Officially Over
- Thread starter wvbjplayer
- Start date
well almost, problem is there comes a point where your money can be down significantly (if only in your mind). it is at this point where any gambler AP or not most probably will become disapointed. it is at times such as these wherein the AP's greatest danger lurks. that being steaming which is just emotion driven over betting out of frustration, anger and unfounded wishful thinking. this is where Zengrifter's point that knowing the pendulum swings both ways is so important to keep in mind. acceptance of this fact sprinkled with a bit of patience and confidence that your playing the best game you can is about your best defense against falling for the temptation to over bet.
God must really love the poor and the superstitious. Why else would he create so many of them.
It must be great to be able to go with life with God as a crutch to explain every failure.
Can't get a good job- Gods's will.
Live in Moms basement- Gods' will.
Lose in the casino- Gods' will.
I believe in God,but believe God helps those who help themselves.
Good luck in your future. Hopefully God will like your next endevor better.
It must be great to be able to go with life with God as a crutch to explain every failure.
Can't get a good job- Gods's will.
Live in Moms basement- Gods' will.
Lose in the casino- Gods' will.
I believe in God,but believe God helps those who help themselves.
Good luck in your future. Hopefully God will like your next endevor better.
just wondering
So, if you had won those dd's, splits etc, how would you see God in that ?
Would you even acknowledge God today with all that cash in your pocket ?
If you we're, say, to 'invest' that money with a 'legit' investor, and it turned a huge profit for you, would that be seedy ? Or is that ok because a guy with a suit and a fancy sign on a upscale building hands you the money, not telling you that your 'investment' returned a profit from exploiting people in third world countries ? Do you see where this is going. I see the casino as a way to get a return on my dollar-hopefully a decent one down the road when my br can accomodate. How is this any different than the scenario I painted previously ? Please dont blame God. Too many gray areas in life my friend.
I wish you well
So, if you had won those dd's, splits etc, how would you see God in that ?
Would you even acknowledge God today with all that cash in your pocket ?
If you we're, say, to 'invest' that money with a 'legit' investor, and it turned a huge profit for you, would that be seedy ? Or is that ok because a guy with a suit and a fancy sign on a upscale building hands you the money, not telling you that your 'investment' returned a profit from exploiting people in third world countries ? Do you see where this is going. I see the casino as a way to get a return on my dollar-hopefully a decent one down the road when my br can accomodate. How is this any different than the scenario I painted previously ? Please dont blame God. Too many gray areas in life my friend.
I wish you well
Oh, I'm actually a staunch atheist. That's probably another reason God was punishing me. Not a big fan of irony, are you? 
Incidentally, at the risk of straying wildly from the thread topic (not to mention the message board itself), most people AREN'T responsible for their shitty lots in life. They're just handed them, and don't have (and can't feasibly acquire) the skills necessary to improve them. Their genetic "toolkits" are woefully inadequate for the task. The sooner we all recognize that unlovely fact, the sooner we'll quit judging those we perceive as intellectually, morally, or otherwise inferior.
One must play the cards he's dealt.
wvbjplayer
Incidentally, at the risk of straying wildly from the thread topic (not to mention the message board itself), most people AREN'T responsible for their shitty lots in life. They're just handed them, and don't have (and can't feasibly acquire) the skills necessary to improve them. Their genetic "toolkits" are woefully inadequate for the task. The sooner we all recognize that unlovely fact, the sooner we'll quit judging those we perceive as intellectually, morally, or otherwise inferior.
One must play the cards he's dealt.
wvbjplayer
Why are you raving about something I long ago conceded, as though I were wholly ignorant of it? Haven't you read the whole thread?
