The Dreadful, Dreary, Boring World of Canadian Casinos

#1
The Dreadful, Dreary, Boring World of Commie Casinos

by Vedran Vuk
Ludwig von Mises Institute | November 15, 2005

In Canada, government-owned and run casinos made a mess of the true entertainment value created by casinos in a competitive free market. The government-owned casinos of Ontario claim to be the "peoples'" factors of production. But anyone with experience in real casinos can only see this as a pathetic joke.

I realized this on a recent visit to Niagara Falls, Canada. The town had two government-owned casinos, five minutes apart. The design of the casinos was the same with no theme and no real difference in games and services provided. The first casino is called the Niagara Casino, and the second is called the Niagara Fallsview Casino.

Many anti-capitalists argue that capitalism is only concerned about money and ignores things such as beauty and creativity. The truth of socialism is on display with these two casinos.

Compare to the grand capital of gambling, Las Vegas, and all the creative themes and architectural designs that have come forth. We have Venice, Manhattan, Paris, and a pyramid in the desert! This would simply be impossible in socialist Canada unless some politician decided a pyramid in the snow was a good way to get votes.

A policy so offensive resides in Niagara Falls' casinos that I shiver at the thought of it. Of course, I speak of the policy of no "free" alcoholic beverages. Free drinks in casinos is something that we have come to take for granted in our free-market-driven casino industry.

Many people go to casinos exclusively for the free drinks. But of course we can't have anything enjoyable in socialism. One beer is US$7. Furthermore, the classic cheap and delicious casino buffet was nowhere to be seen. The buffet had few choices, tasted like roasted nutria, and cost about US$12.

Another difference was that no special offers were given by the casino. Usually, casinos have crazy spectacular car giveaways or remote resort vacation trips to be won, but in Canada? No way.

Las Vegas casinos do not give great buffets, free drinks, and special prizes out of the goodness of their hearts. These offers come through the concern for their own bank accounts and the competition with other casinos. The commie casino designed for the people of Ontario is worse for the customers than casinos based on profit.

These casinos are almost doll house images of real casinos. This can be most seen at the Texas Hold 'Em Poker tables at which I had the pleasure of waiting an hour and a half before being permitted to play. There are ten tables, seven dealers, and four people managing the waiting list.

An inefficiency such as this would never go on long in a real casino. What is the purpose of the four managers when all the casino needs is dealers?! Is there even a need for one manager of the waiting list? God forbid that the commie casino would do anything that might be efficient and profit maximizing.

With no shareholders to answer to and no real competition, there is no incentive to get more dealers instead of waiting-list managers. The bloated staff of Canada's commie casinos is typical of the kind of patronage schemes that infect all government enterprises. The end result is me waiting for ninety minutes, during which time the casino is making no money from me.

To add salt to the wound, the casinos actually changed their dealers regularly, like a competitive casino. This is normally done to ensure that there is less cheating going on. A question then for my socialist Canadian commie friends: What is the point of preventing cheating when you've already hired four waiting-list managers? You've already cheated yourself for whatever their salary may be!

Ludwig von Mises pointed out the flaws of government-run non-profit organizations by saying, "In the absence of profit and loss the entrepreneurs would not know what the most urgent needs of the consumers are. If some entrepreneurs were to guess it, they would lack the means to adjust production accordingly."

A Mises Institute Christmas: $17
The government-run casinos have fake entrepreneurs that cannot adjust their production through dealers and effective management to match the demand of customers. They only make guesses at the number of customers that may possibly come into the casino. This is exactly what Mises is speaking about when he says of such quasi-markets, "They want people to play market as children play war, railroad, or school. They do not comprehend how such childish play differs from the real thing it tries to imitate."
No citizen of Canada can effectively push the casinos into efficiency. Since citizens cannot sell their "stock" in the casinos, there is no one to push for higher profits and greater efficiency. No person is in the position to lose their entire fortune. No person is investing into the company for their children's college education or for their retirement. This means no person is in a position to push for profit maximization.

So play it safe and please avoid Canada's commie casinos.

