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Tips to remembering ace key cards?

Discussion in 'Skilled Play - Card Counting, Advanced Strategies' started by fce21, Jun 9, 2011.

  1. fce21

    fce21 Member

    Had my first live attempts at ace sequencing recently. I quickly found that I struggle to remember both the count and the key cards at the same time. The one time that I noticed 3 "super" key cards (followed by consecutive aces), I focused so closely on them that I completely forgot the count. And while looking for the key cards in the next shoe, I was again unable to keep the count. (The bright side was that the 3 key cards stayed together, followed by another card and then the 2 aces.)

    Anybody have any tips/tricks for remembering the key cards along with the count?
     
  2. Sucker

    Sucker Well-Known Member

    I know of no one who counts while ace-tracking.
     
  3. assume_R

    assume_R Well-Known Member

    If you just Ace-track, then you're just flat betting until the key cards come and and then really jump your bet a lot? Isn't that even more obvious than just counting where you usually have to ramp your bets up (somewhat) gradually? What kind of spread is required for getting an advantage at keying?
     
  4. beyondbj

    beyondbj Well-Known Member

    i try flat bet for long time , waiting for the ace to a large spread , but its really odd, if u do counting with ace track , it will be less obvious
     
  5. tthree

    tthree Banned

    If you can keep side counts that are constantly changing, how hard is it to remember static cards while counting? I know people that do it but never asked them how. I never thought it would be hard. I assume these people use the info to maximize the ace adjustment when determining the TC for bet sizing. This is only an educated guess though.
     
  6. aslan

    aslan Well-Known Member

    Believe me, with KO it can be done, but it's also good to have an easy system to record key cards, using just what you have with you-- fingers, legs, chips, pocket change, cigarettes, lighter, drink, bs card, keys, etc., etc. I am not suggesting systems that the "eye" can easily decipher, so you'll have to take it from here. Also, memory tricks using word sounds can be used as suggested in any book promising to improve your memory can explain.
     
  7. tthree

    tthree Banned

    The one guy I remember mentioning ace tracking keys talked about tracking a packet of aces. He said he knew where to expect them and used the first ace in the right area of the shoe as the key card. That shouldnt be hard to remember.
     
  8. Friendo

    Friendo Well-Known Member

    Try outrageous mnemonics

    I have no experience at this, but some players use outrageous/obscene words to represent the number and suit of a card. The 7 of diamonds is "sled", the 6 of hearts is "shirt", and the 4 of clubs is "f__k".

    EDIT: I don't track, but when I get around to it, I'll try what's outlined at this page - scroll down to "Memorizing Specific Cards", and this page for the phonetic equivalents of numbers.

    So, since four has the phonetic equivalent (see the second link) "R", you would use "car/hair/sewer/door" for the four different sorts of 4s.
     
  9. fce21

    fce21 Member

    Thanks for the tips. KO/TKO is the counting system I use, and it did seem possible to keep count & key cards. I'm just not there yet.

    I like the idea of nicknames for all the cards, I may try that or something similar. If anyone has any other ideas, please share. Thanks.
     
  10. iCountNTrack

    iCountNTrack Well-Known Member

    As sucker mentioned I don't know of any person that counts and sequences the aces. It is pretty difficult if you trying to memorize 3-4 sequences...
    In any case if you really want to count cards, you might be better off zone tracking the shuffle instead, since a good number of sequenceable shuffles are also trackable. I should also mention that zone tracking could be sometimes more profitbale than sequencing and also provide better intrinsic cover.
    PHP:
     
  11. pit15

    pit15 Well-Known Member

    Use your chips to remember them.

    white = club
    red = diamond
    green = heart
    black = spade

    then just have stacks of chips in front of you to represent the cards.

    As far as the big bet jump goes.. I've never done ace tracking but here's a good way to go about it:

    Buy in for around the size that you want your big bet to be, then bet minimum until it's time to make that bet, then stack up all the chips you got then say "all in" and push em all into the circle. Ploppies do stupid **** like that all the time
     
  12. zengrifter

    zengrifter Banned

    I do, not difficult, but I only use ONE keycard (so far) at 2D.
    So I don't get the full value available (yet). Also, I constrain my Ace bets to not exceed my counting max bet. My approach is "sequencing on training wheels. zg
     
  13. zengrifter

    zengrifter Banned

    Under Nevada law any of those items COULD be construed as a criminal volation of the anti-DEVICE law. zg
     
  14. Friendo

    Friendo Well-Known Member

    What about using ace tracking to make otherwise-marginal locations worthy of a visit?

    I'm thinking of those locales with a 6-8 casinos in a 40-mile radius, 4 with decent penetration, the rest hand shuffled but with ghastly penetration.

    • Count the games with good penetration
    • Ace-sequence the remainder
    This gives me a much larger number of opportunities, allowing shorter sessions. Plus, the crappy-penetration joints probably aren't watching their games too carefully.

    Win!

    The only flaw is that I have no sequence skill yet, but I can fix that.
     
  15. pit15

    pit15 Well-Known Member

    Just use chips. Even the craziest casino wouldn't try to claim you were using a device by stacking your chips a certain way.
     
  16. aslan

    aslan Well-Known Member

    Possibly, but I think that's a stretch, especially fingers and legs, and also the chips that the house gives you. :eek:
     
  17. FrankieT

    FrankieT Well-Known Member

    You could remember the number by turning the chip in a certain direction.

    3 hearts - red chip pointing to 3 oclock
    8 clubs - green chip pointing to 8 oclock

    ten hearts - two red chips stacked turned to noon
    jack clubs - two green chips stacked turned to 3 oclock
    queen spades - two white chips stacked turned to 6 oclock
    king diamonds - two $0.50 chips (whatever color the casino uses) stacked turned to 9 oclock

    You could easily remember every single sequence card in a 2D this way.

    Have you're hand constantly playing with chips in order to obscure them from the camera and others.
     
  18. fwb

    fwb Well-Known Member

    It's not so bad if you can make a memory system that represents each card as a distinct object, and then combine a few of them into a scene. E.g. a king hitting an 8-ball with a shovel can represent one sequence (king of diamonds, 8 of clubs, jack of spades).

    Unfortunately I have anecdotal evidence that says otherwise.
     
  19. FrankieT

    FrankieT Well-Known Member

    You could have a partner and have him just min flat bet while memorizing key cards, while you just count. When he spots something and signals you, you can do the big betting.
     
  20. Gamblor

    Gamblor Well-Known Member

    Anyone memorized a sequence card, largely not caring what the rank and suit of that card is?

    Don't mind me, its quite possible I'm sitting here drinking heavily.
     

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