Wondering if anyone can answer

tfg

Well-Known Member
Hello all, I've been on the boards now for a few weeks and love checking things out on here. I'm new to these boards, but not new to playing. I have a bunch of questions that I was hoping people could give some insight on.

I am a recreational blackjack player and love playing. Most of the time, I just like playing for a few hours and having a few drinks and normally just looking to kill some time and have fun. I don't usually win or lose very big. However, I want to step up a little bit and make this actually profitable.

Let me preface by saying, I learned basic strategy around 5 or 6 years ago when I started getting into the game and have that down front and back. I've learned some counting but haven't practiced and aren't very good at it. I haven't tried it really because most of the time I'm just having fun and a little buzzed so I don't have the mental capacity.

My situation is this: I want to know if this is something that I can do on a part time basis to make a little money, without becoming a full time player and using advanced techniques. I'm not looking to become a millionaire.
-Would it be possible to just play some low stakes, and occasional variation of my bets to make around $200-$250 a week? I'm talking like going to the casino, just playing basic strategy with some slight variation of bets and when and if I get up by like $100-$125, then just take off. Do this like twice a week.
-I mean I know with just BS I'm at the disadvantage, but if I have some slight bet increases when I see some favorable conditions, and hit a couple double downs I'd be right at that amount at like a $10 table. Not high stakes, just basically taking off when I get a swing my way which always happens when you're playing. You always have one or two good shoes.
-My other problem is that there's only really one place to play where I'm from. Is this going to look suspicious that I'm basically there like twice a week and then leaving when I'm up by a predetermined amount, or is that just too low of action to be concerned. Remember I'm not going to be counting really.

Am I off base on this? I realize that I could catch a couple bad shoes and break, but I'm looking at it like just one or two sessions a week and leaving when I get up by a certain amount. I appreciate any insight.
 

shadroch

Well-Known Member
Suppose it were possible for you to somehow do this. Get up $100-$125 and stop. Why would you? If you could make $250 playing low stakes BJ for an hour or two, human nature is such that you'd soon start playing for ten hours and trying to win $1,000 or more a week.
In Las Vegas, it is possible for a small time grinder to eak out a few hundred dollars a week thru coupons and promos, but it sounds like you are a long way from Vegas.
 

tfg

Well-Known Member
shadroch said:
Suppose it were possible for you to somehow do this. Get up $100-$125 and stop. Why would you? If you could make $250 playing low stakes BJ for an hour or two, human nature is such that you'd soon start playing for ten hours and trying to win $1,000 or more a week.
In Las Vegas, it is possible for a small time grinder to eak out a few hundred dollars a week thru coupons and promos, but it sounds like you are a long way from Vegas.
Haha, I am a long way from Vegas, but I am there a few times a year.

I see what you're saying, but like I said, I was thinking of this as just a part time thing for just some extra cash. I also realize what you're saying about it being human nature to always trying to win more, but that's what eventually leads to the edge that the house has. I'm just looking to make a small consistent profit and leave every session up some money. Even if it takes one shoe, or 12 shoes. I realize that I'll run into some shoes that'll pound me, but I have the bankroll to absorb being down. Plus, it'll probably draw less attention if I go a few times a week and leave with a few small winnings than try to break the bank in one day for a grand.

I mean in theory, I could just go to a hundred dollar table and just play basic strategy for a couple shoes and win just a few hands and I'd be there.
 
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shadroch

Well-Known Member
I'd re-examine that theory. Basic strategy helps you lose less, not win more.
If you have the bankroll to play $50-$200 a hand, read Max Rubins "Comp City" and try to use as many things in it as possible.
 

QFIT

Well-Known Member
KOLAN said:
best book for you (golden touch blackjack revolution) Frank Scoblete
Or, you could throw your money out the window on the way to Vegas and obtain the same result without all the work.
 

QFIT

Well-Known Member
tfg said:
-Would it be possible to just play some low stakes, and occasional variation of my bets to make around $200-$250 a week? I'm talking like going to the casino, just playing basic strategy with some slight variation of bets and when and if I get up by like $100-$125, then just take off. Do this like twice a week.
Sorry, but this is no more realistic than asking us for advice on time travel. I don't mean to be insulting. There exists a high variance in Blackjack even with the best of strategies. You are asking if you can make a consistent income with the odds against you. If you could do this, why would Las Vegas exist?
 

tfg

Well-Known Member
QFIT said:
Sorry, but this is no more realistic than asking us for advice on time travel. I don't mean to be insulting. There exists a high variance in Blackjack even with the best of strategies. You are asking if you can make a consistent income with the odds against you. If you could do this, why would Las Vegas exist?
Because most people bet the same amount every hand.
 

FLASH1296

Well-Known Member
NOTE:

KOLAN is a Russian Retardate; his nationality is moot, although I like the snappy alliteration.

His recommendation to you ...

("best book for you golden touch blackjack revolution)"

... merely the latest illustration of his diminished capacity.
 