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Vedran Vuk is a major in economics and finance at Loyola University of New Orleans. He is temporarily taking classes at Loyola College in Maryland due to Hurricane Katrina.
 
#2
re:cheating

True, there might not be cheating over in Ontario, but in BC I've been cheated at least twice. One of the casinos in out of business. The other one hired a bust-out dealer to hide the high cards at the end of the shoe. Since most BJ players like to cut in the middle of a 6-decker, the 10s and As are hidden at the end of the pack. I wasn't aware of this at first, and I sat down and played. Over 2 decks have been dealt, and hardly any high cards came out, and I was losing hand after hand. Finally, there's a chance for me to push out a max bet. I got 2 10s against a dealer's 5. I split and got 2 20s, but the dealer got 21. 'What the fu**!!' I said to myself. Finally, I asked a security guard if I could talk to the shift manager. She gave me stupid excuses like 'Before the customers showed up, all 6 decks are spread onto the felt face-up', 'The shuffle is truly random'. The truth is, as all AP's know, no casino shuffle is truly random. For a single deck of cards, it takes at least 7 shuffles for the deck to be truly random, ie. stepladders or riff-ruffs.

Finally I threatened that I'm gonna talk to the BC Lottery Corp., and she said in a calm and cool voice, 'Sure!' The point is, the BCLC does nothing to protect the players. They are just linked with the casinos to rip the players off their hard-earned $$.
 
#3
If the dealers can concentrate the big cards to a section of the pre-cut pack...

...you can figure out where they are and cut them to the front! Thus this could be a very profitable game... no mopre discussion with the SB, please. zg
 
#4
I love this post

>>tables at which I had the pleasure of waiting an hour and a half before being >>permitted to play. There are ten tables, seven dealers, and four people >>managing the waiting list

When they opened the Fallsview Poker room I went, and got on the extremely long waiting list at about 2 a.m.. The poker room closed at I think 4a.m or something like that. They failed to tell me this. Who the hell has a poker room that closes??? It was full and they cleared everyone out!!

If the person who was to be on the button leaves, there is no "dead button" rule. The button goes to the next person, who also posts small blind. Then, the next TWO people must post big blinds. Completely unfair.

The Canadian casinos do suck on all levels.

>>One beer is US$7

This is probably not true, they were $5 Canadian as of a year ago, and they had just gone up from 4.50.
 

BlackJackHack

Well-Known Member
#5
Why not public casinos?

As a self-interested AP, I'd like the whole country to be covered with casinos - a gazillion casinos everywhere - preferably private, with little regulation and maximum competition.

From a policy perspective, however, public casinos (the model in much of Europe, as well as in Canada) make sense. FOr mathematical reasons well within the comprehension of APs, it's tough to lose money with a well run casino. A local casino monopoly, in particular, is a license to print money (the most obscene scenario is where an Indian tribe or corporation is given a local monopoly by government - e.g. Potawotomi in Milwaukee, Harrah's in New Orleans, Caesar's in Louisville, Argosy in Cincinnati, etc.).

Why should Indian tribes (some with 23 members who aren't really Injuns) and private companies rake in all of this coin? Why should the state just take a 10-20% share in taxes? Why shouldn't the state get 80%, and pay 20% or so (plus, perhaps, performance incentives) to a private company as a management fee? Hiring private companies to actually run the casino would help avoid the problems described in the article on Canadian casinos.

Try explaning the US' gaming "policy." In some places, there are only Indian casinos. In others, only private casinos. In some places, casinos only on riverboats. In others, casinos on ocean-going vessels. In some places, just slots. In others, just tables. In others, just VLTs and pull tabs. It is a totally incoprehensible mishmash that advances no rational policy objectives.
 
#6
Beg to differ

>>As a self-interested AP, I'd like the whole country to be covered with
>>casinos - a gazillion casinos everywhere - preferably private, with
>>little regulation and maximum competition.

I believe things are moving in this direction. It is just taking awhile because certain powers that be need to get out of the way and allow the economy to work the way it was intended to. I'm sure we will get to this point eventually in many places.