Anyway, of course I was overbetting; I had no choice, unless I wanted to drive another 5 1/2 hrs. to play (which I didn't). Nevertheless, my luck was exceedingly poor. I'm not sure why so many on here seem to think those two phenomena are somehow incompatible, as if the size of one's bet somehow affected his hands. Try to conceive of a world where BOTH of the following are true:
1. I overbet.
2. My hands sucked ass.
When you have conceived of this world, you will have conceived of the world I actually experienced, and then, perhaps, begin to realize why I am so frustrated and disappointed - while nonetheless conceding my imperfect strategy.
wvbjplayer
Anyway, of course I was overbetting; I had no choice, unless I wanted to drive another 5 1/2 hrs. to play (which I didn't). Nevertheless, my luck was exceedingly poor. I'm not sure why so many on here seem to think those two phenomena are somehow incompatible, as if the size of one's bet somehow affected his hands. Try to conceive of a world where BOTH of the following are true:
1. I overbet.
2. My hands sucked ass.
When you have conceived of this world, you will have conceived of the world I actually experienced, and then, perhaps, begin to realize why I am so frustrated and disappointed - while nonetheless conceding my imperfect strategy.
wvbjplayer
Scroll up. I answered this question in an earlier post.
I also answered this question in another thread, several times, where you similarly harangued me. So, I infer that you're asking only to make the same old tired point that I've now conceded ad nauseum, to wit: that I was overbetting.
No ****. Let's move on.
wvbjplayer
I also answered this question in another thread, several times, where you similarly harangued me. So, I infer that you're asking only to make the same old tired point that I've now conceded ad nauseum, to wit: that I was overbetting.
No ****. Let's move on.
wvbjplayer
Yo i play ac all the time, Iv been kicked the crap out of just as many times as iv kicked the crap out the casinos, but i gotta say that in the time period where i did have enough winnings to bet on a 25 dollar table the times i lost were pretty fing harsh, i mean iv lost multiple hands t big bets before, but the amount of money being wagerd on a 25$ table is pretty extreme and it hit me hard.
Its also worth mentioning that in the game of life i think playing blackjack for that kinda money and losing really makes a man out of you, im only 21 and still impressionable and i know that it has definately impacted my life for the better, and whenever **** comes my way i find i can deal with it better.
But for real man losing a couple thousand is nothing, especially on a 25 min table, iv lost over 2 grand in one shoe alone dozens of times. You gotta go find a temp job get some more bankroll over the next few months and and go back an try again. Also you need to be betting alot more than 100 a hand if you wanna beat an 8 decker 25 min. I got knocked out once and did that now im well in the posative, if you playign a winning game EVENTUALLY the money will come your way you just gotta work for it, even if that means working at kmart for a few months befopre you go back again.
Ferret
Its also worth mentioning that in the game of life i think playing blackjack for that kinda money and losing really makes a man out of you, im only 21 and still impressionable and i know that it has definately impacted my life for the better, and whenever **** comes my way i find i can deal with it better.
But for real man losing a couple thousand is nothing, especially on a 25 min table, iv lost over 2 grand in one shoe alone dozens of times. You gotta go find a temp job get some more bankroll over the next few months and and go back an try again. Also you need to be betting alot more than 100 a hand if you wanna beat an 8 decker 25 min. I got knocked out once and did that now im well in the posative, if you playign a winning game EVENTUALLY the money will come your way you just gotta work for it, even if that means working at kmart for a few months befopre you go back again.
Ferret
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Haven't been to either but Mountaineer is closer lol. Also, from early reports, it sounded like maybe it had better games, maybe lower limits, and maybe fewer if any CSM's. Any $10 table is fine with me lol - so what if I lose $10, one bet, every 200 hands. More often than not, thru betting $20 in a very high count, some betting system designed to win a unit, just plain luck, dealer error, etc, I can make up that one betting unit every few hours and break even lol. Mission accomplished in my world.
Anyway, I'll just say I think you'll be back sometime just because I think you are young and you like the game and have many more bankrolls to accumulate lol. You know the mistake you made (I think) - don't make it next time. If so, persevere in your spare time without money and learn about risk and bankroll.
I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here - I know you're sick of the whole overbetting thing - but as to your point
"as if the size of one's bet somehow affected his hands. Try to conceive of a world where BOTH of the following are true:1. I overbet.2. My hands sucked ass."
I'll just say the size of your bet does not effect your hands, like you say, just your bankroll. To take things to an extreme to try to make a point, try to conceive of a world where you only bet at a TC+20, always with an enormous expected advantage, but always bet, say, half, even all of, your bankroll and even assume you win more hands than you're supposed to.
Obviously, despite the constant advantage, and great cards, it's obvious, don't you think?, you will lose all your money.
All of which isn't to say it's very possible your cards actually did suck lol.
