$ that evening but need to ask what is the best way to practice to speed up my counting abilities? computer simulator, more actual casino play?

Thanks
Click to expand...
Actually, BigBJFan, there has been quite a bit of discussion about this on the forum. Look around a little and you might get some fresh ideas.

The most common suggestion is to just deal down a full deck of cards, counting with the idea being to end up with a zero count (assuming a balanced counting system.) Once you have that down to where you think you should be (most recommend around 30 seconds) then you need to start adding distractions. Talking on the telephone while counting, having a TV program going that you are really into. Anything you can think of that would help simulate the distractions you might run into at the table.

Practice recognizing the pairs of cards and the resulting counts at a glance for as you've already noted, you don't get to stare and study the cards when they are dealt face down.

Having had the experience now, you sort of know what to expect. Use your imagination for I would think that for each person, different techniques would work out best.
 
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cheaney97

Member
#3
#3
Practicing counting

So my question is this: if I'm just starting w/ a deck of cards in my hand (face down) and flipping them over one at a time, I'm not sure I can flip them fast enough to count a full deck in 30 seconds. Do you flip them two at a time to get a faster time? Or is there some other trick, like keeping them face up? What do you do to flip faster?
 
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newyorkbear

Well-Known Member
#4
#4
When I was learning,I started flipping two cards at a time,then went to three and four card flips.I used to be able to do two decks in about a minute.
It also helps if you play at tables with fewer players until you get better.
Its an aquired skill that requires practice,but it sounds like you are on the right road.
 
Mikeaber

Mikeaber

Well-Known Member
#5
#5
cheaney97 said:
So my question is this: if I'm just starting w/ a deck of cards in my hand (face down) and flipping them over one at a time, I'm not sure I can flip them fast enough to count a full deck in 30 seconds. Do you flip them two at a time to get a faster time? Or is there some other trick, like keeping them face up? What do you do to flip faster?
Click to expand...
Yes, flip them in pairs. Not only faster, but it is more like what you'll encounter at the table and two cards will often cancel each other out.
 
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bigbjfan

Well-Known Member
#6
#6
I was able to count a deck last night with single card flipping in 30 seconds accurately. When I played last weekend, I was sitting at 3rd base but I read recently that someone else like sitting in the middle or 1st base while counting so that it is a little easier to see the cards and count them. I may try that next time.

My estimate was also that the dealer was giving about 70% penetration.
 
U

user

Member
#7
#7
One practice method I enjoy is playing with two decks and dealing a full table plus dealers hand.

Play BS on each players hand and dealers rules on his while keeping count. I like to remove one card to view at the end as a tease.
 
zengrifter

zengrifter

Banned
#8
#8
Do it LIKE THIS -

First remove two cards face down. Then turn the deck face up and slide two cards off at a time. When you get to the end, check your count with the two face down cards. You must be able to do this drill in under 22 seconds repeatedly with no mistakes.

However, if you really take this seriously you will need practice software. Below are the top three. zg

TRAINING

Ne Plus Ultra and Practicum by Victor Shelley
The most unique blackjack training software packages on the market today since it will improve your card counting skills. Includes drills to improve counting, true count conversion, deck estimation, play variations, count indices, etc. Use the built in count or create your own balanced or unbalanced count. Newer versions now include the companion Practicum "play" upgrade. Excellent graphics and includes several unique practice and analysis features.

-OR-

SmartCards by Extreme Blackjack
SmartCards provides the best card counting training available anywhere. It is not a home blackjack game, but a professional software tool that builds the skills you need to beat the game consistently. SmartCards does this by providing a large range of exercises and practice environments. It supports virtually any card counting system, with features not found in many other practice programs.

-OR-

Casino Verite V.4
In the latest update, Casino Verite contains 37 drills with dozens of options. You can be presented with rapidly increasing or decreasing counts, many card hands, a larger percentage of difficult hands and hands that you have had difficulty with. The software looks at your errors and increases the times that you will see the same situation. You can also set it to randomly switch between biases for a real workout. The idea is to allow you to play a game but to make better use of your practice time by making it much more difficult than random play. The game itself becomes the most difficult drill.
 
U

user

Member
#9
#9
A counting routine is quite important. Sticking to a routine of when to count the counts on the table saves me mistakes of counting the same card twice, missing a dealers card assuming you have alreadly processed it, etc.

The method Im currently using is counting the players cards in pairs as they come. So when box 1 and 2 get first cards process the count, box 3 and 4 get first cards prosess the count and so on. When extra cards are taken they are processed individually. Then the full dealers hand is processed last.
 
zengrifter

zengrifter

Banned
#10
#10
Face-down 1D - corrections -

... count the dealer's up car FIRST, than your two cards, then players hit cards, etc, - in otherwords always in the order that they first appear to you. zg
 
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rookie789

Well-Known Member
#11
#11
counting correction

zg, i think you and user are both basically stating the same method of counting cards as they 1st appear but you're addressing a single or double deck face down game and user's post sounds like he normally plays a multi-deck shoe dealt face up. if user is playing shoe's his method of counting is as the cards 1st appear.
 
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rookie789

Well-Known Member
#13
#13
I agree, count them as they appear on the table. For 1 thing it eliminates the problem of the dealer scooping cards with a dealer blackjack or bust before you finish the count.
 
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user

Member
#14
#14
Face down corrections

Yes Rookie is right my way would be for shoe games, cards face up.
Zengifter is also correct, the original post was for 1D, cards face down. So I jumped the gun with the post, but the importance of counting routines is relative.

Could someone explain how face down games work?

(edit) As in when are the players cards exposed, are the hit cards up or down.
 
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bigbjfan

Well-Known Member
#15
#15
Thanks for the replies and suggestions so far. The closest non-CSM games available to me are single-deck, dealt face-down. This is where I'd like to return but next time have a winning session. Those cards were being dealt so fast! I would try to count mine, then whatever cards I would see as play continued around the table to me at 3rd base, and then as they were turned over after the dealer would play out before they were collected.

I found that it was difficult for me to keep an accurate count. I'm sure the pace is kept that fast by the dealer to thwart counters.
 
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Canceler

Well-Known Member
#16
#16
bigbjfan said:
I'm sure the pace is kept that fast by the dealer to thwart counters.
Click to expand...
No, you just need more practice. More hands per hour = more $$$$ for the casino. If you're playing at an advantage, it's more $$$$ for you! (You will want fast dealers, once you can keep up with them.)
 
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bigbjfan

Well-Known Member
#17
#17
Canceler, you're right. More practice for me at a faster pace and then I will return and the odds should be in my favor instead of the house. I can count fine when the cards are dealt face up, shoe games but need more practice with face-down play.

In this single deck game, if I so much as looked away for a split second, I would miss seeing someone else's hand(s) throwing off my count. It sure is easy to get distracted momentarily and get thrown off until next shuffle.
 
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