Barona and Chumash Casino's

#1
Hey guys, I'm not really new to the forums, as I would always read everything posted, just never created an account until now. I've been counting now for 7 months and am going to be living in San Diego soon... was wondering what all the casinos down there are like, I heard Barona is a favorite, but was curious about the heat from that place. I've already read all about the rules there, but if anyone could let me know anything they know about the place it would be greatly appreciated.

I also have been hitting up the Chumash Casino up by Santa Barbara for the last 6 months... if anyone has any questions on that just shoot it my way.. i know the place like the back of my hand.. literally :)

-bandit
 
#2
I guess the only question I have is why do you play Chumash? I suggest you research the archives on "How to find a playable game". I can't remember the last time Chumash had a decent game. I did see Social Distortion there last year and it was a kick-ass show.

gg
 

EasyRhino

Well-Known Member
#3
Barona isn't too sweaty. But there is seldom good penetration.

There are also 6 or 9 or so other casinos in the county.
 

Mimosine

Well-Known Member
#4
i played chumash 3 weeks ago, it is really an awful game. PM me if you know something different.

as far as SD goes, you should consider: Barona, Golden Acorn, Valley View and Pala. Viejas and Sycuan are horrible from a player's perspective both on rules and pen the last time i was there.... i can swap more info, if indeed you have something useful to share about chumash.

Chumash sent me some coupons that i have to use, but the thought of driving that far for their game is only tolerable by the view on the way up....
 

ihate17

Well-Known Member
#6
San Diego casinos compete

In most cases San Diego casinos have other casinos close enough to them that they must compete with each other in comps or game choices or both to lure players in.
You will find this extremely different than the Chumash operation where they take the attitude that there are no other casinos to compete with so we can offer you the world's worst comp rate combined with inferior blackjack. In many ways the Chumash is right because there is no other casino within 5 hours drive.

ihate17
 
#7
Chumash

I enjoy playing at the chumash. It's only about 30 mins from santa barbara, where i live. The game they offer is 6 deck, H17, DAS and blackjack pays 3:2. They usually have about 4 5$ tables open during the day, and more in the evening. They can get pretty full at times. Most people playing them don't have a clue though.. You can always find a 10$ or 25$ table open. Alot of the time they are empty. I've been going weekly for the past few months. I usually do pretty good. The last 3 times I've gone I have played for about 3 hours each day and have walked out 150$ up. I just play basic strategy. Oh and believe it or not, most of the dealers DO know basic strategy.
 

Mimosine

Well-Known Member
#8
7410sb said:
I just play basic strategy.
from a BS perspective it isn't the best game because the rules aren't that hot, but from a counter's perspective it is a poor game. pen is about 66% consistently - bad for counter's, OK for BS players, since it SLOWS the game down. 2 deck chop on a 6D H17 game with no LS. only worth playing with a strong wong strategy.
 

ihate17

Well-Known Member
#9
Bad pen on ASM game does not really hurt the casino

Mimosine said:
from a BS perspective it isn't the best game because the rules aren't that hot, but from a counter's perspective it is a poor game. pen is about 66% consistently - bad for counter's, OK for BS players, since it SLOWS the game down. 2 deck chop on a 6D H17 game with no LS. only worth playing with a strong wong strategy.

From my last peak at the Chumash, they actually have improved their pen since my last visit 6 months ago. Of course I only looked at one shift but 1.5 seemed like the norm, but still nothing to write home about.

Since every blackjack table at the Chumash has an ASM, the house loses nearly nothing by offering bad pen when compared to a hand shuffle game.

ihate17
 

JulieCA

Well-Known Member
#10
I've been playing at Chumash quite a bit lately because I've been in the area on other business.

I'm still practicing my counting, so I'm a BS player. The penetration is still bad - very few dealers are penetrating at less than 70% on the 6D game.