>>From a policy perspective, however, public casinos (the model in
>>much of Europe, as well as in Canada) make sense.

No they don't.

>>(the most obscene scenario is where an Indian tribe or corporation
>>is given a local monopoly by government - e.g. Potawotomi in
>>Milwaukee, Harrah's in New Orleans, Caesar's in Louisville, Argosy in >>Cincinnati, etc.).

Correct, the government should not have this much power.

>>Why should Indian tribes (some with 23 members who aren't really
>>Injuns) and private companies rake in all of this coin? Why should
>>the state just take a 10-20% share in taxes? Why shouldn't the state
>>get 80%, and pay 20% or so...

For the same reason the government shouldn't get %80 of the revenue from grocery stores and laundromats and restaurants and... Because this is socialistic, and is much worse a thing than someone exploiting some loopholes.

>>Try explaning the US' gaming "policy." In some places, there are only
>>Indian casinos. In others, only private casinos. In some places, casinos
>>only on riverboats. In others, casinos on ocean-going vessels. In some
>>places, just slots. In others, just tables. In others, just VLTs and
>>pull tabs. It is a totally incoprehensible mishmash that advances no
>>rational policy objectives.

The answer isn't homogenizing the industry like Canada does! The problem here is obviously too much government intervention, not too little. All these places need to be free to offer whatever games they wish.
 

BlackJackHack

Well-Known Member
#7
Re: Public Casinos

I think we agree on one thing - the worst possible scenario is a government-granted monopoly (or oligopoly), which, unfortunately is what exists in most regions with legalized gambling. In most states, it is very difficult to get a casino license (Indian or non-Indian) - there tend to be a very small number of participants who tend to be the most politically connected. I agree that much less regulation would be better than limiting the competition to 1, 2 or 3 stores.

We clearly disagree, however, about the notion of a public casino (in lieu of a single, or limited number, of private casinos).

I disagree completely with your analogy to grocery stores, or other types of businesses. The right to run a casino (unlike a grocery store or lemonade stand) does not exist absent the imprimatur of the state. The casino "franchise" (i.e., the legal right to operate) is worth much more than any value that an operator can bring to the table. Until it grants licenses, the state owns that franchise. The state should use that franchise to maximize the benefit to its citizens. Clearly, reasonable minds could differ as to what course of action would best benefit the common good. While I certainly have not conducted a lengthy study on the matter, I strongly suspect that the state would raise more revenue running its own casino than by entering a gaming compact with Chief Makum Bigwampum or with Harrah's. If they choose the latter route, the state should, at the very least, tax the living crap out of the casino.

Just because something is "socialistic" (or "capitalistic") in and of itself does not mean it is bad. What matters is whether it works. The private sector is never going to clean up Lake Erie or educate poor children. ARen't these worthwhile endeavors? Those on the right wing should not automatically reject public initiatives, any more than those on the left wing should automatically reject private sector initiatives. Public policies should be judged on their own merits (i.e., whether they WORK), not whether they pass some idological litmus test.

Based on your logic, the state should also give up the monopoly in state lotteries, and anybody should be able to run a numbers game. Do we really want that? Isn't it better to have the money raised by lotteries go to education and other public purposes? Isn't the whole logic behind expanding gaming to raise tax revenues? Shouldn't those revenues be maximized?
 
#8
Sounds like AC

In New Jersey a judge decided that all gaming is controlled by the state for the benefit of the state and the casinos cannot tell a patron they cannot play. Thus we can't be prevented from playing BJ in AC, but they just made the game so uniformly poor from a counter's perspective that the venue is of limited value, and every game in town is almost identical. That's what we would have everywhere if the game were government controlled. The variety and laissez-faire attitude of casinos as they exist give us something to work with.
 
#9
RE: RE: Public Casinos

>>Just because something is "socialistic" (or "capitalistic") in and
>>of itself does not mean it is bad. What matters is whether it works.

Yes, I do agree with this. To clarify my original statement: It is bad for the government to take 80% of the income of a huge industry. This is inappropriate Socialism.

