vincent1288
New Member
Anyone have any feed back about it?
SugarHouse Philadelphia Open today
- Thread starter vincent1288
- Start date
Jack Rabbit
New Member
Sugarhouse conditions
8D main floor, 6D hi limit room with one 25 min table that was being raised to 50 min in the afternoon. NMSE only in the hi limit room. The one 8D game I observed had really good pen - less than 1 deck cut. The 6D hi limit games were standard at about 1.5. Really crowded - parking lot was full when I arrived early afternoon. I was not allowed to surrender, but they are allowing aces to be split to 3 hands. It looks like this is worth .08 to the player. Another odd practice I noticed at the 6D game is that they deal out one more hand after the cut card comes out.
The PCs did not hassle me for a players card very aggressively. Probably due to the crowding.
About me, I have been playing on and off for about 30 years. These were the first hands I have played in over 3 years. My result after spreading 1-12 for two hours was +1 unit.
8D main floor, 6D hi limit room with one 25 min table that was being raised to 50 min in the afternoon. NMSE only in the hi limit room. The one 8D game I observed had really good pen - less than 1 deck cut. The 6D hi limit games were standard at about 1.5. Really crowded - parking lot was full when I arrived early afternoon. I was not allowed to surrender, but they are allowing aces to be split to 3 hands. It looks like this is worth .08 to the player. Another odd practice I noticed at the 6D game is that they deal out one more hand after the cut card comes out.
The PCs did not hassle me for a players card very aggressively. Probably due to the crowding.
About me, I have been playing on and off for about 30 years. These were the first hands I have played in over 3 years. My result after spreading 1-12 for two hours was +1 unit.
kewljason
Well-Known Member
1 $25 table?? So what was the limit on the 8 deckers on the main floor? Any CSM or covered shoes-hidden discard tray, such as at Parx? No Surrender?? Pa Law mandates surrender. Gonna have to push them on that, similar to when Mt Airy opened. I think I will print out a copy of the Pa state rules and take it with me. I can afford to make trouble as I am moving from philly next week. :laugh:Jack Rabbit said:
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Automatic Monkey
Banned
Good idea! What are they, stupid? Do they really think they will get away with not allowing surrender after Mt. Airy got reamed for it?kewljason said:
Jack Rabbit
New Member
Answers
Sorry if I wasn't clear. There was 1 25 min table in the hi limit room early afternoon. The rest were 50 and 100. It was crowded so I didn't spend much time on the main floor. The main floor table I observed was 15 to 1000, hand shuffled. The shuffles looked complicated to me, but I don't track.
Pretty sure I did see CSMs, but no covered shoes. I have never seen a covered shoe.
One funny note - I saw a PC with what looked like a TV remote working on changing table limits on a table sign, which is an electronic screen. Took him about 10 minutes to do it and he kept setting it to very high limits by mistake. At least I got some entertainment.
Go ahead and hit em up on the LS.
Sorry if I wasn't clear. There was 1 25 min table in the hi limit room early afternoon. The rest were 50 and 100. It was crowded so I didn't spend much time on the main floor. The main floor table I observed was 15 to 1000, hand shuffled. The shuffles looked complicated to me, but I don't track.
Pretty sure I did see CSMs, but no covered shoes. I have never seen a covered shoe.
One funny note - I saw a PC with what looked like a TV remote working on changing table limits on a table sign, which is an electronic screen. Took him about 10 minutes to do it and he kept setting it to very high limits by mistake. At least I got some entertainment.
Go ahead and hit em up on the LS.
Automatic Monkey
Banned
Hey here's an idea- want to score some tort? Play your game, and when you want to surrender with an even number of chips (let's say, two blacks bet) make your argument. Show them the printout of the law. When they still don't let you surrender, pick up one of the chips (make sure the camera sees exactly what you do) and walk away from the table towards the door. If security tackles or detains you, you will have a hell of a lawsuit. It'll help to have a witness with you.
Taking a hit
LOL AM. Great idea with seeing if they tackle you. I hope everytime that I play that some pitt boss figures out what I'm doing and calls in an over agressive security guard and I get roughed up.
The good news is they never figure anything out, but then I don't get my lawsuit on the other side.
LOL AM. Great idea with seeing if they tackle you. I hope everytime that I play that some pitt boss figures out what I'm doing and calls in an over agressive security guard and I get roughed up.
The good news is they never figure anything out, but then I don't get my lawsuit on the other side.
vincent1288
New Member
LOL, I got another 2 question...