There are a LOT of ploppies, especially in the summer and especially after 5:00 or 6:00 p.m. I generally try to play there early in the day and leave by about 4:00.
 

ihate17

Well-Known Member
#11
Greed, stupidity and paranoia (Also know as Chumash)

I seriously doubt that there is another casino in the country that comps its players at a lower rate than the Chumash, especially table game players. They know their situation being isolated and in a rich area, they will maintain enough players to make great profits without giving much away, so they do just that.

They have a procedure at the Chumash which few other casinos have and it has to cost them a ton of money every single day on their blackjack tables.
Everyone in the world, except management at the Chumash, knows that the average bad blackjack player does not like to play heads up with the dealer. For this reason, nearly every other casino, breaks the shoe when a table goes dead, starting a new shoe when a player sits down. These casinos know from experience that extremely often when one person sits down at a table he will be joined by a couple of other players who happened to be milling arond and waiting for this to happen. These other casino also know that players are superstitious and that when they see a deck or two in the discard rack and no players, it was a "bad shoe" so they do not sit down. The management at the Chumash is so ignorant of just how ploppies think that they refuse to start a new shoe, without any exceptions, till the old shoe has been dealt out. Where this really cost them big money is on their higher limit tables where sometimes in crowded conditions the table will stay dead for periods of much more than an hour. Making this procedure even more ridiculous is the fact that they have an ASM at every blackjack table, so there is no arguement about time down for shuffling.

Years ago, there was a blackjack website owned by a Santa Barbara professor, Elliott Jacobson. Do not remember the website name but do remember Mr Jacobson stating that he was barred from the Chumash. This was shortly after they began dealing blackjack and did not have ASM,s.
Mr Jacobson, found a weakness or weaknesses in their shuffle and got a meeting with someone in management and pointed this out to them and gave them advice on how to shuffle better. I do not know Mr Jacobson's motivations, but the result of him showing them some knowledge was their banning him and then purchasing the ASM machines. The ability of a rare player who might get an edge, every so slight, on their games, drives these people to offer a poor game with worse pen, without needing to really train their pits. They just live in their own perfect little paranoid world.

I live in the area but play there rarely.

ihate17
 

JulieCA

Well-Known Member
#12
The "we can do whatever we want because we have no real competition" is what keeps me out of most of the more isolated Indian casinos in California. At least in Vegas or other larger NV locations, you can get up and move on to the casino next door.

And it's not only the isolated ones - The Spa, in downtown Palm Springs, gives good comps but they act like they're the only game in town and frequently get arbitrary with how they handle the BJ tables. OK - they're really convenient but not the only game in town by a long shot.

My "blackjack girlfriends" (yes, the ones who taught me how to play) wanted to go stay at Chumash a couple years ago. We went into sticker shock at the price of rooms. Holy cow! I don't know if they're still that unrealistic, but I know I won't be staying there unless comped! We opted for Santa Maria and wine country tours. Talk about stupid policies - if we had stayed at the casino hotel, we would've spent a lot more time in the casino and casino restaurants. As it was, we went there 1 time during the 3-day "girl's weekend."

I'll have to watch the dead tables again the next time I go to Chumash. I hadn't noticed that they don't start a new shoe when the table isn't busy.
 

ihate17

Well-Known Member
#13
Very small hotel

There are just slightly over 100 rooms at the Chumash and most will be taken by people with comps. I think they bought the Royal Scandanavian Inn in Solvang but if you are a gambler you do not want to stay in the casino a few miles from the casino but want to stay in the casino attached.

They used to send out mailers with coupons for free rooms or discounted rooms but I am not receiving them now. Today I think you have to give them a lot of action to get anything free, as I said in an earlier post, they are extremely cheap/greedy.

Palm Springs, the Pechanga area, and San Diego all have enough casinos available that they offer better comps and often better games. Often if the casino is very freeway accessable they offer much less than a casino 30 minutes away off a dangerous mountain road. It is not Vegas where you walk out one door and into another but in one area you have places like Pechanga, Pala, Pauma, Rincon and Valley View all within a short drive from one another, they all pay attention to what their competition is doing.
Chumash? You have to drive about 5 hours to get to another casino and they know it and milk it on their comps, games, hotel rooms, shows and anything else they believe they can rape the public with.

