Guns displayed during a backoff

[Automatic Monkey]

Recently I received a backoff where several armed guards approached me and escorted me out with their jackets pulled back to expose their weapons and their hands poised to draw. They followed me out across a parking lot to my car. It looked like something from a western movie.

What a bunch of morons. Where I come from you don't strike a pose like that without a really good reason unless you want to be in a shootout, and if you think you might have reason to use a gun you don't get close enough to the person where they could grab it. No reason I could see for that kind of a backoff, I wasn't doing belligerence or anything that would warrant more than a handshake backoff from a pit boss. What was up with that, has anyone else seen that kind of behavior from Nevada casino security?

 

[creeping panther]

Monkey

Recently I received a backoff where several armed guards approached me and escorted me out with their jackets pulled back to expose their weapons and their hands poised to draw. They followed me out across a parking lot to my car. It looked like something from a western movie.

What a bunch of morons. Where I come from you don't strike a pose like that without a really good reason unless you want to be in a shootout, and if you think you might have reason to use a gun you don't get close enough to the person where they could grab it. No reason I could see for that kind of a backoff, I wasn't doing belligerence or anything that would warrant more than a handshake backoff from a pit boss. What was up with that, has anyone else seen that kind of behavior from Nevada casino security?

Please tell us the whole story, as there must be much more. Even the roughest Native American casinos don't behave in this manner.

CP

 

[standard toaster]

Yeah that was way to much for a simple backoff. Thats a bit extreme. I would not be suprised if your lawyer could manage to do something for you there. Showing off a weapon in a threatening way like that is just to much. Espically when they follow you all the way to your car.

 

[bj bob]

Recently I received a backoff where several armed guards approached me and escorted me out with their jackets pulled back to expose their weapons and their hands poised to draw. They followed me out across a parking lot to my car. It looked like something from a western movie... No reason I could see for that kind of a backoff, I wasn't doing belligerence or anything that would warrant more than a handshake backoff from a pit boss. What was up with that, has anyone else seen that kind of behavior from Nevada casino security?

Doesn't surprise me given the headlines of the past week, with all that happened to your cousin Travis in Stamford. Rumor has it that his old lady fed him Xanax, but my trusty inside sources tell me that she was really 2nd carding him in a BJ game. I'd have gone apesh*t too!
My sincerest condolences to your aunt and the entire Monk family. Requiescat semper in bananas.

 

[Homeschool]

From the Nevada concealed carry law...

NRS 202.320 Drawing deadly weapon in threatening manner.
1. Unless a greater penalty is provided in NRS 202.287, a person having, carrying or procuring from another person any dirk, dirk-knife, sword, sword cane, pistol, gun or other deadly weapon, who, in the presence of two or more persons, draws or exhibits any of such deadly weapons in a rude, angry or threatening manner not in necessary self-defense, or who in any manner unlawfully uses that weapon in any fight or quarrel, is guilty of a misdemeanor.
2. A sheriff, deputy sheriff, marshal, constable or other peace officer shall not be held to answer, under the provisions of subsection 1, for drawing or exhibiting any of the weapons mentioned therein while in the lawful discharge of his duties.


Now the question is, would a "security officer" of a casino be considered a "peace officer". From what I remember from "Beat the Players" a gaming control agent would, but a security officer would not. However I don't have the text with me....

 

[standard toaster]

NRS 202.320 Drawing deadly weapon in threatening manner.
1. Unless a greater penalty is provided in NRS 202.287, a person having, carrying or procuring from another person any dirk, dirk-knife, sword, sword cane, pistol, gun or other deadly weapon, who, in the presence of two or more persons, draws or exhibits any of such deadly weapons in a rude, angry or threatening manner not in necessary self-defense, or who in any manner unlawfully uses that weapon in any fight or quarrel, is guilty of a misdemeanor.
2. A sheriff, deputy sheriff, marshal, constable or other peace officer shall not be held to answer, under the provisions of subsection 1, for drawing or exhibiting any of the weapons mentioned therein while in the lawful discharge of his duties.


Now the question is, would a "security officer" of a casino be considered a "peace officer". From what I remember from "Beat the Players" a gaming control agent would, but a security officer would not. However I don't have the text with me....

No i do not believe a security guard is a peace officer at all

 

[Katweezel]

Chuck

NRS 202.320 Drawing deadly weapon in threatening manner.
1. Unless a greater penalty is provided in NRS 202.287, a person having, carrying or procuring from another person any dirk, dirk-knife, sword, sword cane, pistol, gun or other deadly weapon, who, in the presence of two or more persons, draws or exhibits any of such deadly weapons in a rude, angry or threatening manner not in necessary self-defense, or who in any manner unlawfully uses that weapon in any fight or quarrel, is guilty of a misdemeanor.
2. A sheriff, deputy sheriff, marshal, constable or other peace officer shall not be held to answer, under the provisions of subsection 1, for drawing or exhibiting any of the weapons mentioned therein while in the lawful discharge of his duties.


Now the question is, would a "security officer" of a casino be considered a "peace officer". From what I remember from "Beat the Players" a gaming control agent would, but a security officer would not. However I don't have the text with me....