1. Do they have the $5 blackjack machine that have 5 seat just like ParX?
2. I don't count Cards, But I been pretty lucky with those machine lately, I do follow Basic Strategy 90% of times on those blackjack machine, Do u think I can get into trouble and mark as AP player? I do use player cards
1. Do they have the $5 blackjack machine that have 5 seat just like ParX?
2. I don't count Cards, But I been pretty lucky with those machine lately, I do follow Basic Strategy 90% of times on those blackjack machine, Do u think I can get into trouble and mark as AP player? I do use player cards
tensplitter
Well-Known Member
Hopefully this will reduce the crowds at Parx and its 6 deck shoes.
If I didn't care about my longevity at Sugar House, I would self-surrender a bet and let myself get roughed up and falsely arrested. The lawsuit would result in a huge bankroll increase. If it's ruled that I can't be banned from Sugar House in the future, I would then kill their high limit games by counting.
Perhaps that would be a good idea for the anti-casino group members. Make one bet of $50 and self-surrender, then sue.
If I didn't care about my longevity at Sugar House, I would self-surrender a bet and let myself get roughed up and falsely arrested. The lawsuit would result in a huge bankroll increase. If it's ruled that I can't be banned from Sugar House in the future, I would then kill their high limit games by counting.
Perhaps that would be a good idea for the anti-casino group members. Make one bet of $50 and self-surrender, then sue.
APs, hmm... It's time again to unit and force SugarHouse Casino to obey Pennsylvania Code § 549.9. (Surrender option). Since we have successfully forced Mt Pocono Casino to offer the surrender option, we can do it again with SugarHouse.
Just cut, paste the sample below, and file the complaint through Phoenix Rising's link: http://gamingcontrolboard.pa.gov/?p=113
Sample letter of complaint: (Oh, if you have time to write your own letter, the better.)
SugarHouse Casino ( 1080 N Delaware Ave, Philadelphia, PA 19125) disallows players to surrender, thus it fails to operate its blackjack games in compliance with Pennsylvania Code § 549.9. (Surrender) which reads as follows:
(a) After the first two cards are dealt to the player and the player’s point total is announced, the player may elect to discontinue play on his hand for that round by surrendering one-half his wager. All decisions to surrender shall be made prior to the player indicating whether he wishes to double down as permitted under § 549.11 (relating to Double Down Wager), split pairs as permitted under § 549.12 (relating to splitting pairs), stand or draw permitted under § 549.13 (relating to drawing of additional cards by players and the dealer).
(1) If the first card dealt to the dealer is not an ace or ten-value card, the dealer shall immediately collect one-half of the wager and return one-half to the player.
(2) If the first card dealt to the dealer is an ace or ten-value card, the dealer will place the player’s wager on top of the player’s cards. When the dealer’s second card is revealed, the hand will be settled by immediately collecting the entire wager if the dealer has Blackjack or collecting one-half of the wager and returning one-half of the wager to the player if the dealer does not have Blackjack.
(b) If the player has made an Insurance Wager and then elects to surrender, each wager will be settled separately in accordance with subsection (a) and in accordance with § 549.10 (relating to Insurance Wager).
I ask that the Bureau of Investigations and Enforcement (“BIE”) takes prompt corrective action to ensure that the casino is in full compliance with the Pennsylvania Code § 549.9.
kewljason
Well-Known Member
I took a walk over to Sugarhouse this morning. 2.3 miles each way from the Rittenhouse Square area of Center City Phila. A little more than a mile from the historic old city area (Liberty Bell, Independence Hall, Bestsy Ross House, ect) The Website says they will be running a free shuttle beginning next week to several areas in Center City Phila.
My first impression, was "you gotta be kidding me, 384 million dollars for this?" I am always amazed at how much things cost to be built. I guess I am out of touch with that type of thing, but this was ridiculous. lol Looked more like a converted warehouse than a new structure from the insides. The machines are placed close together and seems like too many crammed in. And it was crowded at 9:30 am on a friday. There are two table game pits on the main floor. One under the blue lights and one under the red lights. the high limit games are under the white lights. (red, white and blue) The Blue pit had 6 blackjack games. 1 -$15 minimum and 5- $25 minimuns. all hand shuffled and not a seat available. The Red pit had 4 blackjack games, all $25 minimum, 2 hand shuffled and 2 CSM, and not a seat available even at the CSM. These 10 tables on the main floor where it. Every table was open and full at 9:30 am. There were no more tables yet to be open. In The white pit (high limit) there was a $50 minimum and a $100 minimum. No one was playing either. As a matter of fact there was only one patron in the high limit area and he was playing slots. I thought about playing the $50 minimum but although I like to play heads up, I don't like to play when 4 pit people stand and watch me. I waited for a seat at a $25 table. Dealers were pretty slow, although I recognized a couple from AC. Penetration was pretty good, about 1.5 decks cut off at my game, I saw closer to 1.25 at another. First 16 vs dealer 10, I got, which was about 4 hands in, I attempted to surrender. Was told they don't offer surrender.