You know it's easy to give advice like this perhaps leaving the impression as if I've always followed my own advice lol. But don't think I haven't been where you are. I remember steaming and losing $1500 in a few hands when I had no idea what I was doing but thought I did. Damn those high counts anyway lol. There went that trip roll, no surprise lol. In my 20's, I bet the money for my plane ticket back home from London on a hand of BJ after losing everything else I had. In my defense I was 100 times, more like infinity since I knew absloutley nothing, lol, dumber then than you are now. You have a foundation you can build upon, little by little, over time if you so choose.
Even then, bottom line, the more you learn the more you will discover the AC and the WV games pretty much suck anyway, and aren't really worth it anyway. OK, maybe if you back-count, but I never found that much fun to do all the time.
I give you credit for stating enough detail, asking what went wrong and hanging in there.
To make you feel inferior over it is just plain wrong and hopefully nobody meant to do that.
Anyway, I'll just say I think you'll be back sometime just because I think you are young and you like the game and have many more bankrolls to accumulate lol. You know the mistake you made (I think) - don't make it next time. If so, persevere in your spare time without money and learn about risk and bankroll.
I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here - I know you're sick of the whole overbetting thing - but as to your point
"as if the size of one's bet somehow affected his hands. Try to conceive of a world where BOTH of the following are true:1. I overbet.2. My hands sucked ass."
I'll just say the size of your bet does not effect your hands, like you say, just your bankroll. To take things to an extreme to try to make a point, try to conceive of a world where you only bet at a TC+20, always with an enormous expected advantage, but always bet, say, half, even all of, your bankroll and even assume you win more hands than you're supposed to.
Obviously, despite the constant advantage, and great cards, it's obvious, don't you think?, you will lose all your money.
All of which isn't to say it's very possible your cards actually did suck lol.
You know it's easy to give advice like this perhaps leaving the impression as if I've always followed my own advice lol. But don't think I haven't been where you are. I remember steaming and losing $1500 in a few hands when I had no idea what I was doing but thought I did. Damn those high counts anyway lol. There went that trip roll, no surprise lol. In my 20's, I bet the money for my plane ticket back home from London on a hand of BJ after losing everything else I had. In my defense I was 100 times, more like infinity since I knew absloutley nothing, lol, dumber then than you are now. You have a foundation you can build upon, little by little, over time if you so choose.
Even then, bottom line, the more you learn the more you will discover the AC and the WV games pretty much suck anyway, and aren't really worth it anyway. OK, maybe if you back-count, but I never found that much fun to do all the time.
I give you credit for stating enough detail, asking what went wrong and hanging in there.
To make you feel inferior over it is just plain wrong and hopefully nobody meant to do that.
Thats not raving, thats the drill sergeant in me.
The reason that we don't overbet is because of extended losing streaks. When you are sufficently capitalized you will come to
experience REAL GODD*MN LOSING STREAKS! BIGGER THAN YOU CAN IMAGINE - F**KING HUGE SCREEMING FREEFALS! You wake-up having nightmares. zg
The reason that we don't overbet is because of extended losing streaks. When you are sufficently capitalized you will come to
experience REAL GODD*MN LOSING STREAKS! BIGGER THAN YOU CAN IMAGINE - F**KING HUGE SCREEMING FREEFALS! You wake-up having nightmares. zg
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I think the guy understands
In the past I made a partial list of why I think many people who try counting will eventually fail or just give it up.
A couple of big ones were not enough bankroll, over betting, and failure to properly spread. He had these three combined and he knew it but was hoping to catch the plus end of the curve early on and he did not, so now he is doing the best thing he can do for himself, as far as blackjack goes, he has stopped playing.
Much smarter than playing on borrowed money or rent money, and he might have learned a lesson that can be used not only if he returns to blackjack but also if he decides to start his own business some day in the future.
This thread also has some points that every novice counter should know.
ihate17
In the past I made a partial list of why I think many people who try counting will eventually fail or just give it up.
A couple of big ones were not enough bankroll, over betting, and failure to properly spread. He had these three combined and he knew it but was hoping to catch the plus end of the curve early on and he did not, so now he is doing the best thing he can do for himself, as far as blackjack goes, he has stopped playing.
Much smarter than playing on borrowed money or rent money, and he might have learned a lesson that can be used not only if he returns to blackjack but also if he decides to start his own business some day in the future.