Maybe one of the lawbreakers who got the AutoMonk was Chuck Norris, moonlighting. :cat:

 

[mjbballar23]

curious

Im also curious to hear the details of this backoff. My guess was that this involved Monkey playing a much stronger game than a regular counting game and the casino did not take to it well.

Also, didnt Monkey mention that he his picture was up in the surveillence rooms of several Nevada casinos about a year ago? Maybe they still remembered him...

 

[EasyRhino]

So... Nevada, then?

I'm trying to picture these guards. First of all, from my unscientific polling, armed guards are fairly rare. Now, if the guards were going for a pseudo-law-envorcement look (and were armed), then their weapon would be a holster, so there's really nothing to expose to anyone. What were these guys wearing? Suits? Did they look like normal security?

Were you acting drunk or suicidal again?

Unless they were off duty cops, then they generally wouldn't qualify as peace officers.

I kind of recommend ratting out the place. Do you have anything to lose?

 

[Automatic Monkey]

Im also curious to hear the details of this backoff. My guess was that this involved Monkey playing a much stronger game than a regular counting game and the casino did not take to it well.

Also, didnt Monkey mention that he his picture was up in the surveillence rooms of several Nevada casinos about a year ago? Maybe they still remembered him...

No this was straight counting, green chip level. Nothing for anyone to sweat, I was even down a little. And I had never played here before.

The store is no stranger to criminal activity and violence.

 

[Homeschool]

Chuck Norris

Maybe one of the lawbreakers who got the AutoMonk was Chuck Norris, moonlighting.

Except if it was Chuck Norris, AM would have been escorted to the door by a roundhouse kick to the face!

 

[Katweezel]

Chuck

Except if it was Chuck Norris, AM would have been escorted to the door by a roundhouse kick to the face!

Chuck Norris doesn't kick people; he shoots em first, then he kicks em! How lucky was the Monk? :cat:

 

[Brock Windsor]

So... Nevada, then?

I'm trying to picture these guards. First of all, from my unscientific polling, armed guards are fairly rare.

I'm interested in more results from your unscientific poll. Which casinos have their regular security pers wear sidearms? Anyone please feel free to make mention.
BW

 

[Billy C1]

When?

I'm with bj Bob on this IF it happened after the "Travis thing". Heightened paranoia, no doubt!

Billy C1

 

[shadroch]

I'm interested in more results from your unscientific poll. Which casinos have their regular security pers wear sidearms? Anyone please feel free to make mention.
BW

Several downtown casinos have armed guards- 4 Queens seems to have only armed guards. El Cortez has two per shift, and Binions has a few. I've seen a few in Laughlin, as well.
While I don't frequent Indian Casinos, I was involved in a dust-up last year at Avi Casino and the security guards were armed and claimed that they were Tribal Police.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

I'm with bj Bob on this IF it happened after the "Travis thing". Heightened paranoia, no doubt!

Billy C1

Yeah, maybe they figured my cards were so bad I was going to have a chimpout! Now if there was a 70-year old woman there dressed like a teen, feeding me pills and picking out china patterns they'd have something to worry about, but I wasn't planning on going ape.

 

[Mimosine]

in a situation like this it doesn't sound like they put their hands on you, if they did does that constitute assault in NV?

 

[callipygian]

in a situation like this it doesn't sound like they put their hands on you, if they did does that constitute assault in NV?

Assault in the United States refers to a threat of force; if actual force is used, it would be battery. Automatic Monkey was likely assaulted without being touched, but was not battered.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

Assault in the United States refers to a threat of force; if actual force is used, it would be battery. Automatic Monkey was likely assaulted without being touched, but was not battered.

It was marginal, and questionable, but being these things are almost always resolved in favor of the casino so there is no doubt about how a charge of assault or menacing would be handled.

In CT we have concealed carry only for anyone who isn't a cop or in certain professions (like armored car driver) and if you are a civilian who is carrying, showing anyone your weapon, or even a gesture like pointing to an outline through your clothes is considered brandishing and you'll get arrested. In an open carry state you usually have to draw before you get into trouble. If they drew I would have sat down on the floor and called the police.

Still in most places where you see a civilian openly carrying a gun he has no bullets in it. The liability is just too high if a gun gets discharged in a casino. Everybody knows these guards have minimal training and could not stop a violent person from grabbing his gun and shooting it around. Security people who truly are trained and prepared to handle guns prefer to carry concealed.

 

[shadroch]

Still in most places where you see a civilian openly carrying a gun he has no bullets in it. The liability is just too high if a gun gets discharged in a casino. Everybody knows these guards have minimal training and could not stop a violent person from grabbing his gun and shooting it around. Security people who truly are trained and prepared to handle guns prefer to carry concealed.

I have to disagree with this. I can't imagine a casino employing anyone to stand around with an empty gun. Nor can I imagine many people would be willing to do it.
In an auction situation, the armed guards are just one layer of security, although the most obvious. almost anyplace that employees armed guards will have a second layer of armed guards in civilian clothes.
Imagine the liability a casino would have if someone they hired to carry a gun was wounded because he wasn't allowed to put bullets in it. Only person I know that would go along with that would be Barney Fife.