Tried a Couple New Cover Plays

aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#61
#61
zengrifter said:
Far less likely. Especially done infrequently and always tied to the size of prior shoe last bet. zg
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The size of the prior shoe last bet is convincing evidence that the continuing max bet is not related to ST. If it can fool KJ, then it is convincing cover. ;):whip::joker:j/k It does walk the line between ploppy and AP; if it didn't, it would hardly be good cover.

Sometimes, I walk around the tables "playing" PC. There are two ways I use to identify counters. (1) I find a table where there is someone who "looks" like a CC. I simply count the table from round one, and look to see if anyone begins changing their bets at or near the change to a plus count. (2) The other way I use is to look for players making larger bets than everyone else. Is it the end of the shoe? Does the large betting continue into the next shoe? Is the usual bet the table minimum? Does the player leave immediately after a large betting round, typically at the end of the shoe?

If anyone wants to improve their camo, they should "play" PC themselves. They will be surprised at all the things they see.
 
Lonesome Gambler

Lonesome Gambler

Well-Known Member
#62
#62
I wonder, how many professional players here feel that playing cover is worth anything? At the risk of repeating what has been said a million times before on this forum, the VAST majority of floor/pit supervisors do not know how to count, and more importantly, do not know perfect BS. They won't be able to recognize a soft doubling error. It's worthless!

If someone in surveillance that does know how to count and does know perfect BS is watching you, "cheap" cover plays will not mask your betting correlation. And if you bet big off the top and then continue to do so as long as you're winning, then sure, they can feel free to do a skills check, because you are playing a negative game.

I noticed the other thread that had lists of top-5 cover plays. Here are mine:

5. Short sessions
4. Being relaxed and natural in the pit
3. Playing unrated or otherwise properly maintaining your cumulative W/L
2. Short sessions
1. Short sessions

Obviously, if you're playing a local game, 3 of those "cover plays" won't necessarily be easily made. But if you want my opinion, don't think that intentionally giving away money when your edge is already razor-thin will necessarily buy you enough time to make it worthwhile in the end.
 
kewljason

kewljason

Well-Known Member
#63
#63
Lonesome Gambler said:
I wonder, how many professional players here feel that playing cover is worth anything? At the risk of repeating what has been said a million times before on this forum, the VAST majority of floor/pit supervisors do not know how to count, and more importantly, do not know perfect BS. They won't be able to recognize a soft doubling error. It's worthless!

If someone in surveillance that does know how to count and does know perfect BS is watching you, "cheap" cover plays will not mask your betting correlation. And if you bet big off the top and then continue to do so as long as you're winning, then sure, they can feel free to do a skills check, because you are playing a negative game.

I noticed the other thread that had lists of top-5 cover plays. Here are mine:

5. Short sessions
4. Being relaxed and natural in the pit
3. Playing unrated or otherwise properly maintaining your cumulative W/L
2. Short sessions
1. Short sessions

Obviously, if you're playing a local game, 3 of those "cover plays" won't necessarily be easily made. But if you want my opinion, don't think that intentionally giving away money when your edge is already razor-thin will necessarily buy you enough time to make it worthwhile in the end.
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Well said, LG. Don't feel bad about repetition. Great points worthy of repeating and you did so, very nicely. Unfortunately, it won't matter too much to those that doesn't want to hear it. :rolleyes:
 
zengrifter

zengrifter

Banned
#64
#64
tthree said:
I never read Ian Andersons book but his music is great.:laugh:
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His earlier book was released in 1975 and it was also a classic. zg

Andersen Talks About Blackjack in "Turning the Tables on Las Vegas"
In most cases, we get to read about blackjack books that mainly focus on the basic strategies of the game as well as subject of card counting. The way these blackjack books are written may vary but the gists of all these blackjack books are one and the same. That is the reason why a lot of blackjack enthusiasts have become interested in the book "Turning the Tables on Las Vegas," by Ian Andersen. The contents of this blackjack book are not similar to the contents of the typical blackjack books that we might have already read. The concentration of "Turning the Tables on Las Vegas" is the game's psychological aspect.
​
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#65
#65
kewljason said:
Well said, LG. Don't feel bad about repetition. Great points worthy of repeating and you did so, very nicely. Unfortunately, it won't matter too much to those that doesn't want to hear it. :rolleyes:
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those "who" don't want to hear it. :rolleyes:
 
zengrifter

zengrifter

Banned
#66
#66
kewljason said:
My math is not exaggerated. It isn't only shoes ending with a max bet that are a problem. If you reach your max bet or even a bet not your max, but substatially higher than your initial wager at any time during a shoe and then retreat to a smaller wager at the start of the next shoe, it is a problem.
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Come on, give it a try.
It at least belongs in your bag of tricks, even if rarely used.
Try it, you'll like it. We need to move you beyond your comfort zone,
that is where growth occurs! Let us know how it goes! z:laugh:g

Ps - I can see it now, the first time you do it - win the big bet, casino's happy with you and then you stay to next shuffle,
bet the same again, and some suit comes dashing out from the eye and yells, "That's it! You're outta here!" :laugh:
 