I told the pit guy, Marty that Pa state rules mandate surrender. He didn't seem to have a clue. I was actually armed with a copy of the rule but decided not to pursue it. I remember when Mt Airy retaliated to being forced to offer surrender by cutting penetration horribly. I am sure it will catch up with them sooner rather than later.
I personally have been waiting for a casino to open in Philly for 5 years. In this my final week as a resident here, it did so. :laugh: I was afraid the rules and condition would be really great, since I won't be around to take advantage of them that much, but after seeing the place, I no longer fear that. Although the penetration is decent at the moment and surrender will make the game even more attractive when they get that going, there aren't enough tables which will mean that they are always crowded (less hands per hour) I suspect that if people are willing to play the CSM as they were today, they will install more of them as well. I will give this place another visit in the next week, probably a weeknite after 11pm and see if it is less crowded.
My first impression, was "you gotta be kidding me, 384 million dollars for this?" I am always amazed at how much things cost to be built. I guess I am out of touch with that type of thing, but this was ridiculous. lol Looked more like a converted warehouse than a new structure from the insides. The machines are placed close together and seems like too many crammed in. And it was crowded at 9:30 am on a friday. There are two table game pits on the main floor. One under the blue lights and one under the red lights. the high limit games are under the white lights. (red, white and blue) The Blue pit had 6 blackjack games. 1 -$15 minimum and 5- $25 minimuns. all hand shuffled and not a seat available. The Red pit had 4 blackjack games, all $25 minimum, 2 hand shuffled and 2 CSM, and not a seat available even at the CSM. These 10 tables on the main floor where it. Every table was open and full at 9:30 am. There were no more tables yet to be open. In The white pit (high limit) there was a $50 minimum and a $100 minimum. No one was playing either. As a matter of fact there was only one patron in the high limit area and he was playing slots. I thought about playing the $50 minimum but although I like to play heads up, I don't like to play when 4 pit people stand and watch me. I waited for a seat at a $25 table. Dealers were pretty slow, although I recognized a couple from AC. Penetration was pretty good, about 1.5 decks cut off at my game, I saw closer to 1.25 at another. First 16 vs dealer 10, I got, which was about 4 hands in, I attempted to surrender. Was told they don't offer surrender.
I told the pit guy, Marty that Pa state rules mandate surrender. He didn't seem to have a clue. I was actually armed with a copy of the rule but decided not to pursue it. I remember when Mt Airy retaliated to being forced to offer surrender by cutting penetration horribly. I am sure it will catch up with them sooner rather than later. I personally have been waiting for a casino to open in Philly for 5 years. In this my final week as a resident here, it did so. :laugh: I was afraid the rules and condition would be really great, since I won't be around to take advantage of them that much, but after seeing the place, I no longer fear that. Although the penetration is decent at the moment and surrender will make the game even more attractive when they get that going, there aren't enough tables which will mean that they are always crowded (less hands per hour) I suspect that if people are willing to play the CSM as they were today, they will install more of them as well.
I will give this place another visit in the next week, probably a weeknite after 11pm and see if it is less crowded.
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tensplitter
Well-Known Member
It's the first week. Once the novelty wears out the tables will become less crowded. If there's no-limit poker offered now is the time to clean out the fish.
kewljason
Well-Known Member
That was actually my intent, as I had a printed copy in my back pocket. I could tell, from the confused response from the pit guy, no good would come of it at that moment. Thinking back to the Mt Airy response, where they cut penetration dramatically, I was thinking what if this bozo, cuts the shoe in half on me for pursuing it. Kind of win the battle, losing the war situation. :laugh: I'll let someone else be the bad guy.melbedewy said:
tensplitter
Well-Known Member
Not offering surrender is just as illegal for a casino as you going 75 mph in a 65. Both are illegal, but usually not enforced.
ArcticInferno
Well-Known Member
Who would go through the trouble of filing a complaint regarding the surrender rule?
They would correctly conclude that only card counters would care enough to take such steps.
They would correctly conclude that only card counters would care enough to take such steps.