>>The private sector is never going to clean up Lake Erie or educate
>>poor children. ARen't these worthwhile endeavors?

Yes, but one cannot make money cleaning up Lake Erie or educating poor kids. That is why these things things are suited to be public endeavors. They are not Businesses!!

>>Those on the right wing should not automatically reject public
>>initiatives, any more than those on the left wing should automatically
>>reject private sector initiatives.

Just for the record, if there was some conception that I am "right wing", you are about as far off as you can be!

>>Public policies should be judged on their own merits (i.e., whether
>>they WORK), not whether they pass some idological litmus test.

Correct, see final paragraph.

>>Based on your logic, the state should also give up the monopoly
>>in state lotteries, and anybody should be able to run a
>>numbers game. Do we really want that?

I do! I would love to run a game with a 90% vig!!!... seriously. Wouldn't you?

>>Isn't it better to have the money raised by lotteries go to education
>>and other public purposes? Isn't the whole logic behind expanding
>>gaming to raise tax revenues? Shouldn't those revenues be maximized?

There is no quality that singles out the casino industry as being especially appropriate for government control. If casinos were allowed to flourish, there would be plenty of tax income. This is much better than selling lottery tickets to poor, ignorant inner-city people and kicking back a small percentage to educate their kid.

The most liberal issuance of casino licences is in Nevada, where they do not need to collect state tax at all!! How can you maximize tax revenues any more than that?? There is competition, choices and a thriving industry. Even a poor person can afford to gamble in some of the downtown joints! Contrast this with Canadian casinos that are grotesquely wanting in quality and quantity. Which scenario "WORKS" best? I think am the pragmatic one here and you are the one espousing ideologies.
 

BradRod

Well-Known Member
#10
Civil Casinos

I am not myself a drinking person and rarely in a casino. I find players that are drunk to be distracting, obnoxious and at times even threatening. The Canadian casinos that I have played in place a high value on decorum. This suites me very nicely as it lets me focus on my game. I find no enjoyment from being in the company of rowdy, madcap drunks. I only play blackjack so I cannot comment on the poker game. The blackjack game is decent and I have done well there.

By the way, I have passed a personal milestone of over 100k career at BJ with over 75k of that this year. Can this be my new career ?
 
#11
Tipping at Canadian Casinos?

no mention of tipping...i suspect that tip hustling does not occur there...i understand that Canadians do not tip as a rule, but the do if they have been immersed long enough in our Yankee BULLS#!T...
 
#12
Canadian casino's very similar to American

I've had the pleasure of playing in quite a few of the provinces in Canada and quite a few of the states in America. The Canadian casino are governed by each province so the rules of the game and of gambling differ from province to province, but that is no different then from state to state.
I've found dumb rules in both. eg. one province teaches the dealers basic BJ strategy so that if a player asks them what to do they actually do give a knowledged response. This same province does not allow drinking at the tables nor does it allow an ATM in the casino. I had to walk a block (yes it was actually -30 F)to get $1500 and the ATM gave it to me all in 20's. I was also in either Kansas or St. Louis and they would only let me buy in for $500 every 2 hours. In both cases I asked the pit boss "Why?" and in each case I was told it was so the locals would not lose to much money. To which I replied "Then why don't they close down the casino's?. Both pit bosses had the ability to smile broadly.
In my province the casino's are privately owned but they must have a charity to help them run the casino. The volunteer's act as chip runners and cage counters. In return the charity gets about $70,000 for it's two nights of work. A charity can apply and is given a two day slot every year and a half. So there is some good that comes out of the casino's.
Overall the provinces have much more say in the day to day running of the Casino. eg. Most provinces have no smoking in the casino's. A lot of the provinces have 24 hour poker rooms and are very similar to towns I've visited in Nevada.
 

V-man

Active Member
#14
Canadian, decent BJ?

Congrats on your winnings. But I disagree on the game you call decent. It's 8 decks, no surrender, cut 2.5 to 3 decks. Even the VIP room with 6 decks, no surrender, pen 1.5 to 2 is lousy. You'd need a large BR, just to survive.
 
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