N

newbctr

Well-Known Member
#70
#70
His second book is the greatest book written about ANYTHING. He even tells you what kind of garlic to eat, and why you shouldn't eat 24 hours before playing... not to mention showering 6 times a day. He is quite simply a genious. I am surprised he hasn't single handlely brought down vegas.
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#71
#71
zengrifter said:
Come on, give it a try.
It at least belongs in your bag of tricks, even if rarely used.
Try it, you'll like it. We need to move you beyond your comfort zone,
that is where growth occurs! Let us know how it goes! z:laugh:g

Ps - I can see it now, the first time you do it - win the big bet, casino's happy with you and then you stay to next shuffle,
bet the same again, and some suit comes dashing out from the eye and yells, "That's it! You're outta here!" :laugh:
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This week, brow-beaten:whip: by the traditionalists, I played it by the book, no camo, short sessions, leave the table if last shoe went to max bet. My first two sessions I was down over $1,000. I spent the trip climbing out of the hole Lady Variance had dropped me in with all her promising plus counts that I could not win. By the end of roughly 20 hours of play, I was dead even, with the last three hours an exercise in futility, 75% pen, S17, 6-deck, and never a +4 count. Can you say, "Up! Down! Up! Down! This way! That way! Round and round and round!"

I guess dead even isn't bad, but even the eye-in-the-sky makes $25 an hour, has the same cat-and-mouse fun on the other side, and gets health and pension benefits to boot. :flame: No, I am not considering a job on the other side. I've always been for the underdog. Besides, they don't pay enough.

I can't stand the thought of playing another game of blackjack at the present moment. I would not wish card counting on my worst enemy. But at least I met a lot of nice people in the course of the past three days.

From 1972 to 2000 I never bet on anything more than an occasional "square" in the office pool. The only thing I ever stayed up all night for was writing a program on my computer, which had me so engrossed I could not let go. There is nothing like a job... I miss the cash rolling in on good days and bad days alike. But, pensions are good, too. :eek:
 
flyingwind

flyingwind

Well-Known Member
#72
#72
KJ, did you say you play 50ish shoes per day? Assuming you only play two or three shoes at each place, you'd be going to 16 to 25 stores a day.
 
kewljason

kewljason

Well-Known Member
#73
#73
flyingwind said:
KJ, did you say you play 50ish shoes per day? Assuming you only play two or three shoes at each place, you'd be going to 16 to 25 stores a day.
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I do move around a lot, but don't hit 25 stores. :laugh: I wong out of negative shoes aggresively, so there are alot of less than 1 shoe sessions, but I don't need to leave the casino after each of those. Only leave the casino after high count shoes.
 
flyingwind

flyingwind

Well-Known Member
#74
#74
kewljason said:
I do move around a lot, but don't hit 25 stores. :laugh: I wong out of negative shoes aggresively, so there are alot of less than 1 shoe sessions, but I don't need to leave the casino after each of those. Only leave the casino after high count shoes.
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Ah. I see. Well, I am going to start keeping count, and if I ever play 50 shoes in one day, I will let you know.
 
S

Sucker

Well-Known Member
#75
#75
flyingwind said:
Ah. I see. Well, I am going to start keeping count, and if I ever play 50 shoes in one day, I will let you know.
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When he says 50 shoes it's only an estimate. He's not actually COUNTING them. Save your brain for keeping track of important things. ;)
 
Z

zoomie

Well-Known Member
#76
#76
kewljason said:
I do move around a lot, but don't hit 25 stores. :laugh: I wong out of negative shoes aggresively, so there are alot of less than 1 shoe sessions, but I don't need to leave the casino after each of those. Only leave the casino after high count shoes.
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KJ,

Can you give the stores just a little more detail so they can flyer you? :mad::mad::mad:
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
#78
#78
zoomie said:
KJ,

Can you give the stores just a little more detail so they can flyer you? :mad::mad::mad:
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I think you're right. KJ in his zeal for helping out his colleagues is giving up too much info on his own play. I have wanted to tell him, but did not want to step on his toes. After all, he is the one of the best, if not the premiere, green chip player on this site. KJ, you should have Ken erase many of your posts. Taken altogether, they paint a profile that would make it easy to find you. I am sure that some surveillance guy out there has your name and some cartoon character (since they don't know what you look like) pinned over their computer. Surveillance pay is not all that good, but like card counting, the cat-and-mouse makes the job entertaining and fulfilling. A good surveillance guy is just another card counter on the other side. Your posts challenge them to do their job, which is to identify and back off counters. ***** Then the other side of me says to myself, KJ is smarter than anyone thinks. He is actually giving out false information to throw off those who follow his posts. I cannot say definitely that this is not the case. His play is so flawless, one cannot help thinking that his camo, even on line, is just as flawless. Whatever the case, now I have said something that I hope is not taken as an offense. I owe a lot to KJ for being so honest in responses to my own posts. I hope you understand that I want each and every AP on this site to succeed beyond their wildest dreams. Given the present state of games and card counting, this is not likely, however, unless they more on to other forms of AP IMHO. :cry: As in every endeavor, desire, hard work and discipline is the way to success. D$mn! It's just like having a job!
 
S

Sucker

Well-Known Member
#80
#80
kewljason said:
I do move around a lot, but don't hit 25 stores. :laugh: I wong out of negative shoes aggresively, so there are alot of less than 1 shoe sessions, but I don't need to leave the casino after each of those. Only leave the casino after high count shoes.
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I'd like to know how THIS is too much information. What are they going to do, bar everyone who ever changes tables in the middle of a shoe? :confused: This describes only about half of all the ploppies on Earth.
 
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