As you can guess, though I live fairly close by I have little love for them.

ihate17
 

Mimosine

Well-Known Member
#14
ihate17 hits the nail on the head on all counts.

Chumash is a comp nightmare, with very piss poor games.

S. San Diego has buy far the best options IMHO.

N. San Diego has many Good options.

Palm Springs has options if you look carefully.

Palm Springs has been the most generous to me with comps, coupons, and even hosts. I'm a low roller with a host who gets me free rooms on big holidays. That says a lot, I respect and appreciate it, and play very politely at the places that extend me this courtesy.
 

JulieCA

Well-Known Member
#15
I think I'm about equidistant from the N. San Diego casinos, Palm Springs and Chumash. The big difference is - my daughter lives in Santa Maria and I go there when I visit her. If I was losing all the time, I wouldn't go. I have a friend in PS so even if I'm not comped rooms, I have somewhere to stay for free, so I do go there quite often.

I'm actually closest to San Manual - but so, apparently, is most of Los Angeles. :laugh: I've only been there twice and while I can't exactly classify either experience as a terrible one, it wasn't great either. I don't even stop there on my way to PS.

Morongo - fly right by. They spent all that money putting up a tower you can see for miles but the casino is a pit. Literally. I don't know what their comps are and I don't care. If their rooms look anything like the casino floor, I wouldn't want to stay there.

Next time I take a day trip to a casino, I'll head south and take y'all up on the recommendations for Pala or Pechanga.
 

irobinson

Well-Known Member
#16
Mimosine said:
ihate17 hits the nail on the head on all counts.

Chumash is a comp nightmare, with very piss poor games.

S. San Diego has buy far the best options IMHO.

N. San Diego has many Good options.

Palm Springs has options if you look carefully.

Palm Springs has been the most generous to me with comps, coupons, and even hosts. I'm a low roller with a host who gets me free rooms on big holidays. That says a lot, I respect and appreciate it, and play very politely at the places that extend me this courtesy.
Palm Springs area has been good to us (wife and I) as well. Host will comp rooms on a weekend without much trouble. We are low rollers as well and I get coupons all the time for match play and I just a coupon for a free night (as long as it is not a Saturday night). I am sure the casino host will give me the night if I asked, however.
 

irobinson

Well-Known Member
#17
JulieCA said:
I think I'm about equidistant from the N. San Diego casinos, Palm Springs and Chumash. The big difference is - my daughter lives in Santa Maria and I go there when I visit her. If I was losing all the time, I wouldn't go. I have a friend in PS so even if I'm not comped rooms, I have somewhere to stay for free, so I do go there quite often.

I'm actually closest to San Manual - but so, apparently, is most of Los Angeles. :laugh: I've only been there twice and while I can't exactly classify either experience as a terrible one, it wasn't great either. I don't even stop there on my way to PS.

Morongo - fly right by. They spent all that money putting up a tower you can see for miles but the casino is a pit. Literally. I don't know what their comps are and I don't care. If their rooms look anything like the casino floor, I wouldn't want to stay there.

Next time I take a day trip to a casino, I'll head south and take y'all up on the recommendations for Pala or Pechanga.
Pala offers a better game than Pechanga. Both are H17 but you can surrender and resplit aces at Pala on shoe games. Pitch games do away with surrender and resplit. The Italian restaurant there is pretty good too.
 

irobinson

Well-Known Member
#18
PS...Pala is only about 10 miles south of Pechanga. Just keep driving south past Pechanga (on the same street as Pechanga) and you will be there before you know it. It is also a nice drive. Better than staying on I-15.
 

Pro21

Well-Known Member
#19
irobinson said:
Pala offers a better game than Pechanga. Both are H17 but you can surrender and resplit aces at Pala on shoe games. Pitch games do away with surrender and resplit. The Italian restaurant there is pretty good too.
If you bet black chips or heavy green you probably want to avoid Pala. Their pit is really stupid and they sweat blood.
 
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