QFIT

Well-Known Member
tfg said:
Because most people bet the same amount every hand.
Yes, and most people lose. That's why Vegas has been the fastest growing city in the country for over a decade.
 

ihate17

Well-Known Member
what are "favorable situations" ?

You already know that BS is a losing proposition. A favorable situation would be if you know the dealers hole card or some how know the next card or two out of the shoe.
I will take for granted that either you will not know this or if you find it out it will be after you have already placed your bet.

But when I hear favorable situations from someone who does not count, two things that absolutely mean little or nothing seem to come up.
1. You are in a win streak and start pressing your bet. There really is no justification for this unless the composition of the remaining cards (cardcounting) would call for an increase in your bets. You won the previous hands because of good luck (variance) but that has no effect on your next hand.

2. You are in the middle of a shoe and a bunch of small cards hit the felt. You say to yourself that aces and faces are coming next, unfortunately for you the count had been highly negative before the last hand and all those small cards only brought the count to some area that is less negative. You are raising your bet now with a bigger disadvantage than you had when the shoe began.

ihate17
 

ohbehave

Well-Known Member
The problem is that more times than not you will start out down the hundred or two hundred bucks. Thus the overall result is a net loss.

The only way to avoid this is to gain an advantage but even then you will still have many losing sessions. But over time you will win more than you lose. With BS you will lose more than you win.
 

tfg

Well-Known Member
ohbehave said:
The problem is that more times than not you will start out down the hundred or two hundred bucks. Thus the overall result is a net loss.

The only way to avoid this is to gain an advantage but even then you will still have many losing sessions. But over time you will win more than you lose. With BS you will lose more than you win.
Yes, this is what I've noticed. There are occasions where I'll start down and then I've just got to grind back up. But the one thing is, is that I'm going to be playing mainly a $10 min, with my only other bets being $20 and $40. My goal is really to play it close and get a couple doubles when I've got a higher bet out.
 

shadroch

Well-Known Member
Thats not really a goal, thats a dream.
Describe the conditions where you play- how many decks, table minimum, rules, ect, ect.
 

callipygian

Well-Known Member
QFIT said:
Yes, and most people lose. That's why Vegas has been the fastest growing city in the country for over a decade.
Actually, casinos make (or at least made from 2000-2006) more money from their rooms and services than from gambling. Maybe with the recent tourism downturn gambling revenues climbed back up as a percentage (assuming there's a fair amount of gambling revenue coming from addicts which is invariant with the economy).
 

tfg

Well-Known Member
shadroch said:
Thats not really a goal, thats a dream.
Describe the conditions where you play- how many decks, table minimum, rules, ect, ect.
Conditions: Min $10, S17, 8 deck, 3:2 blackjack, double any 2 and after split, no surrender
 

ChefJJ

Well-Known Member
callipygian said:
Actually, casinos make (or at least made from 2000-2006) more money from their rooms and services than from gambling. Maybe with the recent tourism downturn gambling revenues climbed back up as a percentage (assuming there's a fair amount of gambling revenue coming from addicts which is invariant with the economy).
Good point...and the Las Vegas region experienced growth in other industrial sectors that was part of the boom.

But the old adage of casinos paying the bills from the losers' money still applies :joker: ...that money just isn't why Vegas is what it is today.

good luck

PS - Sorry all for the digression.
 

johndoe

Well-Known Member
tfg said:
Conditions: Min $10, S17, 8 deck, 3:2 blackjack, double any 2 and after split, no surrender
This isn't a very good game unless penetration is extremely good.

I think you have a very distorted view of counting. No one here with any clue expects to make millions.

In good conditions, you can expect to make 1-2 units per hour in the long run. So at a $25 minimum bet, you'll earn $25-$50/hr, but your bankroll will go up and down like a roller coaster. There is NO consistency to be expected. You'll have many days where you're down thousands.

Read up some of the better books, posted elsewhere on this site, read the faqs, etc.
 

SystemsTrader

Well-Known Member
tfg said:
I was thinking of this as just a part time thing for just some extra cash. I also realize what you're saying about it being human nature to always trying to win more, but that's what eventually leads to the edge that the house has. I'm just looking to make a small consistent profit and leave every session up some money. Even if it takes one shoe, or 12 shoes.
Unfortunately there are no short cuts in life. Since you are not willing to put up the effort to beat this game I would strongly suggest a job at McDonalds. It will guarantee you a small consistent profit and you will leave every session or shift up money.
 

RingyDingy

Well-Known Member
to concur

To concur with what others have posted, counting cards, really isnt "fun" per se, it after a period of time is a grind and you become a robot.

You need to learn a whole other series of skills, for you playing at such a level on a pretty ordinary game you should learn to wong in and out successfully, if your goal is $150/200 win per session, then this could theoretically mean very little play but a lot of backcounting. Is that your idea of fun?

Personally if your goal is as you say, a modest session win, drop the advanced count, go to something simple, hi-lo, and learn to count several tables at once, and cherry pick from there. keeping 2-3 counts from separate tables is more than enough challenge :)

anyway welcome aboard, enjoy your stay and dont get emotional - its all maths baby, yeah!

Ringy
 
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