This thread also has some points that every novice counter should know.
ihate17
sagefr0g said:
finally i think i understand ...as to how that there err uhmm bet system goes.
I'm scientific - none of that pansy-ass Fuzzy Counting crap for me :grin:
oh i know the differance in methods are stark.
to where this patheticly anectdotal chart reveals only what can be an illusion of similarity in light of careful rigorous scientific treatment as opposed to some seedy depraved approach of glutonous superstition which is but a vale shrouding a timid and fearful soul trembling before God.
to where this patheticly anectdotal chart reveals only what can be an illusion of similarity in light of careful rigorous scientific treatment as opposed to some seedy depraved approach of glutonous superstition which is but a vale shrouding a timid and fearful soul trembling before God.
Attachments
No, I had actually forgotten, but I think I found it.
Let me make sure I have the parameters right:
$25 min
$50 max at a TC of +10 (are we talking about hi-lo here, or some other count?)
Sometimes doubling for less
Largely play-all
And the bankroll progression was, what, starting at around $700, then winning $1000 in 24 hours, then losing $2000 over a more extended period?
How much were you betting when you had that first big win?
And hey, I sympathize. I checked, and when I started playing, I started betting $50 max bets when my bankroll was $1200. Now, there were the important modulations that my min bet was $5 or $10, and I was wonging as much as possible. Even then, I ran a very real chance of having my bankroll collapse on me. Instead, I got extremely lucky, and my first seven or 8 trips were winning ones (some of them were long and scary, but I still walked away with wins). And then I got th einfusion of cash from from online gambling, which took away the immediate risk of ruin, and replaced it with the longer term risk of ruin.
Let me make sure I have the parameters right:
$25 min
$50 max at a TC of +10 (are we talking about hi-lo here, or some other count?)
Sometimes doubling for less
Largely play-all
And the bankroll progression was, what, starting at around $700, then winning $1000 in 24 hours, then losing $2000 over a more extended period?
How much were you betting when you had that first big win?
And hey, I sympathize. I checked, and when I started playing, I started betting $50 max bets when my bankroll was $1200. Now, there were the important modulations that my min bet was $5 or $10, and I was wonging as much as possible. Even then, I ran a very real chance of having my bankroll collapse on me. Instead, I got extremely lucky, and my first seven or 8 trips were winning ones (some of them were long and scary, but I still walked away with wins). And then I got th einfusion of cash from from online gambling, which took away the immediate risk of ruin, and replaced it with the longer term risk of ruin.
Well if you feel that way about playing BJ, you made a good choice in ceasing to do it. Never do things you believe are wrong to do, and only you know what those things are. It does disgust me that when I walk out of the casino with a profit (it only happens 55-60% of the time, even for the best of us) that this money once came from someone else who likely worked hard for it and was tricked out of it by the false promises of gambling. It doesn't bother me to deprive the casino of it, and it is helpful to know that the countermeasures they take against the likes of me also slows the rate at which they take from the uneducated. Some of my BJ winnings are added to my schedule of charitable donations, and some of those charities help those harmed by gambling and other vice.
At least in the Christian confessions I'm familiar with, God is interested in your soul and not your money. It's his self-appointed representatives who want your money. So I don't believe God makes you lose any more than he makes others win. This is a mathematical exercise and we are bound by the limitations of the math. Playing undercapitalized, actually, is fine, as long as you are willing to accept going home with an empty pocket. I play a $25 unit myself and on a bad night I would be thrilled to lose a mere $1000! That's why I bring much more than that; because losing $1000 is a completely normal event. I guess you understand this now. And I hope you took away a better understanding of God and of math from your experience.
At least in the Christian confessions I'm familiar with, God is interested in your soul and not your money. It's his self-appointed representatives who want your money. So I don't believe God makes you lose any more than he makes others win. This is a mathematical exercise and we are bound by the limitations of the math. Playing undercapitalized, actually, is fine, as long as you are willing to accept going home with an empty pocket. I play a $25 unit myself and on a bad night I would be thrilled to lose a mere $1000! That's why I bring much more than that; because losing $1000 is a completely normal event. I guess you understand this now. And I hope you took away a better understanding of God and of math from your experience.